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L-Glutamine - pre/post workout, pre/post sleep? which is best?

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  1. #1
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    L-Glutamine - pre/post workout, pre/post sleep? which is best?






    I've bought some good quality L-Glutamine and was wondering when the best time to take it is.

    The site i bought it from says either waking up or before bed, pre or post workout.

    Which do you guys think is best? Also, how much at this recommended time?

    Thanks in advance
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    i do like 5-10 minutes pre and right before bed. Also I take capsules so i get 6grams per serving so 12g a day.

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    i use powder. 5g pre/10g post. also 5g upon waking, and 5-10g at bed.

    i take 20-30g a day.
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    Ive taken L-glutamine for 2 months at 20g per day and did not notice any results (not even improved recovery).

    I personally think its not worth the expense as quality L-glutamine is quite expensive (Japanese or US manufactured).

    Also I recall some discussion (sorry cant remember sources) that L-glutamine should not be taken at the same time as a protein supplement as they compete for the same receptor sites. Glutamine peptides on the other hand dont share the same conflict and you will find many protein powders have peptides added. You might want to research this for yourself as I dont have sources.

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    Try Glutamine Peptides instead of L-Glutamine. The absorbtion and the results are WAY better.

    Cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboy75 View Post
    Ive taken L-glutamine for 2 months at 20g per day and did not notice any results (not even improved recovery).

    I personally think its not worth the expense as quality L-glutamine is quite expensive (Japanese or US manufactured).

    Also I recall some discussion (sorry cant remember sources) that L-glutamine should not be taken at the same time as a protein supplement as they compete for the same receptor sites. Glutamine peptides on the other hand dont share the same conflict and you will find many protein powders have peptides added. You might want to research this for yourself as I dont have sources.
    tahts y u take it before workout and before bed

    most liekly ur stomach shall be pretty empty

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    Quote Originally Posted by dontsurfonmytur View Post
    tahts y u take it before workout and before bed

    most liekly ur stomach shall be pretty empty
    many people eat before workouts (protein shake, light meal) and before sleeping (cottage cheese/cassein)

    i personally find my workout performance suffers I train on an empty stomach.

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    For me training on an empty stomach is not an option. I feel horrible if I do. If I can't eat a small meal, I usually just down a whey protein shake about 10-15 minutes pre-workout.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigPapaPump68 View Post
    For me training on an empty stomach is not an option. I feel horrible if I do. If I can't eat a small meal, I usually just down a whey protein shake about 10-15 minutes pre-workout.
    I'm the same way. Even when I was taking NO-Explode and it said for maximum effect don't eat anything for an hour, I still down a shake.

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    Has anybody actually noticed an improvement on their sleep because of glutamine?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hammercurls View Post
    Has anybody actually noticed an improvement on their sleep because of glutamine?
    Try ZMA for sleep - it gives its users AMAZING DREAMS !!! cheap too...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrmark View Post
    I've bought some good quality L-Glutamine and was wondering when the best time to take it is.

    The site i bought it from says either waking up or before bed, pre or post workout.

    Which do you guys think is best? Also, how much at this recommended time?

    Thanks in advance
    I have always used glutamine...

    -upon awakening
    -pre workout
    -post workout
    -before bed

    Always on an empty stomach.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JMRQ View Post
    Try ZMA for sleep - it gives its users AMAZING DREAMS !!! cheap too...
    Man, I'm gonna have to get some of this asap lol. I've procrastinated on it time and time again but I'm gonna make time to run to vitamin world and grab some. Is there a specific brand you prefer?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gopro View Post
    I have always used glutamine...

    -upon awakening
    -pre workout
    -post workout
    -before bed

    Always on an empty stomach.
    How much, and for what purpose?

