Hey, new here.. want to start BB late in life (sort of)

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  1. #1
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    Hey, new here.. want to start BB late in life (sort of)

    A little about me. I'm 32 M. I've always been athletic, but have never really gotten into BB. I've always been involved in sports, so I've been in and out of gyms my entire life, but never really delved into body building as a sport itself.

    My body composition is about 22% fat (ya i know ewww). I've just cut a fair amount of weight from 194 to almost 175 now (summer goal). I'm about 5'10. I'm not shabby, as I can bench around 250 at 175 lbs, but I know thats not exactly spectacular either.

    I have access to all sorts of fitness equipment, so that's not a problem (even here at home).

    Where I need advice is: How do I effectively body build at my age? I know I'm not OLD, but there's a big difference in 32 and 22 haha. My body still responds fairly well (thus the recent 20lb weight drop). I really want to pack on some lean muscle mass, but I'm not sure about the process and actual mentality that I should approach this with.

    It would be nice to loose the prementioned 20lbs and gain 10 lbs lean back on.

    Any advice? Any aged body builders out there haha...

    Thanks for your opinions. Have a GREAT night!

    B.

    What type of diet should I approach? Training schedule? That sort of thing.

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    I started at 30 years and its not as hard as you might think.
    Just eat and lift.
    yeah thats basically it, do the basic squats, deads, benchpress, overhead press.
    All of the other stuff just kinda fell in place for me but it has also taken me 8 years to get where i am so it was alot of trial and error on my part.
    maybe I'm not much help

  3. #3
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    Thanks vad.

    I would classify myself as a casual body builder at this point haha. My body is in a place where I can go into a workout feeling confident that I'm not going to sustain an injury due to improper form or a tight connection somewhere.

    I've just never really gotten serious enough to go about it scientifically, and with a body builder diet (whatever that means).

    Thanks for the reply! YOu took my forum virginity hahaa!!!

  4. #4
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    Brokeback IronMag! I love it!

    At the risk of "sloppy seconds", I'll step up to the plate...

    I started at 38. Trust me, YOU are a YOUT' (I said "yout" lol!).

    First thing I get EVERYBODY to do who asks for help is track your diet. Without changing a thing, and I know it's hard but do it anyway, go to FitDay - Free Weight Loss and Diet Journal (the free version, online, that's what I use) and enter everything you put in your mouth the last two or three days. Run a "report" for the average and post up your average grams of protein, carb and fat, and total calories (your "macros"), and tell me if you are gaining or maintaining at this level.

    Also, give me an idea of your current activity level ("none" is a level, don't worry, we all start somewhere) and any injuries/illnesses/meds you are willing to share with us under the guise of anonymity.

    We'll start there.

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    Thats a pretty cool counter there! The problem is that the diet I've had over the last few days isn't a very accurate picture of my normal diet. Should I track it over the next few days?

    I;ve also been drinking one of the metrx shakes with like 42g of protein on my workout days (not sure if its the right thing to do, but hey i actually kinda like the taste!)

    My current activity level is a %50 seated office job haha.. seated half the time i guess. WIth an evening taebo workout of 1 hr.

    I have no injuries, illnesses, or medications.

  6. #6
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    I just need a few "typical-ish" days so I know what maintenance is FOR YOU. I don't want your "unusual" eats - just the "normal" ones, and that includes any shakes or MRP you consume.

    I don't know what metrx is. I don't use shakes personally, on a diet, I prefer to chew what little food I get to consume.

    Do you do those classes every day? Any other activity? Lifting? Cycling, walking... just list it. I need an idea of where you are right now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    I need an idea of where you are right now.
    He's in Alabama

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    Quote Originally Posted by SnowManSnow View Post
    Where I need advice is: How do I effectively body build at my age?
    Listen to Built, I read all of her post. Doing it right at any age produces the best possible results.

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    Well, how about I start logging what I eat each day right here.. I'll try to eat the "Normal" things... and, after a few days, we SHOULD have an idea of whats going on.

    The TaeBo happens about 3x a week. I also do it with leg weights and dumbbells in my hands (it's quite challenging!).

    I'll start logging, and post what it is that I find.

    B.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    I just need a few "typical-ish" days so I know what maintenance is FOR YOU. I don't want your "unusual" eats - just the "normal" ones, and that includes any shakes or MRP you consume.

    I don't know what metrx is. I don't use shakes personally, on a diet, I prefer to chew what little food I get to consume.

    Do you do those classes every day? Any other activity? Lifting? Cycling, walking... just list it. I need an idea of where you are right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Metallibanger View Post
    He's in Alabama
    Thanks Metalbanger. I now know EXACTLY how to help the OP diet down.

    <rolls eyes>

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    So, I've been reading some articles, and I'm finding some things that I wouldnt have guessed. Please correct me if I'm wrong so I can go into this with the correct mindset.

