Better than Tamoxifen

musclepump · 12-09-2004, 11:36 AM

This talks about Arimixdex being better than Tamoxifen. One paragraph that really gets my attention is:

"Arimidex, known generically as anastrozole, is one of three newer drugs called aromatase inhibitors, which prevent estrogen from being made in the first place instead of just keeping it from entering cells."

http://www.freep.com/news/nw/cancer9e_20041209.htm

Thoughts on what this could mean for the bodybuilding community?

**Dale Mabry** · 12-09-2004, 11:43 AM

Prolly nothing, some estrogen is good.

A good example is DHT and hairloss. You have DHT inhibitors and DHT Blockers. Inhibitors will prevent DHT from being made which is good for your hair, but it is bad in that other things use DHT, such as your wang. Now, a blocker, such as nolvadex with estrogen, would block the binding at the site, allowing the hormone to exert it's effects elsewhere. This is why people take spiro over propecia, it is not systemic so it will have fewer sides.

Nolvadex is different in that it is tissue specific and not topical, but you get the idea.

Tha Don · 12-09-2004, 12:03 PM

someone recommended this for me on my test/dbol cycle, i haven't done any research on it yet so i wouldn't want to recommend it myself, be interesting to see what the others say

**dg806** · 12-09-2004, 12:48 PM

It's not new. Not good for post cycle. It's basically used on cycle to combat estrogen.

gopro · 12-09-2004, 03:31 PM

Different compounds...different actions...different uses.

redspy · 12-09-2004, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by young d

someone recommended this for me on my test/dbol cycle, i haven't done any research on it yet so i wouldn't want to recommend it myself, be interesting to see what the others say

You could also use Femara, which is a very effective AI.

Tha Don · 12-09-2004, 04:41 PM

apparently you can't use arimidex and nolva together, but i've heard you can use something called letrozole and nolva, got a friend who recommends letro on cycle then adding in nolva if gyno symptoms start occuring, anyone else used letrozole and recommend it?

redspy · 12-09-2004, 04:51 PM

Letrozole and femara are the same thing. I've used it to reduce bloat and it's very effective. Use a low dose though, otherwise it can dry out your joints and reduce libido.

Tha Don · 12-09-2004, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redspy

Letrozole and femara are the same thing. I've used it to reduce bloat and it's very effective. Use a low dose though, otherwise it can dry out your joints and reduce libido.

how much is a low dose? you take it on cycle i assume for how long? do you just use it for gear or with certain PH's too? where can I find it, chemist or is it illegal?

gococksDJS · 12-09-2004, 05:58 PM

im going to run 1/2 mg EOD with a test/dbol cycle

Flex · 12-09-2004, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dg806

It's not new. Not good for post cycle. It's basically used on cycle to combat estrogen.

yup, what he said^

it's an aromatase inhibitor as opposed to an anti-estrogen.

godjs is using the correct mg of rimi for a cycle of test dbol.

**Pirate!** · 12-09-2004, 06:55 PM

I'm going to do .25 mg ed of femera (letro) and 20 mg nolva with test/d-bol. 10 mg/nolva with 12.5mg d-bol twice daily. I'll probably drop the nolva down to 10 mg/day after the d-bol phase. I'll let you know how its working in about a week. I'm using tamoxifen pills--makes twice daily dosage not so bad.

gococksDJS · 12-09-2004, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PirateFromHell

I'm going to do .25 mg ed of femera (letro) and 20 mg nolva with test/d-bol. 10 mg/nolva with 12.5mg d-bol twice daily. I'll probably drop the nolva down to 10 mg/day after the d-bol phase. I'll let you know how its working in about a week. I'm using tamoxifen pills--makes twice daily dosage not so bad.

I assume your running a 10-12 week cycle, are you planning on running the nolva throughout? Why not run the nolva until the femera has time to get into your system? Just wondering because dbol is already hard on the liver and nolva can possibly be as well. Also are you going to run any HCG?

