Law generates rush on soon-to-be-banned drugs

brodus · 12-30-2004, 08:25 PM

Anyone who thinks it's cool that a company is selling M1T @ 50mg., and takes the "buyer beware" stance, is an idiot in my book. Why the fuck do people like you protect enterprise and capitalism more than you protect social well-being...don't answer, that was rhetorical, and I already know every possible argument you have, as I've already read the books you probably still work out of. It's just an expression of exasperation. There is something fundamentally wrong with you if you think it's okay for a company to sell 50mg. caps of M1T.

QuestionGuy · 12-30-2004, 08:39 PM

LawDUDE is an Idiot alright. God there is so much I want to say but I am not going to becasue it's going to be long and to emotional and complicated.....So whatever, keep your asses safe out there boy's, and make sure you steal money from drug dealers !!! aiight ??

law74 · 12-30-2004, 09:15 PM

Well spell the fucking word right next time you fucking tard. I am right there is no such fucking word as epsitemic. Your problem, not mine. And I guessed correctly at what word you were attempting to spell after rumaging feverishly through your Roget's Thesaurus For Cops. You poor boy. I know you are smart, even if you are a cop. You don't have to prove anything to me. Don't be so insecure. Keep that gun on your side, it will distract the girls from noticing the conspicuous lack of bulge in your pants. They will never know you have a small penis. That is why you became a cop. Otherwise, if you really wanted to do something useful you would have been a firefighter. These guys truly are community servants. You are an insecure little boy who can only hurl insults. Why do you feel so threatened. I never insulted you. Yet you attack me. Why? Was your mommy neglectful? Did your daddy touch you in places? Give me a break. I know you will break my head. you are a cop right?
Sorry but living in a building with a doorman does not qualify you as "living in these communities." The communities I am talking about don't have doors sometimes, much less doormen. You punk ass bitch. I lived in the heart of Bushwick doing student teaching work. I put my neck on the line for nothing other than to help people. I didn't get a police car, I didn't get a gun. I didn't get to hang out in clubs and collect overtime pay like you, you fucking nimrod. If you want to help and you truly are as altruistic as you are claiming go down to the South Side of Chicago and volunteer to be a mentor for a kid. Help work in a soup kitchen. You get alot of nice benefits for being a cop. do something where the only benefit is the way you helped out. no money, no nothing. Then you can talk to me. Otherwise eat a doughnut you fucking pig!!! You wanted insults, you wanted name calling, well now I am finally wallowing in the mud with you pigs. Fuck You, Fuck this board. Too many fucking cops. Probably just trying to find out who is stocking up on PH/PS so they can bust people after the ban. No, half the cops I know do steroids and brag about it. You all are the fucking worst. Remember there are special places in hell reserved for hypocrites.
And you are the one protecting capitalism by supporting the continued construction of prisons to house nonviolent offenders. You have completely failed to address any substantive argument I have made. you lose.

Curlingcadys · 12-30-2004, 09:21 PM

QG, I don't think I've seen someone get burned sooooo bad....ouch! put some ointment on that!

topolo · 12-30-2004, 09:24 PM

I agree with Brodus

law74 · 12-30-2004, 09:42 PM

Watch out who you agree with. I saw in buy and trade that you said you stocked up on M1t and would probalby do a cycle or two next year. Well these jokers have no problem with putting you in jail for that. And if they don't I am very curious as to why not. Any answers.

brodus · 12-30-2004, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Otherwise eat a doughnut you fucking pig!!!

Nice, dude. I liked your little attempt at making a creative jab; that Roget's thing was cute, I think I read someone write something similar in 9th grade English. Not that it matters, since I don't own a Thesaurus, Now if you could extend that spark of creative brilliance to think beyond your pedantic us-versus-them-ism, maybe you wouldn't be so angry, and you'd have time to realize that a lot of words can be used creatively as adjectives.

And the way you glossed over the fact that your Taxi/Cop analogy was total bullshit was classic lawyer-ese. Tell me, in a court of law, when someone makes accusations and cannot find sources to back up what they say, while the other party does provide sources, what happens?

