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Hey, could you all clear something up for me?

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  1. #1
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    Hey, could you all clear something up for me?






    Hey everyone. I'm looking into getting back into the gym for a different reason. I used to do extremely high reps for endurance training in regards to mixed martial arts, but somewhere along the lines my goals have shifted from competing in tournaments to getting bigger. Right now I am about 5'8 150lbs with about 15-17% bodyfat and am slightly confused.

    What I am confused about isn't the amount of sets or reps, what or how much to eat, or what routine is best for me, but moreso I am confused by how much time people are telling me I should spend in the gym. I hear some people saying 30 minutes to an hour and some saying 2 hours+. I come from the school that believes that you can't do anything in a limited amount of time no matter how hard someone works. I feel that many fitness experts feed us what we want to hear. Unfortunately I have bought into one thing; I am truly afraid of overtraining. So far here is what I plan on using to gain mass and the set/rep scheme isn't set, but I do plan on pyramidding it and altering it as I progress. Would this have me in the gym too long or cause me to overtrain? Any input is greatly appreciated.

    Here is what I plan on using and switching between in the next year.

    3 Day Split Every two weeks substitute Snatch High Pull, Clean High Pull, and Power Cleans into back workout.

    Back/Biceps:
    Pullups/lat pulldown 4x10
    Barbell Row/Seated Rows 3x6, 8, 10
    Shrugs 3x6, 8, 10
    Standing Barbell Curls 3x8, 10, 12
    Hammer Curls 3x8, 10, 12
    Ab Pullovers
    Leg Lifts

    Chest/Triceps/Shoulders
    Incline Dumbbell Press 3x6, 8, 10
    Bench Press 3x6, 8, 10
    Military Press 3x6, 8, 10
    Upright Row 3x 6, 8, 10
    Lateral Raises 3x6, 8, 10
    Dips 3x10
    Triceps Extensions 3x8, 10, 12
    Triceps Pushdown 3x8, 10, 12

    Legs
    Squats 3x6, 8, 10
    Deadlifts 3x5
    Leg Extension 3x8, 10, 12
    Leg Press 3x6, 8, 10
    Leg Curl 3x8, 10, 10
    Standing Calf Raises 4x10, 12, 15, 20
    Seated Calf Raises 3x10, 15, 20

  2. #2
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    You can totally get an amazingly tough workout in 30 minutes.

    Hell, DOMS (a member here) used to do HIT and his workouts were less than 10 minutes and he was dead afterwards.

    There are a few simple things you need to remember:

    1 - Use mostly compound movements.
    2 - Use mostly free-weights.
    3 - Keep a balance between all the major areas of the body.

    In the program you posted, most of the movements are isolation, there are too many machine exercises, and there is not a great balance. By balance i mean the same amount of upper body work as lower body work, and the same amount of pressing as pulling.

    The reason so many people are in the gym for hours on end is that they miss these points.

    Isolation exercises arent as taxing as compounds because they dont utilise as much muscle at one time as bigger, multi-jointed exercises do. Machine exercises dont invoke stabilizer muscles and dont take as much mental focus as their free-weight counterparts.

    Add those two things up, and the only way youre going to feel you've done enough in your session is if you do a million exercises and a million sets.

    My advice would be to scrap this and read the stickied threads at the top of the training section, they outline some great concepts for program design.

    Welcome to IM!
    http://www.getlifting.info

    Disclaimer: All health, fitness, diet, nutrition, anabolic steroid & supplement information posted here is intended for educational and informational purposes only, and is not intended as a substitute for proper medical advice from a medical doctor. We do not condone the use of anabolic steroids (AAS), all information about AAS is for educational and entertainment purposes only. If you choose to use AAS it's your responsibility to know the laws of the country that you live in. Consult your physician or health care professional before performing any of the exercises, or following any diet, nutrition or supplement advice described on this website.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gazhole View Post
    You can totally get an amazingly tough workout in 30 minutes.

    Hell, DOMS (a member here) used to do HIT and his workouts were less than 10 minutes and he was dead afterwards.

    There are a few simple things you need to remember:

    1 - Use mostly compound movements.
    2 - Use mostly free-weights.
    3 - Keep a balance between all the major areas of the body.

    In the program you posted, most of the movements are isolation, there are too many machine exercises, and there is not a great balance. By balance i mean the same amount of upper body work as lower body work, and the same amount of pressing as pulling.