Tha Don · 12-09-2004, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PirateFromHell

I'm going to do .25 mg ed of femera (letro) and 20 mg nolva with test/d-bol. 10 mg/nolva with 12.5mg d-bol twice daily. I'll probably drop the nolva down to 10 mg/day after the d-bol phase. I'll let you know how its working in about a week. I'm using tamoxifen pills--makes twice daily dosage not so bad.

do you really need both the letro and the nolva on cycle? i was just gonna run the letro then get on the nolva if i see any gyno, wouldn't the nolva just be a waste of money if your estrogen is under control? (and the point golcocs mentioned about the liver being put under extra stress)

peace

**Pirate!** · 12-09-2004, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gococksDJS

I assume your running a 10-12 week cycle, are you planning on running the nolva throughout? Why not run the nolva until the femera has time to get into your system? Just wondering because dbol is already hard on the liver and nolva can possibly be as well. Also are you going to run any HCG?

12 weeks, nolva throughout, femera doesn't take much time to get into your system as far as I understand it, not worried about nolva stessing the liver. HCG is a must.

redspy · 12-09-2004, 09:54 PM

I believe that taking AIs and SERMs simultaneously will reduce the effectiveness of the AI by around 20%. Personally I'd only take Nolva on cycle to control gyno issues. Each to their own

**Pirate!** · 12-09-2004, 09:56 PM

I can always adjust if necessary. I just want to take some nolva with the d-bol.

redspy · 12-09-2004, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by young d

how much is a low dose? you take it on cycle i assume for how long? do you just use it for gear or with certain PH's too? where can I find it, chemist or is it illegal?

Pirate's suggestion of 25 mg ed sounds good to me. You can buy AIs as research chems. Failing that you could buy from an online pharmacy. If you need more info PM me.

musclepump · 12-09-2004, 10:16 PM

I'll look for AI's later... looking for pill form Tamoxifen now... my mice can't stand the taste of this research chemical!

Tha Don · 12-10-2004, 07:40 PM

what about Proviron? that any good?

my main worry is gonna be gyno, just read about a buddy of mine who got it and i really don't want that shit happening to me, he was running nolva and something else during cycle and it still got him before the end of 8 weeks! might cut my 1st cycle down to an 8 weeker

i've decided on nolva pct, just not sure what to prevent gyno + bloat whilst on... letro+nolva or proviron+nolva by the looks of things

sound alright?

redspy · 12-10-2004, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by young d

what about Proviron? that any good?

my main worry is gonna be gyno, just read about a buddy of mine who got it and i really don't want that shit happening to me, he was running nolva and something else during cycle and it still got him before the end of 8 weeks! might cut my 1st cycle down to an 8 weeker

i've decided on nolva pct, just not sure what to prevent gyno + bloat whilst on... letro+nolva or proviron+nolva by the looks of things

sound alright?

I'd recommend letro while on cycle to reduce bloat, but have Nolva ready in case you get gyno symptoms. For PCT use Nolva.

12-09-2004, 11:36 AM	#1
musclepump Celebrity PersonalTrainer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,669 Photos: 128	Better than Tamoxifen This talks about Arimixdex being better than Tamoxifen. One paragraph that really gets my attention is: "Arimidex, known generically as anastrozole, is one of three newer drugs called aromatase inhibitors, which prevent estrogen from being made in the first place instead of just keeping it from entering cells." http://www.freep.com/news/nw/cancer9e_20041209.htm Thoughts on what this could mean for the bodybuilding community? Let's all join together and SPEAK ENGLISH IN AMERICA.

12-09-2004, 11:43 AM	#2
Dale Mabry Moderator Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Elsewhere Posts: 14,335 Photos: 10	Prolly nothing, some estrogen is good. A good example is DHT and hairloss. You have DHT inhibitors and DHT Blockers. Inhibitors will prevent DHT from being made which is good for your hair, but it is bad in that other things use DHT, such as your wang. Now, a blocker, such as nolvadex with estrogen, would block the binding at the site, allowing the hormone to exert it's effects elsewhere. This is why people take spiro over propecia, it is not systemic so it will have fewer sides. Nolvadex is different in that it is tissue specific and not topical, but you get the idea. If sense were common, everyone would have it. 4/2007-Current 75th Ranked most popular image 1 spot behind Prince's bulge...