BTW, I'm not a cop, I live in a rent-controlled building in Humboldt Park which has the highest homicide rate in town, I volunteer regularly throughout Chicago. Maybe I mis-spelled Epistemic b/c I heard a siren outside of my window and looked up for a second.

You obviously hate cops. That's too bad. You obviously have a naieve perception of how things actually work in the world. That the very machinations of big city policing, which you mock, are what allow us to maintain our illusion of relative safety among truly nasty people.

Well, I hate lawyers. I have more education in the core proficiencies than most lawyers, and I don't like the fact that they get paid to let guilty people dodge bullets of justice. I especially hate when they step out of their sphere of knowledge, which really is the letter of the law, chain of precendence, and the "personality" of various districts, and then lecture people on things they read about or wish were true.

The advice you've given, namely play hardball with the cops when you're knowinlgy breaking the law, has gotten me and a lot of my firends in a ton more trouble than we needed to get in. We were young and impressionable and believed the bullshit you spew, and it got us fucked, legally. This is why I'm not getting off your ass. All of your arguments are built around a pseudo-anti-establishment platform, when in reality, it's all about getting your QP of B.C. Bud to your friends house, and if a cop bugs you, FUCK THEM...talk about displaced anger.

Quote:

And you are the one protecting capitalism by supporting the continued construction of prisons to house nonviolent offenders.

I know your mad about your friend doing time for selling pot. Maybe if he earned income the way the rest of society does, people would care more. But they don't, and that's the root of your anger...but please, don't take it out on the guys that bust burglars in my backyard, and catch the Wicker Park rapist.

Sleep tight, angry man.

brodus · 12-30-2004, 09:51 PM

I have all the illegal PHs I want. I stocked up probably more than anyone here. I will not be driving with them so this case is moot. If I did drive with them and was busted, that's my fault for being a dumbass. We lost the PH battle. The answer isn't to break the law and then say "it's my right." I've tried that one before a judge...trust me, it doesn't work.

The answer is to be part of the democratic process, which is slow, plodding, and fair to all. Of course, people in support of PH didn't do this. It was part of my original threads--my anger at the lack of a solid front on the part of PH users and manufacturers. Without that, I know nothing could have happened. The greedy bastards got what they wanted--your money--and didn't do anything to secure the market once they realized the snowball was rolling downhill against them. Not to mention MLB sucks a big fat dick for not being proactively involved, and forcing Congress to have hearings, when there were much more important things like wars going on. Of course, I watched everything live on C-Span, and reported it here, but most people are content making sweeping assessments of McCain and everyone else, when in fact, no one I've spoken with actually watched all the debates and hearings save myself, and perhaps DiMaggio at USFA.biz.

You win some, you lose some...but smart drug users of any kind who truly understand the game and who aren't trying to profit from the underground market rarely get busted. Like I said before, ride a bike if you must transport. Searching a house is infinitely more difficult than a car.

law74 · 12-30-2004, 10:00 PM

I don't do drugs, never have, never will. Believe they should be legal on principle, not out of self-interest. Don't dislike cops. Read my post. Like many cops. Cops do keep us safe from the bad people. however, I don't agree with the government creating a class of bad people legislatively. I believe law should only restrict activities that directly, not indirectly harm others. That is all. I am not angry. I am very peaceful. Aikido, way of the peaceful warrior. I don't get paid shit. I don't get guilty people off. I protect you, the same way a cop does. If it wasn't for lawyers you would not have any of the rights you do have. If most cops and government agents had their way yes we would all be very safe. We would also be living in a fascist dictator state. i like all the messy freedom that we have. Always when it comes to drug arguments any one on the prohibition side can not win. Look at alcohol prohibition. It did not, can not, and will never work. So why are drug addicts criminals while cigarettes and beer is still legal. Should people who do PH/Ps be in prison. I seriously don't believe so. If you do i am really curious how you can justify it. Sorry but social acceptability is not enough justification for putting someone in prison. Cops don't make these shitty laws they just enforce them. I know this. Cops, lawyers both necessary. Both scumbags in the eyes of the world.

