Why We Get Fat

[OnceWasFat]

Has anybody else read the book Why We Get Fat by Gary Taubes? He very convincingly argues for an alternative hypothesis of weight maintenance that turns conventionally wisdom on its head. He argues that the reason we gain or lose fat isn?t simply because calories in are greater or less than calories expended, but that macronutrient composition, specifically the quality and quantity of carbohydrates we consume, controls our accumulation of fat. He backs his arguments with modern science and relevant science from a few decades ago and states that the nutritional advice of the recent decades has been at odds with observed reality.

Any thoughts?

 

[OfficerFarva]

It's because people eat like shit and sit on their asses all day.

 

[OnceWasFat]

Taubes argues that they eat like shit and sit on there asses all day because they are getting fat, not the other way around. In effect, high insulin levels are robing their energy and storing it as fat, making them either eat more and/or move less to meet their body's energy demands.

 

[OfficerFarva]

Taubes argues that they eat like shit and sit on there asses all day because they are getting fat, not the other way around. In effect, high insulin levels are robing their energy and storing it as fat, making them either eat more and/or move less to meet their body's energy demands.

Those hundreds of millions of fat people also have bad genetics, right?

 

[OnceWasFat]

No, he's not saying that. He's saying that the low-fat, high-carb diet that's been the official recommendation, the famous food pyramid, leads the high insulin levels which drives abnormal fat accumulation.

 

[OfficerFarva]

No, he's not saying that. He's saying that the low-fat, high-carb diet that's been the official recommendation, the famous food pyramid, leads the high insulin levels which drives abnormal fat accumulation.

There might be some truth in that but I don't know anyone that follows that pyramid on purpose. I do however know a lot of people who can devour an entire pizza and 30 beer in a night multiple times a week.

 

[OnceWasFat]

People certainly need to make better choices. It might help some if they knew there were delicious alternatives, like bacon and eggs, that won't make them fat instead of thinking that it will (assuming Taubes is right).

 

[Calves of Steel]

Carbs are not as filling as fat per calorie, and they raise insulin dramatically causing fat, muscle, and water gain. Switching from a standard 50% carb diet to a keto diet will make it much harder to maintain weight if you eat to fullness. You'll also notice a difference in how your appetite comes on. Instead of rapid hunger you get a very gradual buildup in appetite that's easier to ignore.

 

[AmM]

Carbs are not as filling as fat per calorie, and they raise insulin dramatically causing fat, muscle, and water gain. Switching from a standard 50% carb diet to a keto diet will make it much harder to maintain weight if you eat to fullness. You'll also notice a difference in how your appetite comes on. Instead of rapid hunger you get a very gradual buildup in appetite that's easier to ignore.

Carbs don't get you fat, too many calories make you fat. You can get shredded on a high carb low fat diet as long as your in a calorie deficit. Stop making carbs out as being the reason for obesity. People are obese because they shove too much food down their throat.

 

[dave 236]

Carbs don't get you fat, too many calories make you fat. You can get shredded on a high carb low fat diet as long as your in a calorie deficit. Stop making carbs out as being the reason for obesity. People are obese because they shove too much food down their throat.

Nope. This is just wrong! Show me how at a calorie deficit on a predominantly high carb diet this will work. Skinny fat is what you'll get. You may not be overweight but you will not be anywhere close to shredded.

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[theCaptn']

Carbs don't get you fat, too many calories make you fat. You can get shredded on a high carb low fat diet as long as your in a calorie deficit. Stop making carbs out as being the reason for obesity. People are obese because they shove too much food down their throat.

A cal deficit of McDs will get you shredded ...... ...

 

[AmM]

Nope. This is just wrong! Show me how at a calorie deficit on a predominantly high carb diet this will work. Skinny fat is what you'll get. You may not be overweight but you will not be anywhere close to shredded.

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Bullshit! Many have and many still do. "Skinny fat" LOL, you been reading to many boards!

 

[dave 236]

People certainly need to make better choices. It might help some if they knew there were delicious alternatives, like bacon and eggs, that won't make them fat instead of thinking that it will (assuming Taubes is right).

The fact that we've all been inundated with lies about how eating foods like these raises serum cholesterol levels doesn't help. We have a self created epidemic of unhealthy obese people in the world (esp the U.S.) and its got a lot to do with being given bad information about what does and doesn't make us fat. If i hear one more fucking dietician in a hospital tell a cardiac patient that he/she can have all the grains they want but should watch out for eggs i may commit a homicide. Its ridiculous and only serves to keep people on meds.

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[dave 236]

Bullshit! Many have and many still do. "Skinny fat" LOL, you been reading to many boards!

You should read more in general. If you are thinner with a 25% bodyfat what would you call it? Shredded? Whatever. you are just wrong about high carbs at a calorie deficit. Carbs are the one macro you dont have to consume any of as you can produce them from amino acid or fatty acid breakdown. Try going on a no fat diet for a while and just increase carbs, then go have labs done and check your hormone levels. I work as a lab tech at a college that trains Med lab personnel. I see it 1st hand quiet a bit. Now im not a proponent of goin carb free but limiting simple carbs is something i think most people would benefit from.

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[OnceWasFat]

The whole calorie deficit argument is just a red herring. Of course if you're in an energy deficit you're going to lose weight (some muscle and some fat). That's the physical reality of the problem -- The First Law of Thermodynamics. It's the mechanism, the "how" we lose weight, but it says nothing about the biology of why we accumulate or shed fat. Fat is stored or liberated primarily under the action of insulin. Carbohydrates drive insulin which drives fat accumulation.