12-09-2004, 12:48 PM	#4
dg806 Guardian of The Homeland Super Moderator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Charlotte NC Posts: 18,197	It's not new. Not good for post cycle. It's basically used on cycle to combat estrogen. 1-Andro Rx Pro-hormone

12-09-2004, 03:31 PM	#5
gopro NGA/IFPA Pro Bodybuilder Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: GLOBAL! Posts: 10,893	Different compounds...different actions...different uses. All American EFX Sponsored Pro Bodybuilder/Internet Marketing Manager P/RR/S DVD and E-Book now available! P/RR/S DVD http://www.home-gym.com/erbrporepras.html P/RR/S E-BOOK html www.X-traordinaryWorkouts.com Monthly columnist for Muscular Development and Ironman magazines. www.prrstraining.com Time to GROW Without Plateau! Personal Training Gopro is available for online personal training, dietary guidance, and contest prep coaching. Send me a PM or e-mail if interested. Thank you.

12-09-2004, 10:16 PM	#19
musclepump Celebrity PersonalTrainer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,669 Photos: 128	I'll look for AI's later... looking for pill form Tamoxifen now... my mice can't stand the taste of this research chemical! Let's all join together and SPEAK ENGLISH IN AMERICA.

12-09-2004, 12:03 PM	#3
Tha Don Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Nottingham, England Posts: 3,826 Photos: 33	someone recommended this for me on my test/dbol cycle, i haven't done any research on it yet so i wouldn't want to recommend it myself, be interesting to see what the others say

12-09-2004, 04:41 PM	#7
Tha Don Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Nottingham, England Posts: 3,826 Photos: 33	apparently you can't use arimidex and nolva together, but i've heard you can use something called letrozole and nolva, got a friend who recommends letro on cycle then adding in nolva if gyno symptoms start occuring, anyone else used letrozole and recommend it?

12-09-2004, 04:51 PM	#8
redspy Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,040	Letrozole and femara are the same thing. I've used it to reduce bloat and it's very effective. Use a low dose though, otherwise it can dry out your joints and reduce libido.

12-09-2004, 05:58 PM	#10
gococksDJS RIP Foreman Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 6,000	im going to run 1/2 mg EOD with a test/dbol cycle

12-09-2004, 06:55 PM	#12
Pirate! Gatekepper Moderator Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 6,173	I'm going to do .25 mg ed of femera (letro) and 20 mg nolva with test/d-bol. 10 mg/nolva with 12.5mg d-bol twice daily. I'll probably drop the nolva down to 10 mg/day after the d-bol phase. I'll let you know how its working in about a week. I'm using tamoxifen pills--makes twice daily dosage not so bad.

12-09-2004, 09:54 PM	#16
redspy Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,040	I believe that taking AIs and SERMs simultaneously will reduce the effectiveness of the AI by around 20%. Personally I'd only take Nolva on cycle to control gyno issues. Each to their own

12-09-2004, 09:56 PM	#17
Pirate! Gatekepper Moderator Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 6,173	I can always adjust if necessary. I just want to take some nolva with the d-bol.

12-10-2004, 07:40 PM	#20
Tha Don Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Nottingham, England Posts: 3,826 Photos: 33	what about Proviron? that any good? my main worry is gonna be gyno, just read about a buddy of mine who got it and i really don't want that shit happening to me, he was running nolva and something else during cycle and it still got him before the end of 8 weeks! might cut my 1st cycle down to an 8 weeker i've decided on nolva pct, just not sure what to prevent gyno + bloat whilst on... letro+nolva or proviron+nolva by the looks of things sound alright?

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