Twigz · 12-30-2004, 10:11 PM

Brodus, you are great. I wish we had more people out there like you, and less people like law.
I personally help take on crooked cop off the streets because he was stepping over the line of right and wrong. I could have just stood by and watched the shit go through court, as no one would have ever known, but I decided to bring up the discrepancies that i witnessed, so as not to have innocent people spending time in jail.

I have also sat on the porch with some kids, husbands, wifes, etc. that did some things that I sure as hell could have locked them up for, but I didn't I had the time to sit and mediate, even though that is not part of my job. Like I said before, I signed up for this job to help my community not to toss people behind bars. Many times my fellow officers look at me like I am nuts, or even tell me that I should have just booked them, but it all comes down to attitude. I'm not here to prove what a stud I am, or beat on people.

I do find it interesting that you bring in the arguments that "Did daddy touch you in places?" or "was your mommy neglecful?" because these I have seen used by defence lawyers before.

Oh and I do believe that Brodus was argueing points that you brought up and he squashed with FACTS.

So you go right ahead and call me crooked, and power hungry cop, but I treat people as I wish to be treated, defence attorney, crook, citizen. I don't care who you are, if you have not messed with me than I have no problems with you, just doing my job, nothing personal. I did know what i was getting into when I signed for this job, and i don't want your pity, I gladly take those chances everyday so that no one else has to. The thing that irritates me is the simple fact that people like you hate me just because I wear a badge.

law74 · 12-30-2004, 11:50 PM

Who hates you. I love you. Seriously. Brodus you are a decent fellow as well. but how you can advocate breaking the law and then claim to be for law enforcement is beyond me. I advocate everyone obey the law, whether you agree with it or not. I do agree with your rants about the PH scare and the democratic process though. But you do realize that you have just given law enforcement the ability to subpoena the internet records from this diatribe, find out who you are, and conduct very invasive searches of your house and person. Will they, who knows, maybe, maybe not. Once again, I DO NOT HATE COPS!!! I don't even know why i have to state this. Why is it that if you criticize a particular practice you hate all the people. Shit I criticize the criminal defense bar all the time. I sure as hell don't hate criminal defense lawyers. I am just not comfortable with consensual activities ever being made crimes. that is what both of you have failed entirely to understand. My problem is not with cops. Brodus I am very sorry that you got fucked over by the legal system. But I will never consent to a search just because they will do it anyway. That is like telling a girl to lay back and just enjoy being raped. What you are saying is the least morally defensible position possible. Twigz, do you realize this. Brodus is saying then that because cops do these things anyway, legal or not, you just have to be a better criminal. Would not the better alternative be that (1) This activity not be criminal in the first place; (2) Don't engage in criminal activity yourself. I hate murderers, rapist, and yes anyone who drives under th einfluence of any narcotic or alcohol. These things hurt other people. I am just fundamentally uncomfortable with the government classifying consensual activity as being criminal, then giving law enforcement expanded powers to enforce laws that should not exist in the first place. I fully understand how the world works gentleman. I fully understand the need for police officers. I fail to understand how I am safer because a heroin addict is in jail instead of treatment. In case you say that this is not so, look at the mandatory sentencing under NY's recently reformed drug laws. Yeah they have been reformed, but that does not give these people there lives back. Sorry, to me the injustice of a person being in prison for having a drug addiction is much greater than that person being out and stealing my stereo. These people need help, sometimes many opportunities. Shit, it took me several tries to quit smoking and that was hard. But putting people in jail. Brodus, I am suprised at you. You should no better than to argue the way you are. Taking the position of just being a better, more cautious criminal is just utterly indefensible and morally bankrupt. I don't agree with you on anything, but even I know you are too smart to honestly take that position. So it is Ok to break laws, just don't get caught. It is OK to send people to jail for the very same behavior that I am engaging in. I only care if I get caught. I love cops as long as they don't enforce the laws against me. I think you agree with me more than you are willing to admit. Remember, I don't hate cops. move away from cops. I don't like laws that take away freedoms. It is invasive for a cop to search me and my car. Why, have done nothing wrong. I am not doing this to protect drug dealers. I do this to protect the person who has done nothing wrong but is subjected to intrusive governmental laws that undercut what I believe to be basic human freedoms, and intrude upon the dignity of every free person. I don't have anything to hide from the government. That is why they have no business searching me. Too often they do. I got pulled over for having a small crack in my windshield and the police officer wanted to know if he could search me car. I said no. He listened. No problem. Brodus, there is nothing wrong with asserting your rights, sorry it did not work out for you. I would still defend you if you get busted. Even better is I would do it for free.