    #1 Diet is huge and is equal to or at least close to importance of lifting in building lean muscle mass. It seem like I'm going to have to eat a bit more a bit more often to dictate that I get what my muscles need to recover and grow. That being said, it has to balance out with what my body can actually USE per meal.

    #2 It seems like I've over trained my whole life haha. From what I'm reading an entire upper body workout a few times a week would probably be overtraining.. the same with lower body.

    Now some questions:

    #1 I'm confused about what intensity I should strive for in a set. From what I'm gleaning I should do no more than 4-10 work sets / workout, but how hard should I train the movement? Seems like I read that I don't really want to try to train to failure, but If I don't how do I recruit the optimal number of muscle fibers (the fire all or nothing right?)

    #2 Also, Say I did a workout with 8 work sets of pushing movements for upper body on day how many REPS should I include in each? Do I set the weight for failure after 4-6 reps? (see above) or what?

    #3 WOuldnt the above dictate a fairly SHORT workout? Why would it take me more than half an hour to do 8 work sets of most ANY kind? I know you can't judge a workout by how LONG it lasts, but how do I get the intensity I need with so few sets?

    See what I'm struggling with here? I just grew up being taught a TOTALLY different mindset. I always worked out with my uncle who was a gym freak (Still is at almost 50) I remember he could bench over 400 for 2 or 3 reps, but never really got that body builder BUILD. I guess he plateaued out because he overtrained... workouts generally around 2 hrs .. most ever day.. and so forth.

    Sorry this is so long, but I have a habit of doing things the right way.

    B.

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    1: no need to eat more frequently. Eat one big meal or 18 tiny ones, it really doesn't matter, or if it it does, not by much. Eat as frequently as you feel comfortable. Ultimately, it's a budget. And diet will be responsible for at least 80% of your success - or failure.

    2: Instead of body parts, think "movement patterns".

    The OTHER #1: read this, it'll help you understand the rep ranges, which will mostly address your concerns.

    The OTHER #2 and #3: read this. I incorporate the ideas in the linked article I just gave you into a workout split. Scroll to the end for the fully-worked-out split.

    Your uncle plateaued because he didn't eat enough to get big. If you train in very low rep ranges, your workout will often need to be very long because the recovery between sets is so critical.

  13. #13
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    Im also confused.... about diet in this way.. I'm seeing a lot about "eating enough". Eating "enough" from what I've seen so far looks like eating a LOT haha ( I know it has to do with the KIND of food and all), but I'm concerned about not gaining muscle, but instead gaining back the 20 lbs of FAT I just lost. It is, as you put it, a budget... and I guess I have to balance it with muscle consumption of the caloric intake.

    Thanks for your help so far, I'm sure there will be more noob questions

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    Try this: track what you are currently eating on FitDay - Free Weight Loss and Diet Journal for a few days and run an average. If you are neither gaining nor losing on this, you have now discovered maintenance - for you.

    To gain, eat more, and to lose, eat less. How much more depends on your genetics, but for most unassisted males 2 lbs of muscle gain in a month is about the most they can count on, and that only happens in a surplus. If you plan to gain no more than say 4 lbs a month for a few months during a bulk - well, supposing you ONLY gained fat. This would represent a 500-calorie over maintenance diet. You won't gain ONLY fat if you lift heavy, but this is the worst-case scenario.

    Supposing your maintenance turns out to be 2600. Try 3000 for your bulk, watch how fast you gain fat, and adjust accordingly.

    That help?

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    wow.. freakin confusing.. but I'll get there

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    OK, I've determined that on AVERAGE.. not always... I consume around 1200 cals and around 59g of protein / day.

    You asked about the TaeBo earlier... and I'm flexable with that. Let's plan on 2x a week once I start lifting (time is a factor when you have a family and job u know).

    Other than that I don't really have any stressful activities to speak of. I play golf, but it's cart golf most of the time.

    Should I track this longer? or does this give us the basic information we need to start tinkering?

    B

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    On TaeBo Days should I just consume another 300 cals or so? The workout is generally 55mins of pretty intense stuff.

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    Okay, we need to step to the side here and discuss the purpose of exercise. What type of exercise do you think will make you hard and lean?

    Also, how fast are you losing on these calories?

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    as far as the taebo goes? I think a good cannon is that I've been eating average like posted above and over the last few months i've dropped almost 20lbs doing the taebo... so there is obviously NOT a surpluss of much of anything goin on there.

    As far as building muscle, I haven't been doing much in that respect (thats why I'm here getting advice from folks with nice abs) From general "workout knowlege" I would think that heavy progressive overload would cause the muscle fibres to thicken. Then again, I've been wrong once this week already

    I don't mind dropping the taebo to a few times or even once a week if that will help direct the nutrients in the right way to muscle growth.

    I'm planning on hitting the gym later today. I'll post work sets and weights as well as time and so forth to be scrutinized by people with big muscles haha.

