big1day

i've been back into lifting for about 2 months now i slacked way off for about 1.5 years now i'm back hitting it hard on a upper/lower split i am currently 192 lbs and 25 5.7 tall.

next week i will start to take icon science 1 AD "erogopharm clone". I couldn't take the 1 AD when it was legal do to me being in the military and didn't want to gain too much weight (i had to run 3 miles almost 2-3 times a week) but now i want to get pretty big and toned i eat about 2200 cals a day knocked off a few lbs i was 205

so my supp plan looks like this

4:45am wake up
515 eat toast take glutimine,1 AD and Paravol (helps with lowered libido)
530 start cardio
0600 start lifting
0715 after shower and drink protein shake (nitro tech now but going to optimum whey)
0720 eat oatmeal

1800 dinner and 1 ad and paravol and glutimine!

how does this look? after i went through the bottle of 1 AD i was going to take anabolic extreme PCT--- Anabolic Xtreme PCT, 90 Caps

workingatit43

With only being back into lifting for a short time do not do the anabolics yet put them down for a while and I don't think that would be a proper pct and you make no mention of support supps. I would make more gains naturally get about 3 years solid lifting in then if you want go that route best of luck

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Irons77

I'd work on my diet too

Soreness is weakness exiting the body.

Built

...and the workout! Half an hour of cardio before lifting isn't prudent. Glutamine is a complete waste of money. And you need some protein in you before you lift in the AM. If you're pressed for time, try a protein shake with your toast.

Built

Paravol. Hmmm... reading...

Proprietary Blend: Horny Goat Weed 10% Icarin, Tribulus Terrestris Ext 40%, Long Jack (Eurycoma Logifolia)(From 20:1 Extract) Avena Sativa 4:1 Extract, L-Arginine HCL, Chrysin Powder, Maca Pwd., Muira P. Herb. Pwd. Rodeola Rosea Extract 1%, Catuaba Bark powder (Extract 4:1), Diindolylmethane, Cissus Quadrangularis Powder, Sarsaparilla (Smilax Powder) Calcium (D-Glucarate), Stinging Nettle Powder (Urtica Dioica) 350 mg

The trib might help with stiffies - if you're over forty! The other stuff, there's really not enough of to elicit an effect. Chrysin and calcium d glucarate are there to combat estrogen, but Chrysin has lousy oral bioavailability (it really works best as a transdermal with DMSO, which is pretty much the only thing it dissolves in) and there isn't enough calcium-d-gluc to do anything.

Save your money and just lift heavy and eat more saturated fat to bring up your testosterone levels, and continue to run a deficit so you drop bodyfat. Since aromatase is present in bodyfat, your estrogen:androgen retio will come down by itself as you lean out.

big1day

well i already have both of them the paravol is said to help libido. The 1-AD well i may go ahead and take this bottle. i know it is potent stuff i'm 25 so not too worried about it stunting growth. I'm checking around to see if it is ok to take it alone or do i have to stack it. I know you are saying what a tard for buying it but it was a great find and it made it here today. Please if you have no info on the product just read and leave or leave a jacked up comment but i am going to take it just looking for a few pointers

Built

big1day, listen to me. I am not selling anything and am volunteering my time and expertise to be here.

Some supplements can help you, some can hurt you, and some do nothing. The research is yours to discover.

That being said, anything you take will work only if you do. You need to do some reading so you can optimize your diet and your training. Even AAS don't do what they should with a crappy training and diet protocol, and from what you posted up, your protocol needs work.

Put it another way - if you're spending the dough to give you an edge, you might as well squeeze everything you can out of your hard-earned cash. Supplements are NOT "buff in a bottle". I wish they were, trust my lazy ass when I tell you I would be SO all over that if it existed. Work smart, work hard, eat properly. This means read more than you purchase - kinda like "measure twice, cut once". Do it right the first time.

big1day

well i have a pretty good training plan i think i mean i have seen good gains i saw the 1-ad and bit the bullet yes foolishly yes but none the less i bought it. i've been reading all over the net. i found this forum!



Upper- Tuesday,Friday


Straight leg Dead lifts-3x8
dumbbell lunges- 5 steps out turn around and repeat -3X
Pull through s 3x8 ( i need a replacement exercise i fell dumb doing these)
Glute ham raises-3x8
Squat (smith machine) 3x8
MTN climbers 3 count 30


Wednesday -off maybe some cardio

lower-Monday,Thursday

db presses flat 3x8
bent barbell row-3x8
db seated mil press-3x8
lat pull downs 3x8
triceps push downs with ropes on pulley 3x8
21's (curls)

i mix up it up sometimes but i mainly do what have been working....i do understand what you are saying but i need help with this one product you won't hear of me doing this again but I WILL start this bottle once the info i'm seeking is found

workingatit43

You can save the stuff it will not go bad on you

Anabolic Innovations Representative
Sbmuscle.com Representative My opinons, views, and suggestions are that of my own and do not represent SBMuscle.com.
Anabolic Innovation at SB Muscle
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Built

There you go. We're all works in progress, hey?

Now, your routine. You've got some good stuff, but I'm going to make some unasked for suggestions if you don't mind.