**Pirate!** · 12-31-2004, 12:27 AM

I will say that you all have very valid points. The Us vs. Them mentality only divides us all. I'm glad we have defense attorneys and police officers. The breakdown is in the system and our diminishing liberties. This has been the way off all societies that have come and gone, and it isn't going to change. I don't think this is an issue of who is the biggest intellectual or who has the most sound philosophy. We all have different values and beliefs concerning what is best for our country. My father--and best friend--is a socialist and I am completely opposite. You could even call me somewhat of a Libertarian. Despite ideological differences, we love each other. We would all do better to serve the people in the world who need our help, than to spew anger and disgust at those who have different opinions and values. People are diverse. It takes effort toward unity to keep us together and functioning as a healthy society. Just my opinion.

brodus · 12-31-2004, 01:29 AM

Good Post!

brodus · 12-31-2004, 01:39 AM

Law, I can drop the personal jabs, no sweat. Just understand I have a lot of respect for the officers in my neighborhood, and I have had bad experiences with defense attorneys in the past. I am very leery of any us vs. them logic, and I'm growing more and more angry at the gulf between practicality/utilitarianism and college-based theory.

I'm not saying I think the police should be able to trample our rights at will.

law74 · 12-31-2004, 09:37 AM

Brodus, I can drop it as well. I have respect for many officers as well. I don't think we are as far apart as you might think. I just don't want anymore liberties being taken away from a government that seeks to protect us from ourselves. I believe you agree with this. You are responsible and rational. You have determined for yourself, that you can manage prohormones safely even after the ban. I just don't believe that you should be a criminal. You are a smart guy. Why should you go to jail b/c you want to have some more muscle on your body. I don't believe the answer is to just be smarter about engaging in crime. You should not have been labeled a criminal at all. AS I said cops have the unfortunate role of having to enforce some of these ridiculuous laws. They have an impossible job. This is simply a war that they can not win. In order for them to do their job of enforcing drug laws, civil liberties must be undercut because of the nature of drugs (easy to hide, easily disposable.) I just don't feel that drugs are a big enough menance to sacrifice my liberties for. I actually know a number of police officers who agree with me. They agree with me that this problem could be better managed as a public health issue instead of as a law enforcement issue. Cops should not be in the business of enforcing morality. It would be like them arresting me for eating McDonalds (sure I know it is bad for me, but it is my body). I do want cops to protect us from murderers and other violent criminals. I just want to make their job easier by lessening their burden.
Sorry if I come off confrontational. This is something I do get worked up over. I just hate seeing our rights gradually whitering away as the government seeks to protect us from the threat of the month. There are always going to be threats, there will always be violence, there will always be crime. I just don't want us rushing off in a moment of panic sacrificing the remaining liberities we do have. Our liberities are almost unique in this world and I am just so tired of seeing them being handed over willfully to protect ourselves from some overstated threat.
Brodus, it has been interesting sparring with you. Have a wonderful day. Pirate, you finally brought some sanity to this discussion. Stay safe, stay out of trouble. If the cops ever do come looking for you just PM me. HAhahahahahaha. Take care guys.