Our bodies have some energy requirement -- call it E. If we consume exactly E amount of calories we could still be in an energy deficit or surplus. If high insulin levels are causing us to store some of our consumed energy as fat, then we have no choice but to either become more sedentary or eat more (or both) the meet our energy demand (or possibly catabolize our other tissues, becoming "skinny fat"). This is why carbohydrate heavy diets are driving the obesity epidemic.

 

[theCaptn']

Protein can elicit an insulin response as well

 

[OnceWasFat]

That is certainly true, but the insulin response in healthy people to protein is much lower than to glucose, and it's even slightly lower in Type II diabetics. Plus, the rise time in serum insulin levels is much slower. When protein is consumed along with significant amounts of dietary fat, the response curve is even lower and slower than to carbohydrates with fat. In fact, carbohydrates consumed along with a little protein (with minimal fat), gives the greatest insulin spike. The central point is that carbohydrates are the primary driver of insulin and insulin drives fat accumulation (and inhibits fat breakdown).

 

[_LG_]

That is certainly true, but the insulin response in healthy people to protein is much lower than to glucose, and it's even slightly lower in Type II diabetics. Plus, the rise time in serum insulin levels is much slower. When protein is consumed along with significant amounts of dietary fat, the response curve is even lower and slower than to carbohydrates with fat. In fact, carbohydrates consumed along with a little protein (with minimal fat), gives the greatest insulin spike. The central point is that carbohydrates are the primary driver of insulin and insulin drives fat accumulation (and inhibits fat breakdown).

You can lead a sheep to water, but you can't make them drink.

 

[OnceWasFat]

Roger that...but it's always interesting to watch the debate play out.

 

[_LG_]

People get ideas in their head and can't let go.

 

[s2h]

The type of carbs matter...100g of carbs from snickers bars are going to effect a person different then 100g from brown rice..

 

[OnceWasFat]

The type of carbs matter...100g of carbs from snickers bars are going to effect a person different then 100g from brown rice..

Absolutely. The quality of the carbs is important. However, because of individual variability some people will be able to handle brown rice just fine, while others will mostly turn it to fat. People who stay significantly lean despite eating quite a few carbs probably have smaller insulin responses that those who get fat just looking at something like brown rice.

 

[LINK0435]

Part of the issue I believe is that we eat too much empty calories in this country in general we are fed processed crap everywhere you go. Even foods marked as healthy alternatives if you read the label's will still be loaded with sugars and salts. People need simply eat more natural foods and it would not be such an issue, start making your own food instead of buying pre prepared items or going out to chain restaurants. the further you get away from this stuff the better you feel and it becomes easier to lose weight that's all I did and I dropped 60 lbs.

 

[OnceWasFat]

I think that's some great advice. It's unfortunate that obesity disproportionately inflicts the financially less fortunate. It's probably because it's cheaper to eat that processed, high-sugar, junk than healthier alternatives.

 

[Christsean]

Can I keep it real simple for a moment. ..... always remember.......eat less, move around more, lose weight.

That is the magic behind any good diet.

 

[Little Wing]

i'm kinda sure it was simply that second blt. i vote overeating plain and simple.

 

[dave 236]

Can I keep it real simple for a moment. ..... always remember.......eat less, move around more, lose weight.

That is the magic behind any good diet.

True enough, if you are only concerned with weight. If you are concerned with your body's composition however, it isn't that simple.

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[Christsean]

True enough, if you are only concerned with weight. If you are concerned with your body's composition however, it isn't that simple.

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Yes sir, you are correct. That was a rhetorical statement (if such exists).

The basic principle holds true in any diet though. Take the most scientifically approached diet around and at the end of the day what has taken place to lose the weight? Less unused calories consumed than used by the body.

I hope this was taken in good humor as I intended.

 

[Powermaster]

It's lifestyle simply put.

Not just overeating this or that. It's the availability of good whole food in the country is just appalling. Go to the grocery store on any corner any you'll find mostly processed food that was engineered to be addicting. Then there's fast food, soft drinks....

Yeah sure Taubes is right about the insulin part but it's much more than that with processed foods and meats filled with antibiotics and high levels of omega 6 screwing up hormone balances of growing kids and adults as well.
Then we have the lack of exercise part mostly caused by the hormone imbalances setting off metabolic & metabolism mess.
Environmental factors are involved as well with amount of xeno estrogens used in packaging all processed foods and drinks....

 

[dave 236]

Yes sir, you are correct. That was a rhetorical statement (if such exists).

The basic principle holds true in any diet though. Take the most scientifically approached diet around and at the end of the day what has taken place to lose the weight? Less unused calories consumed than used by the body.

I hope this was taken in good humor as I intended.

Yes, no animosity felt. its a discussion that comes up often though and its worth debating the different opi ions and evidence out there because obesity and diabetes (type 2) are almost synonymous. Then there are those stupid BMI charts at the doctors offices or hanging up in Target pharmacy that confuse people into believing you just have to achieve a certain weight (or lack of weight) relevant to height to be healthy. Much of the problem exists now due to the sedentary lifestyles being led by a large majority of the population along side the myth that since fat is more calorie dense than carbs you're better off eating whole grain toast (or whatever the grain based flavor of the month is) than eggs or steak. Calories definitely matter however which is another reason logging what is eaten is important in maintaining a healthy diet.

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