    The reason so many people are in the gym for hours on end is that they miss these points.

    Isolation exercises arent as taxing as compounds because they dont utilise as much muscle at one time as bigger, multi-jointed exercises do. Machine exercises dont invoke stabilizer muscles and dont take as much mental focus as their free-weight counterparts.

    Add those two things up, and the only way youre going to feel you've done enough in your session is if you do a million exercises and a million sets.

    My advice would be to scrap this and read the stickied threads at the top of the training section, they outline some great concepts for program design.

    Welcome to IM!
    Thanks! I just read the first one in regards to designing a routine and it is going to be built around squats, deads, military press, bench press, and barbell rows on a 5x5 format.

    As much as I don't want to acknowledge that I am a beginner, in truth I am a beginner when it comes to the specific goal I want.

  4. #4
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    We all been there bro, hell I learn something about BBing everyday on here
    Soreness is weakness exiting the body.

  5. #5
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    I'm usually in the gym for 45min to an hour. Typically closer to an hour

    much longer than that and my take is that you're either overtraining or not utilizing your time well enough
    AtLargeNutrition - Support the company that supports strength!

  6. #6
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    Thanks for all of your help guys! I have enough programs to last me for at least 2 years that focus on goals ranging from strength and myrofibrillar hypertrophy to gaining mass and inducing sarcoplasmic hypertrophy :-D. I also have the Strength Training Anatomy book, which I absolutely LOVE! Here are my workout programs ranging from beginner to intermediate! The set/rep schemes of each workout will also change once I get a good solid base :-D.

    The leg press on the A/B format is real light and taking the place of squats because of an injury I have. Normally I would squat 3x a week, but that is a no go this time D=. I tore my MCL and stretched out the PCL and ACL about a year ago doing mixed martial arts. The 3day split was derived from cowpimp's designing a training method, so props to him on that!

    Strength/5x5

    Workout A
    Squats 5x5
    Barbell Rows 5x5
    Deadlift 3x5
    Barbell Curls 3x8
    Pullups 4xFailure
    Calf-Raises 3x15

    Workout B
    Leg Press 3x5
    Bench Press 5x5
    Military Press 5x5
    Dips 4xFailure
    Tricep Extensions 3x8


    3 Day

    Tuesday Back/Bis
    Barbell Row 3x8
    Seated Row 3x8
    Pullups 4xFailure
    Upright Rows 3x8
    Shrugs 3x8
    Hammer Curls/Barbell Curls 3x8, 8, 10

    Wednesday Chest/Tris/Shoulder
    Incline Bench Press 3x8
    Bench Press 3x8
    Dips 4xFailure
    Incline Flys 3x8
    Military Press 3x8
    Lying Lateral Raises 3x8
    Tricep Extensions 3x8, 8, 10

    Saturday Legs/Abs
    Back Squats 3x8
    Front Squats 3x8
    Deadlift 3x5
    Good Mornings 3x8
    Calf-Raises 3x10
    Cable Crunches
    Wood Chops

    4 Day Split

    Back/Biceps:
    Pullups 4x10
    Barbell Rows 3x8
    Seated Close Grip Rows 3x8
    Barbell Shrugs 3x8
    Barbell Curls 3x8
    Hammer Curls 3x8

    Chest/Triceps:
    Incline Bench Press 3x8
    Flat Bench Press 8/8/6/4
    Dips 3x8
    Incline Dumbbell Flys 3x8
    Triceps Extensions 3x8
    Triceps Pushdowns 3x8

    Shoulders/Traps:
    Military Press 3x8
    Seated Shoulder Press 3x8
    Lateral Dumbbell Raises 3x8
    Upright Rows 3x8
    Shrugs 3x10

    Legs:
    Squats 3x10
    Front Squats 3x8
    Leg Extensions 3x10
    Leg Curls 3x10
    Deadlifts 3x5
    Seated Calf-raises 3x8
    Standing Calf-raises 3xfailure

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gazhole View Post
    You can totally get an amazingly tough workout in 30 minutes.

    Hell, DOMS (a member here) used to do HIT and his workouts were less than 10 minutes and he was dead afterwards.

    There are a few simple things you need to remember:

    1 - Use mostly compound movements.
    2 - Use mostly free-weights.
    3 - Keep a balance between all the major areas of the body.