BigDyl · 12-31-2004, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by law74

Brodus, I can drop it as well. I have respect for many officers as well. I don't think we are as far apart as you might think. I just don't want anymore liberties being taken away from a government that seeks to protect us from ourselves. I believe you agree with this. You are responsible and rational. You have determined for yourself, that you can manage prohormones safely even after the ban. I just don't believe that you should be a criminal. You are a smart guy. Why should you go to jail b/c you want to have some more muscle on your body. I don't believe the answer is to just be smarter about engaging in crime. You should not have been labeled a criminal at all. AS I said cops have the unfortunate role of having to enforce some of these ridiculuous laws. They have an impossible job. This is simply a war that they can not win. In order for them to do their job of enforcing drug laws, civil liberties must be undercut because of the nature of drugs (easy to hide, easily disposable.) I just don't feel that drugs are a big enough menance to sacrifice my liberties for. I actually know a number of police officers who agree with me. They agree with me that this problem could be better managed as a public health issue instead of as a law enforcement issue. Cops should not be in the business of enforcing morality. It would be like them arresting me for eating McDonalds (sure I know it is bad for me, but it is my body). I do want cops to protect us from murderers and other violent criminals. I just want to make their job easier by lessening their burden.
Sorry if I come off confrontational. This is something I do get worked up over. I just hate seeing our rights gradually whitering away as the government seeks to protect us from the threat of the month. There are always going to be threats, there will always be violence, there will always be crime. I just don't want us rushing off in a moment of panic sacrificing the remaining liberities we do have. Our liberities are almost unique in this world and I am just so tired of seeing them being handed over willfully to protect ourselves from some overstated threat.
Brodus, it has been interesting sparring with you. Have a wonderful day. Pirate, you finally brought some sanity to this discussion. Stay safe, stay out of trouble. If the cops ever do come looking for you just PM me. HAhahahahahaha. Take care guys.

**Pirate!** · 12-31-2004, 02:09 PM

Group Hug?

iMan323 · 12-31-2004, 06:42 PM

Yeah, group hug. I have an idea

.....pass that shit over here...*puff puff*

BigDyl · 12-31-2004, 07:06 PM

Group hug.

Twigz · 12-31-2004, 07:45 PM

I'll go with the group hug. Law in actuality I think we do agree, we just have different ways of stating it. Like I said at first, personally I don't care what you do to yourself. It just had better not cause problems for others.

law74 · 12-31-2004, 07:51 PM

Happy New Year to All.

12-30-2004, 08:25 PM	#91
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	Anyone who thinks it's cool that a company is selling M1T @ 50mg., and takes the "buyer beware" stance, is an idiot in my book. Why the fuck do people like you protect enterprise and capitalism more than you protect social well-being...don't answer, that was rhetorical, and I already know every possible argument you have, as I've already read the books you probably still work out of. It's just an expression of exasperation. There is something fundamentally wrong with you if you think it's okay for a company to sell 50mg. caps of M1T. Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

12-30-2004, 09:51 PM	#98
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	I have all the illegal PHs I want. I stocked up probably more than anyone here. I will not be driving with them so this case is moot. If I did drive with them and was busted, that's my fault for being a dumbass. We lost the PH battle. The answer isn't to break the law and then say "it's my right." I've tried that one before a judge...trust me, it doesn't work. The answer is to be part of the democratic process, which is slow, plodding, and fair to all. Of course, people in support of PH didn't do this. It was part of my original threads--my anger at the lack of a solid front on the part of PH users and manufacturers. Without that, I know nothing could have happened. The greedy bastards got what they wanted--your money--and didn't do anything to secure the market once they realized the snowball was rolling downhill against them. Not to mention MLB sucks a big fat dick for not being proactively involved, and forcing Congress to have hearings, when there were much more important things like wars going on. Of course, I watched everything live on C-Span, and reported it here, but most people are content making sweeping assessments of McCain and everyone else, when in fact, no one I've spoken with actually watched all the debates and hearings save myself, and perhaps DiMaggio at USFA.biz. You win some, you lose some...but smart drug users of any kind who truly understand the game and who aren't trying to profit from the underground market rarely get busted. Like I said before, ride a bike if you must transport. Searching a house is infinitely more difficult than a car. Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

