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7g a week..real?
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What's your favorite test dose?!
- Thread starter Darkhrse99
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AlphaStrength50
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i thoughtbswoper was on hgh amd 2g test?
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Mike Arnold
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He is, but he said he wants to try out 5-7 grams per week.
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AlphaStrength50
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oh fick no man 5-7 isnjot easyy
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I have. I know plenty of people who use a couple grams of test per week. I agree with most of what swiper says regarding testosterone, but I do NOT think using 5-7 grams per week, especially 7 grams per week, is anymore beneficial than a much lower dose of say, 3.5-4.0 grams per week. A dose of roughly 3.5 grams weekly will result in receptor saturation in the average person, which means there won't be any androgen receptors left for the testosterone to latch onto--they will all be filled up. The average pro is NOT using 5-7 grams of test per week...and I have seen the exact cycles of many current pros at this point...most of them top pros, incluidng Kai and Evan...and most use between 1.5-2.0 grams of test weekly...and some even less than that, if you can believe that. Of course, they use other drugs too. Kai went a BIT higher when he was with Oscar, but still nowhere close to 5-7 grams a week...and Oscar is known as a heavy drug guy.
As a coach, I often get clients that come from other coaches...and most clients freely share what the other coach was having them do. Likewise, these coaches also often share with their amatuer clients the cycles of their pro clients in order to inspre them or inform them regarding "what it takes". Often, these cycles are passed down to me. I saw a mini cell phone video of Oscar's "drug book", which contained the cycles of al his pros at the time. This was about 3 years ago....and of all the pro cycles I have seen, not a single one came anywhere close to 5-7 grams of test per week....not a single one. In fact, the highest test dose I saw used 2.5 grams weekly...and this was a man who has now been top 2 in the Olympia on two different occasions.
Often, its the amatuers or low-ranking pros who are taking a shit-tons of drugs in an effort to catch up to the pros/top pros. I chronically see amatuers and even non-competitors using more drugs than the pros I know of....and sadly, most of these people are deluded into thinking that the pros must take at least as much or more, so they continue to use more and more drugs, thinking that if they use enough, they will eventuially catch up. But...the real reason the top pros are top pros is not because they use more drugs than less successful BB'rs, but because they have better genetics, which includes drug response. This not directed at swiper, as I think he is a cool guy, but 7 grams is ridiculous. Not only is it a waste, but it is much more likely to cause serious, long-term health problems, including cardiac hypertrophy and heart dysfunction, among numerous other cardiovascular side effects. Even 5 grams is absurd, in my opinion. Better results would be obtained by using a combination of drugs, rather than filling every available receptor site with testosterone. There are too many other steroids out there, which supply effects testosterone does not, which work synergistically with testosterone to enhance growth beyond what testosterone can accomplish alone. So, filling every AR with test is never the best way go if maximum growth is your goal.
get my quotes right if you're going to quote me. this is what i said. I never said "the average pro is taking 5-7g ew"
It seems like you're getting some misinformation. Maybe people don't want to tell you what they actually take because they know you have a big mouth and will tell the entire BBing community????
Mike Arnold
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Where did I ever say I was quoting you? I didn't...I simply made a statment that most pros are not using 5-7 grams per week. I never attributed that statement to you....and I have never associated any names with any cycles I have ever posted, with the exception of Kai Greene. Besides, I did not get this information from Kai, but from someone else. I would NEVER betray anyone's trust in the way you have just inferreed.
If anyone is misinformed, it is going to be the person who actually thinks that the body can use 7 grams of test. I was being respectful before, but now I will just say that such an idea is flat-out fucking stupid for all the reasons I stated previously. Most certainly, there are people who have and do use that much...the idiots. No one knows what every pro is doing--that is common sense, but the people who are the most likely to be informed are the coaches, as it is them who deal with the largest number of people and in many cases design the programs being used. One thing I can say for sure is that a non-competitive BB'r with no ties to the industry is certainly NOT going to be the most informed.
The highest dosed pro cycle I have seen at this point is posted below...and was used by a man who used to work with Oscar Ardon. He is one of the very best BB'rs in the world at this time, with some people thinking he is the best. I do not know what he uses now, but have been told he uses less now than he did then, since switching coaches. I am NOT saying no pros uses more than this, as I have heard all kinds of crazy stories, but I don't consider rumors to be reliable, so I take them with a grain of salt. There are always going to be people out there using a ton of drugs, but from everything I have seen and heard up to this point, I would say the typical pro uses between 1.5-2.0 grams of test per week, along with other AAS totaling anywhere between 3-5 grams per week. I SEVERELY doubt that the typical pro is using 4 grams of T weekly, as it would conflict with everything I have seen over the last 20 years. Of course, I am sure plenty of pros do, but I don't think its the "average". If I had to guess, I would say that a relatively small minority of pros use 4 grams of test per week and I certainly don't think 7 grams is anywhere near common. These are the smart pepople...the people who understand that the body has a limit to the amount of gear it can use. There is a reason Kai has reduced his dosages since switching coaches...because he was finally convinced by somoene with insight that using too much AAS is an assinine move.