    In the program you posted, most of the movements are isolation, there are too many machine exercises, and there is not a great balance. By balance i mean the same amount of upper body work as lower body work, and the same amount of pressing as pulling.

    The reason so many people are in the gym for hours on end is that they miss these points.

    Isolation exercises arent as taxing as compounds because they dont utilise as much muscle at one time as bigger, multi-jointed exercises do. Machine exercises dont invoke stabilizer muscles and dont take as much mental focus as their free-weight counterparts.

    Add those two things up, and the only way youre going to feel you've done enough in your session is if you do a million exercises and a million sets.

    My advice would be to scrap this and read the stickied threads at the top of the training section, they outline some great concepts for program design.

    Welcome to IM!

    Gazhole you give good advice.

    'You can work hard or you can work long'

    When I was a pure HIT trainer I remember doing leg-extensions to failure immediately followed by deep-breathing 20 rep squats. I could barely walk for a few minutes after - talk about jelly legs ! - and needed a good 5 mins rest before I could proceed and train the rest of my body. Doing just 2 hard working sets twice a week for my legs my squat went from 90 lbs for 10 reps initially to ~300 lbs for 20 reps at my best (before I stopped training). Modest poundage compared to some but for me, being primarily an ectomorph and hardgainer, it was a great achievement.

    45-60 mins is more than adequate to train the entire body let alone just 1-2 bodyparts !

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Protheus View Post
    Gazhole you give good advice.

    'You can work hard or you can work long'

    When I was a pure HIT trainer I remember doing leg-extensions to failure immediately followed by deep-breathing 20 rep squats. I could barely walk for a few minutes after - talk about jelly legs ! - and needed a good 5 mins rest before I could proceed and train the rest of my body. Doing just 2 hard working sets twice a week for my legs my squat went from 90 lbs for 10 reps initially to ~300 lbs for 20 reps at my best (before I stopped training). Modest poundage compared to some but for me, being primarily an ectomorph and hardgainer, it was a great achievement.

    45-60 mins is more than adequate to train the entire body let alone just 1-2 bodyparts !
    Thanks man

    It just occurs to me that, no matter how much you love working out, you want to do other things with your time aswell. If i spent 3 hours in the gym, 5 days a week...i think id get bored of it pretty quickly.
    http://www.getlifting.info

    Disclaimer: All health, fitness, diet, nutrition, anabolic steroid & supplement information posted here is intended for educational and informational purposes only, and is not intended as a substitute for proper medical advice from a medical doctor. We do not condone the use of anabolic steroids (AAS), all information about AAS is for educational and entertainment purposes only. If you choose to use AAS it's your responsibility to know the laws of the country that you live in. Consult your physician or health care professional before performing any of the exercises, or following any diet, nutrition or supplement advice described on this website.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Protheus View Post
    Gazhole you give good advice.

    'You can work hard or you can work long'

    When I was a pure HIT trainer I remember doing leg-extensions to failure immediately followed by deep-breathing 20 rep squats. I could barely walk for a few minutes after - talk about jelly legs ! - and needed a good 5 mins rest before I could proceed and train the rest of my body. Doing just 2 hard working sets twice a week for my legs my squat went from 90 lbs for 10 reps initially to ~300 lbs for 20 reps at my best (before I stopped training). Modest poundage compared to some but for me, being primarily an ectomorph and hardgainer, it was a great achievement.

    45-60 mins is more than adequate to train the entire body let alone just 1-2 bodyparts !
    How in the hell did you ever manage to do breathing squats AFTER doing extensions to failure? I can barely do 20 rep breathing squats when I'm fresh and warmed up, let alone when I'm tired.
    Ron Paul 2012

    No gym for home, work out floor with 30, but is it for 20 like 30 lb when you no lift it to be for men, for 30 lbs instead? or half is 10 for 20 pounds?

  10. #10
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    Thanks for all of the input guys! Let me know if you all think I am on the right track!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by danzik17 View Post
    How in the hell did you ever manage to do breathing squats AFTER doing extensions to failure? I can barely do 20 rep breathing squats when I'm fresh and warmed up, let alone when I'm tired.
    It was brutally hard and used infrequently - and required reducing the normal poundage I would normally use for breathing squats by ~30-40%.

    I don't think I could have pushed myself through it without a wickedly evil training partner, but heh I got my own back when it was his turn !

    The anticipation beforehand was worse than waiting in a dentists reception. And I hate going to the dentist!

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