12-30-2004, 10:11 PM	#100
Twigz Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 419 Photos: 4	Brodus, you are great. I wish we had more people out there like you, and less people like law. I personally help take on crooked cop off the streets because he was stepping over the line of right and wrong. I could have just stood by and watched the shit go through court, as no one would have ever known, but I decided to bring up the discrepancies that i witnessed, so as not to have innocent people spending time in jail. I have also sat on the porch with some kids, husbands, wifes, etc. that did some things that I sure as hell could have locked them up for, but I didn't I had the time to sit and mediate, even though that is not part of my job. Like I said before, I signed up for this job to help my community not to toss people behind bars. Many times my fellow officers look at me like I am nuts, or even tell me that I should have just booked them, but it all comes down to attitude. I'm not here to prove what a stud I am, or beat on people. I do find it interesting that you bring in the arguments that "Did daddy touch you in places?" or "was your mommy neglecful?" because these I have seen used by defence lawyers before. Oh and I do believe that Brodus was argueing points that you brought up and he squashed with FACTS. So you go right ahead and call me crooked, and power hungry cop, but I treat people as I wish to be treated, defence attorney, crook, citizen. I don't care who you are, if you have not messed with me than I have no problems with you, just doing my job, nothing personal. I did know what i was getting into when I signed for this job, and i don't want your pity, I gladly take those chances everyday so that no one else has to. The thing that irritates me is the simple fact that people like you hate me just because I wear a badge. ILLEGITIMIS CON CARBORUNDUM!! (don't let the bastards grind you down) I love vegetarians, they're a great source of lean protien!

12-31-2004, 01:29 AM	#103
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	Good Post! Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

12-31-2004, 01:39 AM	#104
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	Law, I can drop the personal jabs, no sweat. Just understand I have a lot of respect for the officers in my neighborhood, and I have had bad experiences with defense attorneys in the past. I am very leery of any us vs. them logic, and I'm growing more and more angry at the gulf between practicality/utilitarianism and college-based theory. I'm not saying I think the police should be able to trample our rights at will. Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

12-30-2004, 08:39 PM	#92
QuestionGuy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 2,741	LawDUDE is an Idiot alright. God there is so much I want to say but I am not going to becasue it's going to be long and to emotional and complicated.....So whatever, keep your asses safe out there boy's, and make sure you steal money from drug dealers !!! aiight ??

12-30-2004, 09:15 PM	#93
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	Well spell the fucking word right next time you fucking tard. I am right there is no such fucking word as epsitemic. Your problem, not mine. And I guessed correctly at what word you were attempting to spell after rumaging feverishly through your Roget's Thesaurus For Cops. You poor boy. I know you are smart, even if you are a cop. You don't have to prove anything to me. Don't be so insecure. Keep that gun on your side, it will distract the girls from noticing the conspicuous lack of bulge in your pants. They will never know you have a small penis. That is why you became a cop. Otherwise, if you really wanted to do something useful you would have been a firefighter. These guys truly are community servants. You are an insecure little boy who can only hurl insults. Why do you feel so threatened. I never insulted you. Yet you attack me. Why? Was your mommy neglectful? Did your daddy touch you in places? Give me a break. I know you will break my head. you are a cop right? Sorry but living in a building with a doorman does not qualify you as "living in these communities." The communities I am talking about don't have doors sometimes, much less doormen. You punk ass bitch. I lived in the heart of Bushwick doing student teaching work. I put my neck on the line for nothing other than to help people. I didn't get a police car, I didn't get a gun. I didn't get to hang out in clubs and collect overtime pay like you, you fucking nimrod. If you want to help and you truly are as altruistic as you are claiming go down to the South Side of Chicago and volunteer to be a mentor for a kid. Help work in a soup kitchen. You get alot of nice benefits for being a cop. do something where the only benefit is the way you helped out. no money, no nothing. Then you can talk to me. Otherwise eat a doughnut you fucking pig!!! You wanted insults, you wanted name calling, well now I am finally wallowing in the mud with you pigs. Fuck You, Fuck this board. Too many fucking cops. Probably just trying to find out who is stocking up on PH/PS so they can bust people after the ban. No, half the cops I know do steroids and brag about it. You all are the fucking worst. Remember there are special places in hell reserved for hypocrites. And you are the one protecting capitalism by supporting the continued construction of prisons to house nonviolent offenders. You have completely failed to address any substantive argument I have made. you lose.