    Quote Originally Posted by fray5 View Post
    Man, I'm gonna have to get some of this asap lol. I've procrastinated on it time and time again but I'm gonna make time to run to vitamin world and grab some. Is there a specific brand you prefer?
    Why do you think you need it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by fray5 View Post
    Man, I'm gonna have to get some of this asap lol. I've procrastinated on it time and time again but I'm gonna make time to run to vitamin world and grab some. Is there a specific brand you prefer?
    I'm using the ON brand because they sell a big bottle with 180 pills... I LOVE ZMA it gives me amazing dreams EVERY SINGLE NIGHT

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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    How much, and for what purpose?



    Why do you think you need it?
    I am not going to get into a debate about whether glutamine works or not, because in MY lab it has proven to me that it does. Forget the lab coat studies that say it does not...studies in labs are totally inconclusive (often bias, often disproven, often conflicting, often not replicable) and have failed the REAL world thousands of times. Now, that said...

    I take glutamine MOST of all because it keeps my immune system running top notch. On glutamine...maybe one small cold per year. Off glutamine...about 2 flu bugs and a half a dozen colds, coughs, etc. Did the experiment twice and I need no more proof.

    Further, it is my belief that having the immune system running optimally is one of the most important aspects of successful progress in bodybuilding.

    If you do not use it or believe in it I have no problem with that! I use it...my clients use it...and we always will. One of my staples.

    : )

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    Actually Eric, I asked you how much glutamine you take, and for what purpose. I wasn't aware you had a lab, but cool.

    I asked fray5 why he thinks he needs ZMA. I was thinking he might do just as well with a multi-B, zinc and magnesium. Or possibly an epsom bath - the magnesium is absorbed transdermally, which helps a lot of people sleep well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    Actually Eric, I asked you how much glutamine you take, and for what purpose. I wasn't aware you had a lab, but cool.

    I asked fray5 why he thinks he needs ZMA. I was thinking he might do just as well with a multi-B, zinc and magnesium. Or possibly an epsom bath - the magnesium is absorbed transdermally, which helps a lot of people sleep well.
    Ahhhh, my bad. So used to seeing people these days bash glutamine, figured you were too!

    Actually my "lab" is world...no better place to experiment and see what REALLY goes on!

    I used to take upwards of 30 grams per day, but now 15-20 grams as I don't need as much with LG-5.

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    I remain decidedly on the fence with glutamine. In very large doses (30-40g daily) it helps people with intestinal disorders such as Celiac disease, and leaky gut syndrome, precisely because it is largely taken up by the gut when consumed orally.

    In well-fed bodybuilders in a nitrogen-positive state (read: bulking), unless there is an underlying gut issue, the evidence is rather thin. Not only is glutamine not an essential amino acid (you'll hear the term "conditionally essential" but that's only under catabolic/wasting conditions - the opposite of nitrogen-positive), but it is also the most abundant amino acid in your diet - about 10% of the protein most of us consume is glutamic acid: glutamine. Considering how much protein most in this sport consume - you for instance, Eric, likely consume well in excess of 300g daily, am I right? That means you're getting in 30g daily from your diet alone. In a caloric excess, I'm not clear on any possible benefit to be had from supplementing with more. What the research is clear on is that it won't hurt you (other than possibly causing some GI distress).

    Addressing your comment about how the world is your lab, I see how you can make that mistake, but the problem with experimental hypothesis testing is the subjects need to be blind to the process, and that's simply not possible when you use yourself as a guinea pig, not unless you were to set up a test for yourself with a placebo control and a treatment and somehow hide the labels until you were finished your analysis. If you did this, you could reasonably argue for your real-world lab. What you have, in fact, is a real-world demonstration, but those are vulnerable to the confound of placebo.

    Don't think I'm dismissing the value of observation though; I'm not. What you CAN find from the real world is the basis for experimentation - it all starts with observation. If the effect is real, it will not only stand up in "the real world", that is to say, accompanied by its placebo, but also to hypothesis testing, when the effect of placebo is controlled for.