    Thanks again,

    B

  20. #20
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    How about instead of that you just do a simple full-body workout for now?

    squats
    romanian deadlifts
    lat pulldowns
    Arnold press
    One arm dumbbelll rows
    flat or low incline db or barbell press

    Do everything as 3x5-8, pick a weight where you won't quite hit muscular fatigue and focus on good form. No machines (other than the lat pulldowns).

    Re diet: starting today I'd like you to increase your protein. You are 175 at 22% bodyfat - this means you have roughly 140 lbs of lean mass on you AND you're dieting. I'd like your protein at around 200g a day. Don't let your fats drop lower than 70g. Get some fish oil and get in 10g of your daily fats from these (that's right, ten capsules, I take this myself and I'm not kidding).

    Your calories are too low. You're going to lose any size you ever had. Your fat loss can not continue at this pace, not now that you're leaner. You dieted too fast, and we need to slow things down so your metabolism doesn't crash.

    Okay?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SnowManSnow View Post
    I would think that heavy progressive overload would cause the muscle fibres to thicken.
    It will, in a caloric surplus it will for sure, yes. In a deficit, it protects lean mass by "directing calorie traffic" toward muscle. With not enough resources to run your whole body, your body will grudgingly drop fat - and you'll lean out. Cardio creates a deficit, but doesn't protect lean mass. When you're dieting, you want to lean out, not just get smaller and softer, right? So you do the stuff that protects lean mass: lift heavy and short, don't run too much of a deficit, don't rely upon cardio for too much of your deficit (I'd say don't rely upon cardio for your deficit at all but rather do it sparingly for conditioning/active recovery), keep your protein high so you remain in a nitrogen positive state while you lose weight, keep your fats up so you feel satisfied and so you maintain your endocrine function..

    Any of this help?

  22. #22
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    my note....noone cares how much you can bench except you.

    No offense to you but its so "male" to worry about it. Everyone always asks that question ya know. just kinda a pet peeve of mine.
    Ban 2 1/2 's !!!!!!
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    I think I can manage that. Is a smith machine ok for the squats and so forth, I don't have access to a real squat rack, and there isn't one for 30 or so miles haha.

    My issue is going to be I will have to force myself to start slow and below fatigue as you put it. My form will be fine. I've been lifting a long time, just not with the correct diet to gain mass. When I was in college I weighted 150 and benched 295 at 2% body fat. I played tennis like a mad man (thus burning up ALL MY CALORIES haha).

    As far as the diet goes, where the heck am I going to find 200g of protein? and should I find it ... I'm guessing my caloric intake will go up significantly with it just from eating that much.

    I also have a scale that measures body fat and so forth, should I watch it over the next few weeks or so? I assume I'm going to want to gain weight and have body fat drop? (pardon my noobish questions).

    Again, thanks for your help.

    B

  24. #24
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    Please do not use the Smith. If you value your knees you just won't use it.

    How heavy do you figure you can squat right now? I realize you haven't been squatting in a while and you might not have your form down - I'm only asking so I can find a work-around for you.

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    The squat thing I'll have to experiment with as far as weight goes. It has been a while since I did real squats, so you're right about starting slow there. As far as REAL Squats go, im pressed (no pun intended) to find a way to do it. I do have a machine at the gym, one where you kind of lay at a 45 degree angle and press, but no squat rack with free weights. I realize it's less than ideal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Merkaba View Post
    my note....noone cares how much you can bench except you.

    No offense to you but its so "male" to worry about it. Everyone always asks that question ya know. just kinda a pet peeve of mine.

    I agree

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    I usually start newbs off with goblet squats. http://www.crossfit.com/discus/messages/22/20544.jpg

    The thing I like about goblets is they teach you proper form and to get your ass all the way down there.

    If you can clean heavy enough, you might consider doing free barbell squats with a weight you can clean and press or snatch into position.


    Alternatively, you can try lumberjack squats.
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  28. #28
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    OK I managed to get right at 200g prot today, and the calories that go with it.. I'm guessing around 2k.

    Picked up fish oil.. sounds gross

    Did evening workout as follows:
    Didnt go heavy as you suggested.

    1 Arm Rows: 3x8 45lbs
    Lat PUlls: 3x8 100lbs
    Flat Bench DB: 3x8 50lbs
    Roman Deadlift: 3X8 95LBS ( had to do a few really light sets to get the hang of this onebut i like it!)
    Lumber Jack Squats 4x8 70lbs

    forgot all about arnold presses

    like u said i started light.

    The workout took about 45 mins. A few hrs after it I feel muscle fatigue, but not really tired.

    When is the next time I need to do this?

  29. #29
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    I AM SO PROUD OF YOU!!!

    Do this workout three times a week. Read the writeup in my blog for next time.

    The fish oil - did you get caps? They're the easiest. Just take a couple before each meal.

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    Thanks!!!

    So I do this 3 times a week. ok... what about diet on off days? same as workout days?

    Also, I don't feel like I got much of a workout just doing this.. .should I still fight the urge and rest a day before working out again?


    B

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