12-30-2004, 09:21 PM	#94
Curlingcadys Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: WI Posts: 631	QG, I don't think I've seen someone get burned sooooo bad....ouch! put some ointment on that!

12-30-2004, 09:42 PM	#96
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	Watch out who you agree with. I saw in buy and trade that you said you stocked up on M1t and would probalby do a cycle or two next year. Well these jokers have no problem with putting you in jail for that. And if they don't I am very curious as to why not. Any answers.

12-30-2004, 10:00 PM	#99
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	I don't do drugs, never have, never will. Believe they should be legal on principle, not out of self-interest. Don't dislike cops. Read my post. Like many cops. Cops do keep us safe from the bad people. however, I don't agree with the government creating a class of bad people legislatively. I believe law should only restrict activities that directly, not indirectly harm others. That is all. I am not angry. I am very peaceful. Aikido, way of the peaceful warrior. I don't get paid shit. I don't get guilty people off. I protect you, the same way a cop does. If it wasn't for lawyers you would not have any of the rights you do have. If most cops and government agents had their way yes we would all be very safe. We would also be living in a fascist dictator state. i like all the messy freedom that we have. Always when it comes to drug arguments any one on the prohibition side can not win. Look at alcohol prohibition. It did not, can not, and will never work. So why are drug addicts criminals while cigarettes and beer is still legal. Should people who do PH/Ps be in prison. I seriously don't believe so. If you do i am really curious how you can justify it. Sorry but social acceptability is not enough justification for putting someone in prison. Cops don't make these shitty laws they just enforce them. I know this. Cops, lawyers both necessary. Both scumbags in the eyes of the world.

12-30-2004, 11:50 PM	#101
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	Who hates you. I love you. Seriously. Brodus you are a decent fellow as well. but how you can advocate breaking the law and then claim to be for law enforcement is beyond me. I advocate everyone obey the law, whether you agree with it or not. I do agree with your rants about the PH scare and the democratic process though. But you do realize that you have just given law enforcement the ability to subpoena the internet records from this diatribe, find out who you are, and conduct very invasive searches of your house and person. Will they, who knows, maybe, maybe not. Once again, I DO NOT HATE COPS!!! I don't even know why i have to state this. Why is it that if you criticize a particular practice you hate all the people. Shit I criticize the criminal defense bar all the time. I sure as hell don't hate criminal defense lawyers. I am just not comfortable with consensual activities ever being made crimes. that is what both of you have failed entirely to understand. My problem is not with cops. Brodus I am very sorry that you got fucked over by the legal system. But I will never consent to a search just because they will do it anyway. That is like telling a girl to lay back and just enjoy being raped. What you are saying is the least morally defensible position possible. Twigz, do you realize this. Brodus is saying then that because cops do these things anyway, legal or not, you just have to be a better criminal. Would not the better alternative be that (1) This activity not be criminal in the first place; (2) Don't engage in criminal activity yourself. I hate murderers, rapist, and yes anyone who drives under th einfluence of any narcotic or alcohol. These things hurt other people. I am just fundamentally uncomfortable with the government classifying consensual activity as being criminal, then giving law enforcement expanded powers to enforce laws that should not exist in the first place. I fully understand how the world works gentleman. I fully understand the need for police officers. I fail to understand how I am safer because a heroin addict is in jail instead of treatment. In case you say that this is not so, look at the mandatory sentencing under NY's recently reformed drug laws. Yeah they have been reformed, but that does not give these people there lives back. Sorry, to me the injustice of a person being in prison for having a drug addiction is much greater than that person being out and stealing my stereo. These people need help, sometimes many opportunities. Shit, it took me several tries to quit smoking and that was hard. But putting people in jail. Brodus, I am suprised at you. You should no better than to argue the way you are. Taking the position of just being a better, more cautious criminal is just utterly indefensible and morally bankrupt. I don't agree with you on anything, but even I know you are too smart to honestly take that position. So it is Ok to break laws, just don't get caught. It is OK to send people to jail for the very same behavior that I am engaging in. I only care if I get caught. I love cops as long as they don't enforce the laws against me. I think you agree with me more than you are willing to admit. Remember, I don't hate cops. move away from cops. I don't like laws that take away freedoms. It is invasive for a cop to search me and my car. Why, have done nothing wrong. I am not doing this to protect drug dealers. I do this to protect the person who has done nothing wrong but is subjected to intrusive governmental laws that undercut what I believe to be basic human freedoms, and intrude upon the dignity of every free person. I don't have anything to hide from the government. That is why they have no business searching me. Too often they do. I got pulled over for having a small crack in my windshield and the police officer wanted to know if he could search me car. I said no. He listened. No problem. Brodus, there is nothing wrong with asserting your rights, sorry it did not work out for you. I would still defend you if you get busted. Even better is I would do it for free.