    This is certainly true for the best-studied supplement of all time: creatine. Science is STILL uncovering new uses for this supplement, including improved cognitive function in Alzheimers and cardiac function following surgery. And science has had no difficulty whatsoever establishing creatines efficacy as an ergogenic aid.

    Glutamine has been shown to be of tremendous benefit in burn units. It has to be delivered via IV drip, however, and the catabolic conditions of near-death are nowhere near the piddling bit of microtrauma we in physical culture make way more of than is really the case.

    Dave Barr had this to say in his two-part article, Glutamine, destroying the dogma (parts I and II):

    It's the mark of a great person who can devise a theory, drawing from many different ideas, and stick to it. Without this, science would be meaningless. But it's the mark of an even greater person when they can admit, without shame, that their idea is wrong.

    Sometimes theories pan out and sometimes they don’t, but we have to be able to let go of them once they're shown to be incorrect. This doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t believe new theories when they first come out; it just means that we have to be conscious about the fact that they aren’t dogma and may be wrong.

    Case in point: The theory behind glutamine was so great that I refused to believe the authors of the Candow et al. (2001) study when they told me the results in person. I was an educated bodybuilder and I wasn’t going to let some egghead scientist (who was actually more muscular than I was, and therefore far from being just an "egghead") tell me that I was wrong. Of course, I wanted to believe that glutamine was useful (even though I got nothing from it) and when someone wants to believe something you can’t convince them otherwise.

    Since then I’ve had a while to let the results sink in. I know that most believers in glutamine will also have a hard time accepting the reality of the situation, which is why I didn’t just try to convincingly show that glutamine wasn’t as great as everyone thought; I tried to overwhelmingly demonstrate it.


    Bottom Line

    Glutamine is good for hospital patients and rich people with money to waste. If you’re involved in resistance training and already have proper post workout nutrition, along with a moderate carb intake, then glutamine probably won’t do anything for you. In fact, none of the proposed theories dealing with glutamine supplementation have worked out in the athletic world. It’s also one of the most expensive supplements around (simply based on dosage recommendations), so it’s way too costly to use for personal experimentation — especially when the updated scientific literature doesn’t support the theories.
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    Glutamine is banned under the Missuse of Placebo's Act
    TheCaptn' is not a registered proctologist. His post are for his amusement only. Please seek proper medical advice if symptoms persist.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Marquis du Gears View Post
    Glutamine is banned under the Missuse of Placebo's Act
    If you strike me down(ban me)I'll become more powerful than ever.. Don't say i don't warn you.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    I remain decidedly on the fence with glutamine. In very large doses (30-40g daily) it helps people with intestinal disorders such as Celiac disease, and leaky gut syndrome, precisely because it is largely taken up by the gut when consumed orally.

    In well-fed bodybuilders in a nitrogen-positive state (read: bulking), unless there is an underlying gut issue, the evidence is rather thin. Not only is glutamine not an essential amino acid (you'll hear the term "conditionally essential" but that's only under catabolic/wasting conditions - the opposite of nitrogen-positive), but it is also the most abundant amino acid in your diet - about 10% of the protein most of us consume is glutamic acid: glutamine. Considering how much protein most in this sport consume - you for instance, Eric, likely consume well in excess of 300g daily, am I right? That means you're getting in 30g daily from your diet alone. In a caloric excess, I'm not clear on any possible benefit to be had from supplementing with more. What the research is clear on is that it won't hurt you (other than possibly causing some GI distress).

    Addressing your comment about how the world is your lab, I see how you can make that mistake, but the problem with experimental hypothesis testing is the subjects need to be blind to the process, and that's simply not possible when you use yourself as a guinea pig, not unless you were to set up a test for yourself with a placebo control and a treatment and somehow hide the labels until you were finished your analysis. If you did this, you could reasonably argue for your real-world lab. What you have, in fact, is a real-world demonstration, but those are vulnerable to the confound of placebo.

