IronMagLabs Osta Rx

          Follow Us on Facebook        Subscribe to us on YouTube        Follow Us on Twitter        IronMagLabs on Instagram        Sign Up for our Newsletter


Man who killed burglary suspects cleared

Results 1 to 23 of 23
  1. #1
    Registered User
    bio-chem's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    9,176
    Rep Points
    346951410

    Man who killed burglary suspects cleared






    Man who killed burglary suspects cleared - CNN.com
    HOUSTON, Texas (AP) -- A Texas man who shot and killed two men he suspected of burglarizing his neighbor's home was cleared in the shootings Monday by a grand jury.


    Joe Horn shot and killed two men last November after he saw them crawl out a neighbor's window.

    Joe Horn, 61, shot the two men in November after he saw them crawling out the windows of a neighbor's house in the Houston suburb of Pasadena.

    Horn called 911 and told the dispatcher he had a shotgun and was going to kill the men. The dispatcher pleaded with him not to go outside, but Horn confronted the men with a 12-gauge shotgun and shot both in the back.

    "The message we're trying to send today is the criminal justice system works," Harris County District Attorney Kenneth Magidson said.

    Horn's attorney, Tom Lambright, has said his client believed the two men had broken into his neighbor's home and that he shot them only when they came into his yard and threatened him.

    The two Horn suspected of committing burglary, Hernando Riascos Torres, 38, and Diego Ortiz, 30, were unemployed illegal immigrants from Colombia. Torres was deported to Colombia in 1999 after a 1994 cocaine-related conviction.

    The episode touched off protests from civil rights activists who said the shooting was racially motivated and that Horn took the law into his own hands. Horn's supporters defended his actions, saying he was protecting himself and being a good neighbor to a homeowner who was out of town.

    Don't Miss
    KHOU: Local coverage
    "I understand the concerns of some in the community regarding Mr. Horn's conduct," Magidson said. "The use of deadly force is carefully limited in Texas law to certain circumstances ... In this case, however, the grand jury concluded that Mr. Horn's use of deadly force did not rise to a criminal offense."

    Lambright did not immediately return a phone call seeking comment from The Associated Press.

    Texas law allows people to use deadly force to protect themselves if it is reasonable to believe they are in mortal danger. In limited circumstances, people also can use deadly force to protect a neighbor's property; for example, if a homeowner asks a neighbor to watch over his property while he's out of town.

    It's not clear whether the neighbor whose home was burglarized asked Horn to watch over his house.

  2. #2
    Metrosexual
    ELITE MEMBER
    DOMS's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    In a van, down by the river...
    Posts
    32,686
    Rep Points
    1860097295

    Nice.

    Texas sounds like a great place.


  3. #3
    Registered User
    bio-chem's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    9,176
    Rep Points
    346951410

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMS View Post
    Nice.

    Texas sounds like a great place.
    i thought this would be something you approved of. I've got to agree, it works for me.

  4. #4
    Metrosexual
    ELITE MEMBER
    DOMS's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    In a van, down by the river...
    Posts
    32,686
    Rep Points
    1860097295

    If I'm elected, there'll be two dead Mexicans in front of every home!


  5. #5
    Registered User
    bio-chem's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    9,176
    Rep Points
    346951410

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMS View Post
    If I'm elected, there'll be two dead Mexicans in front of every home!
    i'm proud to be an american. i just want to point out that i beat mino in posting this little bit of news

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    ELITE MEMBER
    min0 lee's Avatar


    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    The Bronx, NYC
    Posts
    44,751
    Rep Points
    802265827

    Quote Originally Posted by bio-chem View Post
    i'm proud to be an american. i just want to point out that i beat mino in posting this little bit of news


    That seems to be the Colombians M.O., they have breakin crews here in NYC.

  7. #7
    Succinct
    ELITE MEMBER
    Witchblade's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Holland
    Posts
    4,469
    Rep Points
    2519459

    He shot them in the back out of self-defence?

    Not that I don't approve of course.

  8. #8
    Un~Bulking
    ELITE MEMBER
    DaMayor's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Right Here. No, HERE.
    Posts
    7,855
    Rep Points
    76758723

    I saw this on the news the other night. Per that interview, the men were in his (Horn's) front yard, less than fifteen feet from his front door. When he approached them, they initially made a forward move (i.e., towards him) before turning to run away. His attorney was saying that he feared for his safety/life, and chose to shoot.

    Either way, if you don't want to pick lead out of your ass, then don't break into people's houses.