Let's be real here. The reason you are posting these comments is because you are pissed that I publically disagreed with your position on testosterone, partiularly your idea to run 5-7 grams weekly, even though I was respectful in my delivery. You have seen me post here for years without complaint, but as with most people, as soon as they get called out for something, they lash out, as you are doing here. So, keep on posting whatever you want, but it won't change the fact that 7 grams of testosterone weekly is a horrible idea and that most pros don't use anywhere close. Anyway, See below:
Weeks 1-8: Test @ 1.5 grams/week.
Weeks 1-8: Deca @ 1 gram/week.
Weeks 1-8: Anadrol @ 500 mg/day.
Total AAS per week: 6 grams, over half of which is Anadrol.
Weeks 9-16: Test @ 2.5 grams/week
Weeks 9-16: EQ @ 2.5 grams/week.
Weeks 9-16: Dianabol @ 100 mg/day.
Total AAS per week: 5.7 grams.
I don't know what his GH or insulin program was.
Being that you laughed when I said I think the average pro dose of test is probably between 1.5-2.0 grams per week, you must think that this cycle is horribly insufficient for building Olympian level mass, right? I guess 6 grams of gear just isn't good enough for ole' swiper. So, since you think even 2 grams of test for a pro is bullshit (which would make the above cycle under-dosed), just what do you think these guys require? I am dying to hear your opinion.
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you're well known to have a big mouth that you can't keep shut and everyone knows it.
you don't know much about me as I don't have a big mouth like yourself. I'll leave it at that.......
I laughed at your KAI comment. notice I made large font??
you don't know much about me as I don't have a big mouth like yourself. I'll leave it at that.......
I laughed at your KAI comment. notice I made large font??
Mike Arnold
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1.) For someone who has NEVER divulged ANY private info about another individual, I find that hard to believe. Unlike you, unless I can back up my accusations with proof, I keep them to myself. So, either put up or shut up, although I think you'll be shutting up. Empty accusations are weak.
2.) Yes, you laughed at my original Kai comment, in which I said that I think the average pro test dose is 1.5-2.0 grams weekly, but that Kai used more than that. I am not so sure why you find it so funny that Kai used more than 2 grams per week, but if you would care to elaborate on that, I am all ears. In addition, at any point did I ever say that Kai has never experiemented with much larger dosages of test? No, because I don't know what he has done, aside from a particular point in his career when working with Ardon, based on some reliable information/pictures.
3.) No, I don't know much about you, but I have seen your body...and you appear to be just what you say you are--another non-competitive steroid user with a good physique. Welcome to the community, where you will find a million other people just like you. Now, most of us, after being involved in the community for a while, form friendships with at least some people in the industry. So, unless you are some undercover big-wig, which would make no sense whatsoever in this case, then all the dick measuring is irrelevant. I am sure you are a very important person that needs to keep your identity a secret. Does that make you feel better?
4.) I will also point out that you ignored every question I asked you, as well as ignored every point I made relevant to the conversation...and I suppose you will do the same with this post, as well. But...this is typical among those who have no counter. I have seen it many times over the years.
Look, we can simply agree to disagree. I will never conform to your position on testosterone dose, as I believe it is misguided for numerous reasons. I also have my own opinions regarding typical pros doses (if one can even list a "typical" dose, as there is so much variance among the pros), based on what I have seen, heard, and experienced over a 20 year time frame...and we don't have to agree on that either. After all, our perceptions are formed from our own experiences, so if the only pro cycles you have ever seen involved monster dosages, you will be more inclined to think this is normal among all pros. That's fine. I was never trying to change your opinion, but to get all butt-hurt over someone disagreeing with you...and then launch personal attacks because you can't use logic and science to lend credibility to your argument..that is immature.
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you're right i will not say. i respect what people tell me in private. unlike you.
wtf? you said Kai takes 2g weekly. that's what i laughed at. here is what you said. "incluidng Kai and Evan...and most use between 1.5-2.0 grams of test weekly..
Nope, you're right i'm just a nobody steroid user that enjoys training. I've said that many times myself. what's your point?
your questions had to do with you thinking i said all pros use 5-7g test ew. i never said that. i know some use a lot less. i'm not refuting that. learn to read.
Mike Arnold
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^^^^
I have to leave the house now, but you are wrong...I did NOt say Kai used between 1.5-2.0 grams per week. I was referring to "most" pros cycles I have seen. If you loook one sentence further down, you will see I said Kia used MORE than that! Be back later.
I have to leave the house now, but you are wrong...I did NOt say Kai used between 1.5-2.0 grams per week. I was referring to "most" pros cycles I have seen. If you loook one sentence further down, you will see I said Kia used MORE than that! Be back later.
yes you did. then you said he "used a bit higher". what's the big deal? 1.5-2g or a "bit more". who cares? not much of a difference.
anyway back on topic: my point is there are some pros on 5-7g of test ew. that is a fact. believe it or not I really don't care. I have nothing more to add unless you have more insulting comments to say to me.