12-31-2004, 12:27 AM	#102
Pirate! Gatekepper Moderator Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 6,172	I will say that you all have very valid points. The Us vs. Them mentality only divides us all. I'm glad we have defense attorneys and police officers. The breakdown is in the system and our diminishing liberties. This has been the way off all societies that have come and gone, and it isn't going to change. I don't think this is an issue of who is the biggest intellectual or who has the most sound philosophy. We all have different values and beliefs concerning what is best for our country. My father--and best friend--is a socialist and I am completely opposite. You could even call me somewhat of a Libertarian. Despite ideological differences, we love each other. We would all do better to serve the people in the world who need our help, than to spew anger and disgust at those who have different opinions and values. People are diverse. It takes effort toward unity to keep us together and functioning as a healthy society. Just my opinion.

12-31-2004, 09:37 AM	#105
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	Brodus, I can drop it as well. I have respect for many officers as well. I don't think we are as far apart as you might think. I just don't want anymore liberties being taken away from a government that seeks to protect us from ourselves. I believe you agree with this. You are responsible and rational. You have determined for yourself, that you can manage prohormones safely even after the ban. I just don't believe that you should be a criminal. You are a smart guy. Why should you go to jail b/c you want to have some more muscle on your body. I don't believe the answer is to just be smarter about engaging in crime. You should not have been labeled a criminal at all. AS I said cops have the unfortunate role of having to enforce some of these ridiculuous laws. They have an impossible job. This is simply a war that they can not win. In order for them to do their job of enforcing drug laws, civil liberties must be undercut because of the nature of drugs (easy to hide, easily disposable.) I just don't feel that drugs are a big enough menance to sacrifice my liberties for. I actually know a number of police officers who agree with me. They agree with me that this problem could be better managed as a public health issue instead of as a law enforcement issue. Cops should not be in the business of enforcing morality. It would be like them arresting me for eating McDonalds (sure I know it is bad for me, but it is my body). I do want cops to protect us from murderers and other violent criminals. I just want to make their job easier by lessening their burden. Sorry if I come off confrontational. This is something I do get worked up over. I just hate seeing our rights gradually whitering away as the government seeks to protect us from the threat of the month. There are always going to be threats, there will always be violence, there will always be crime. I just don't want us rushing off in a moment of panic sacrificing the remaining liberities we do have. Our liberities are almost unique in this world and I am just so tired of seeing them being handed over willfully to protect ourselves from some overstated threat. Brodus, it has been interesting sparring with you. Have a wonderful day. Pirate, you finally brought some sanity to this discussion. Stay safe, stay out of trouble. If the cops ever do come looking for you just PM me. HAhahahahahaha. Take care guys.

12-31-2004, 02:09 PM	#107
Pirate! Gatekepper Moderator Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 6,172	Group Hug?

12-31-2004, 06:42 PM	#108
iMan323 Preved Medved! Elite Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Brooklyn Posts: 947	Yeah, group hug. I have an idea .....pass that shit over here...puff puff

12-31-2004, 07:45 PM	#110
Twigz Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 419 Photos: 4	I'll go with the group hug. Law in actuality I think we do agree, we just have different ways of stating it. Like I said at first, personally I don't care what you do to yourself. It just had better not cause problems for others. ILLEGITIMIS CON CARBORUNDUM!! (don't let the bastards grind you down) I love vegetarians, they're a great source of lean protien!

12-31-2004, 07:51 PM	#111
law74 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 40	Happy New Year to All.

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