    Don't think I'm dismissing the value of observation though; I'm not. What you CAN find from the real world is the basis for experimentation - it all starts with observation. If the effect is real, it will not only stand up in "the real world", that is to say, accompanied by its placebo, but also to hypothesis testing, when the effect of placebo is controlled for.

    This is certainly true for the best-studied supplement of all time: creatine. Science is STILL uncovering new uses for this supplement, including improved cognitive function in Alzheimers and cardiac function following surgery. And science has had no difficulty whatsoever establishing creatines efficacy as an ergogenic aid.

    Glutamine has been shown to be of tremendous benefit in burn units. It has to be delivered via IV drip, however, and the catabolic conditions of near-death are nowhere near the piddling bit of microtrauma we in physical culture make way more of than is really the case.

    Dave Barr had this to say in his two-part article, Glutamine, destroying the dogma (parts I and II):

    It's the mark of a great person who can devise a theory, drawing from many different ideas, and stick to it. Without this, science would be meaningless. But it's the mark of an even greater person when they can admit, without shame, that their idea is wrong.

    Sometimes theories pan out and sometimes they don’t, but we have to be able to let go of them once they're shown to be incorrect. This doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t believe new theories when they first come out; it just means that we have to be conscious about the fact that they aren’t dogma and may be wrong.

    Case in point: The theory behind glutamine was so great that I refused to believe the authors of the Candow et al. (2001) study when they told me the results in person. I was an educated bodybuilder and I wasn’t going to let some egghead scientist (who was actually more muscular than I was, and therefore far from being just an "egghead") tell me that I was wrong. Of course, I wanted to believe that glutamine was useful (even though I got nothing from it) and when someone wants to believe something you can’t convince them otherwise.

    Since then I’ve had a while to let the results sink in. I know that most believers in glutamine will also have a hard time accepting the reality of the situation, which is why I didn’t just try to convincingly show that glutamine wasn’t as great as everyone thought; I tried to overwhelmingly demonstrate it.


    Bottom Line

    Glutamine is good for hospital patients and rich people with money to waste. If you’re involved in resistance training and already have proper post workout nutrition, along with a moderate carb intake, then glutamine probably won’t do anything for you. In fact, none of the proposed theories dealing with glutamine supplementation have worked out in the athletic world. It’s also one of the most expensive supplements around (simply based on dosage recommendations), so it’s way too costly to use for personal experimentation — especially when the updated scientific literature doesn’t support the theories.
    Exactly the answer I expected (well, not EXACTLY, but close)...and I have read it all before. I read the studies, journals, etc just like all other science geeks, but in this case my mind remains unchanged.

    Glutamine works for intense training athletes of all types (and I work with athletes of all types)...period.

    And in my opinion, the real world lab (used correctly) far surpasses the usefullness of the white coat lab.

    But hey, what do I know.

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    Like I said, I remain decidedly on the fence. I took it for years, gave it away as Christmas gifts, and was utterly sold on it. I'm sure I spent thousands of dollars on it over that time.

    Now I spend my money on steak. But then, I'm sure I don't train nearly as hard as you do, Eric. I'm way too lazy. Were I to undertake some sort of endurance training, I might revisit the stuff. I wish there were a simple way to take it on an IV drip. Pity you can't just go to the supp store and pick up a bag of lactated ringers along with concentrated IV solutions of glutamine and BCAAs - stuff the Olympic athletes are put on by their team doctors. I'd slip arginine in there too; increase GH output.
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    Think I'd rather use steroids. At least I know they'll work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by juggernaut View Post
    Think I'd rather use steroids. At least I know they'll work.
    I know, right? Besides, it's cheaper.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    I know, right? Besides, it's cheaper.
    Damn right.
    MA, what's the positive in using creatine during AAS usage? I mean is there, or are there any benefits to using while on or cruising aside from the obvious benefits to someone who isn't optimized?

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