AlphaStrength50
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chill bros come on guys lol
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Mike Arnold
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You appear to have a difficult time fully reading what someone posts and/ or comprehending what is typed. In your original post, there were 2 things which you took issue with...only two. The 1st was that you thought I mis-quoted you and the 2nd was that you thought I said Kai used 1.5-2.0 grams of test per week (refer to post #36).
Not only were wrong wrong about the mis-quote, as I never attributed that statement to you, but you didn't even read enough of my post to see that I was NOT referring to Kai when I made that statement. Therefore, BOTH of your gripes are meaningless, as you either misunderstood or didn't read what was said. Ohhh...and you trying to back-track in this post isn't working either. I saw what you said...and so did anyone else who read this thread, so just admit you made a mistake (3 mistakes, actually) and stop trying to bullshit your way out of it by saying "there is not much of a difference" because yes, there is a difference between 1.5-2.0 grams of test and 2.5 grams weekly test. That is a potential 1 gram difference--a 60% increase, which is hardly irrelevant.
*** For the record, the cycle I saw of Kai's involved using 2.5 grams of test/week, along with several more grams of AAS, totaling about 6 grams per week. Personally, I don't find this too hard to believe, being that I have seen numerous pro cycles using 3-4 grams of total AAS per week. In addition, I think those who exceed that dose of test are only compromising their gains and/or wasting their testosterone, as better gains will take place with a well planned combination of AAS versus test alone. We only have a limited number of receptor sites available for use (3.5 grams causes receptor saturation in the average person) and although testosterone is a wonderul drug, capable of initiating muscle growth through multiple mechanisms, there are other drugs which supply benefits testosterone does not. Virtually EVERY top coach recognizes this fact, which is why EVERY cycle I have EVER seen from these coaches, including some of the cycles Chad supposedly designed for Ronnie, ALWAYS involve a combination of drugs, but if you want to argue with all of us, go right ahead. I feel no further need to argue this point. Now, a high test, GH, and insulin cycle an be very effective for growth...and there may be times where such a cycle is warranted, but it would not be my go-to cycle for those seeking maximum mass gains in the overwhelming majority of cases...and like I said, all the greats seem to agree.
Then, you continue in this post by stating..."my point is there are some pros on 5-7g of test ew. that is a fact. believe it or not I really don't care". You say this as if I was arguing with you about it, even though I CLEARLY said right up front that I am sure some pros do use that much test. But...but you must have missed that one as well. So, virtually every argument you raised was never an issue to begin with, invalidating nearly eveything you posted in this thread.
Insulting comments to you? Sorry, buddy, but you're not going to turn this around on me, as YOU were the one who launched into personal attacks and insults simply because you were butt-hurt over me respectfully disagreeing with your position on test dose. Sure, I got pissed after that and said a few things, but still attempted to converse in an intelligent fashion by making valid points and asking several questions, all of which you ignored while continung to launch further pesonal attacks without just cause and in the absence of provocation--proof positive that your only reason for being here was to satisfy your butt-hurt ego.
More so, you refused to post even the slightest bit of evidence in support of your claims. You claim I have outed people's personal info. If so, why won't you tell all of us where this private info was posted? I would like you to show me even a single post anywhere on the entire web where I have ever posted a pro's personal cycle in connection with their name, but you will never be able to do that because it never happened. There is absolutely no reason you couldn't refer all of us to these supposed posts, as anything posted on the web is freely available to the general public. Like I said, talk is cheap and unless you can back up your assertions with proof, you are only taking out your ass.
Lastly, you say you have nothing else to add, but I would like to point out that you never really had anything to add in this thread, as not only were your initial arguments based on improperly comprehended posts, but you then spent the remainder of your time hurling personal attacks even after your mistakes were brought to your attention. I tried multiple times to engage you in debate, but YOU chose not to respond. So, by all means, please post something useful and let's move away from the bullshit.
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so how did you come up with the dose of 5-7g? yeah you read my post.
"I have seen the exact cycles of many current pros at this point...most of them top pros, incluidng Kai and Evan...and most use between 1.5-2.0 grams of test weekly... "
that's what you said ^^^^ stop trying to change your statement.
Yes not much difference between 2g and 2.5g, maybe to a lightweight like yourself. I'm back tracking nothing, you're making a big deal of 2g and 2.5 It's not a huge jump.
And i bet you're going to tell me Ronnie took 2g ew of test too, right? LOLLOLOLLOLOL
Yeah it's well known you're a big mouth that can't be trusted. And no i will not site my sources. I respect their privacy unlike you. take it for what it is or don't, i could care less.
Mike Arnold
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I am not going to repeat what I already said. Your reading comprehension is poor and your attempts at diversion juvenile. That was my final attempt at adult conversation. Have a good night.
good night, sweet dreams my love!