• Straight leg Dead lifts-3x8 ** if these are done correctly, they're the same as Romanian deads. If not, please switch to Romanian deads, and they're fantastic for hamstring development.
• dumbbell lunges- 5 steps out turn around and repeat -3X **Another real winner. Try a barbell - you'll be able to use more weight and work core all at once. I do these with a 95-lb preloaded barbell - a little narrower than an Oly bar, but you still need enough space to do them.
• Pull through s 3x8 ( i need a replacement exercise i fell dumb doing these)**Try SHELC. When they're easy, try 'em one leg at a time. Another one you can try is a seated cable row, but instead of pulling with your arms/back, you leave your arms ramrod straight, bend your knees slightly and push with your hams while laying all the way down until your back is on the rest. You will feel similarly silly that you are doing back rows "wrong". A third option is leg press, but done with your toes up high on the platform, actually your toes hanging OFF the platform. Push through your heels. Finally, try good mornings - seated or standing, nothing works like a GM.
• Glute ham raises-3x8** excellent and brutally hard.
• Squat (smith machine) 3x8**you seem like a good person so I'll tell you to please never ever use a smith machine to squat. This is not a squat. Smith machines have their place, don't get me wrong. They're great for chinups. And they make excellent towel racks...
  
  Proper squat form is of course below parallel. Here's a vid to check out: http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ck%20Squat.mpg
  
  (this site is excellent for proper form)
  
• MTN climbers 3 count 30

Now, I'd suggest you start with the heavy compounds and move into the accessory work afterward.

Something like this:
warmup: mountain climbers

Then the workout:
Full squat 5x5
RDL 5x5

Then perhaps
GHR OR Good mornings 3x8
then
walking lunges 3 walks

that way you're getting the heavy compounds in at the beginning, and some unilateral work in afterward.

Since you want some extra arm work, why not toss in bis and tris at the end here? Do them as an "antagonist pair" - set of tris, rest, set of bis, rest...

• Standing alternating dumbbell curls OR dumbbell preacher curls (try 'em, they're BRUTAL)
• Close grip bench press OR weighted dips

Might be a better workout for you. Do your cardio (if you chose to do any) at the end of this.




For this next workout...

• db presses flat 3x8 **good exercise
• bent barbell row-3x8 **another excellent back movement
• db seated mil press-3x8** do 'em standing. Consider Arnold presses.
• lat pull downs 3x8** do chinups, weighted. MUCH better!
• triceps push downs with ropes on pulley 3x8-** there are better tricep movements. Try close grip bench press, or weighted dips.
• 21's (curls) ** again, there are better bicep exercises. Try standing alternating dumbbell curls, or preacher dumbbell curls (they're brutal, try 'em!), or even more lat pulldowns so you also hit lats

Perhaps switch up the order a bit, and toss in some barbell pressing. I moved the direct arm work to the end of leg day since your arms should be pretty much fried by the time you've done all this pushing and pulling.

Something like this:

• You l like cleans? If you do, try a few short sets first. Then do:
• B.O. barbell rows OR chest-supported t-bars 5x5
• flat or low incline barbell press 5x5

Then perhaps

• weighted chins 3x8 (weighted negatives is fine, self-assist with your feet to get to "up" if you need to)

These last two work great as an antagonist pair, as above:

• one arm lat pulldowns 3x8
• Arnies 3x8

Thoughts?

big1day

AWESOME!!! i will throw some of that in tomorrow i already switched from smith machines and i do the walking lunges out for 12 steps and back 12 holding the 35's.i will try to follow the roman deadlift tomorrow. i do pretty heavy weight for me right now but my spotter sucks he doesn't really know the gym or know exercises

big1day

Work out was great this morning i wore my self out

Glute ham raises
squats
leg press
roman dead lifts
lunges
calve raises

man by time i got done with set 2 of the lunges holding the 30's for 12 steps out and 12 back i was done i think my legs were waving the white flag but i pushed through the work out then walked 1 lap and that was it

big1day

I think my diet is pretty good i cleaned it up very good being that i was in the marines i had to eat pretty clean to stay within the strict height and weight standards. i got out in august and packed on about 50lbs of fat in less than 6 months i noticed it i cut back on portion size which is my main enemy i was eating for 3 people. I now eat regular portions at about 500 cals for the 3 main meals and about 200 for the other 2 to 3 meals so i end out about 2000 no more than 2200 a day i weight lift and cardio. I see a decrease in my flab but since i lift pretty heavy i think I'm done losing weight i dropped from 205 to 192 but the flabby parts are starting to show more muscle i can see the front 3 muscles on my thigh now. i drink plenty of water.

Built

Grams of protein? Grams of fat? Grams of fibre?

Your calories are lower than mine! Why so low?

big1day

i was a fat ass 2 months ago over 205 for no reason just flab so I've been cutting cals and hitting the gym to bring it all together for me. I wanted to trim up then blow up. I don't go as far into the counting anymore i used to use fitday.com but i slacked off that and i just know now how to eat clean and in moderation

workingatit43

Keep up the good work bro

Anabolic Innovations Representative
Sbmuscle.com Representative My opinons, views, and suggestions are that of my own and do not represent SBMuscle.com.
Anabolic Innovation at SB Muscle
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