  9. #9
    Registered User


    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    273
    Rep Points
    10

    Ive always idealized the principal that if your robbing me, i can fuck you up anyway i want. Kudos to the old geezer.
    Max Bench: 260
    Weight: 203
    Height: 5 10 and then some

  10. #10
    Smartass anthropologist
    ELITE MEMBER
    goob's Avatar


    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Anywhere, everywhere, nowhere....
    Posts
    5,990
    Rep Points
    18202470

    Quote Originally Posted by DaMayor View Post
    I saw this on the news the other night. Per that interview, the men were in his (Horn's) front yard, less than fifteen feet from his front door. When he approached them, they initially made a forward move (i.e., towards him) before turning to run away. His attorney was saying that he feared for his safety/life, and chose to shoot.

    Either way, if you don't want to pick lead out of your ass, then don't break into people's houses.
    But self -defence.....perhaps not. If they had started to run, and had their backs to him, it's more like murder. He obviously had time to think, and chose to shoot. THis does not sound like a reflex action.

    They brought it on themselves for trying to break into someones house, and paid the ultimate price.

  11. #11
    Un~Bulking
    ELITE MEMBER
    DaMayor's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Right Here. No, HERE.
    Posts
    7,855
    Rep Points
    76758723

    Quote Originally Posted by goob View Post
    But self -defence.....perhaps not. If they had started to run, and had their backs to him, it's more like murder. He obviously had time to think, and chose to shoot. THis does not sound like a reflex action.

    They brought it on themselves for trying to break into someones house, and paid the ultimate price.
    This was my initial thought. I personally wouldn't shoot to kill (in the back) over a robbery, unless an innocent person had been injured during the crime. I would blow your ankles off, maybe bust a cap in your patella....


    And another thing. What the hell does shooting at criminals have to do with race? I wish these civil rights wussies would get their facts straight before crying a river of tears.

  12. #12
    Moderator
    MODERATOR
    Dale Mabry's Avatar


    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Elsewhere
    Posts
    15,568
    Rep Points
    242738373

    I don't think they approached him, I don't think they threatened him, and I don't think he was in mortal danger or needed to kill them. I like the ruling, however.
    If sense were common, everyone would have it.

    4/2007-Current 75th Ranked most popular image 1 spot behind Prince's bulge...

    Check out my world famous Bob Loblaw's Law Blog at http://www.synergyhw.blogspot.com/...Just kidding, it's a health and wellness blog.

  13. #13
    Un~Bulking
    ELITE MEMBER
    DaMayor's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Right Here. No, HERE.
    Posts
    7,855
    Rep Points
    76758723

    Quote Originally Posted by Dale Mabry View Post
    I don't think they approached him, I don't think they threatened him, and I don't think he was in mortal danger or needed to kill them. I like the ruling, however.
    Oh, I didn't believe the self defense claim either...this is just what his lawyer said. And we know how clemson those clemson legal types clemson are.

    I'll take the ruling as well.

  14. #14
    Metrosexual
    ELITE MEMBER
    DOMS's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    In a van, down by the river...
    Posts
    32,686
    Rep Points
    1860097295

    There are an estimate 20 million Mexicans robbing my country. Can I kill them and get off? Please?


  15. #15
    Moderator
    MODERATOR
    Dale Mabry's Avatar


    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Elsewhere
    Posts
    15,568
    Rep Points
    242738373

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMS View Post
    There are an estimate 20 million Mexicans robbing my country. Can I kill them and get off? Please?
    You would get off if you killed them, but that is somehow unrelated to this discussion.
    If sense were common, everyone would have it.

    4/2007-Current 75th Ranked most popular image 1 spot behind Prince's bulge...

    Check out my world famous Bob Loblaw's Law Blog at http://www.synergyhw.blogspot.com/...Just kidding, it's a health and wellness blog.

  16. #16
    Un~Bulking
    ELITE MEMBER
    DaMayor's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Right Here. No, HERE.
    Posts
    7,855
    Rep Points
    76758723

    Funny, but I just had a discussion about this a minute ago.

    We have lived in our home for twenty years now. Recently, our neighbors, and best friends, decided to rent the house next door to them out to none other than, GUESS WHO. I haven't seen much of these people. Although I have seen their two pit bulls...which now have targets on their useless hides. Now, apparently, the son who lives in this house has gotten a case of sticky fingers due to his recent interest in recreational drugs, and has stolen from his own family.
    So, after twenty years in a rural setting where we could leave our doors unlocked, our kids could play outside safely, and I could sleep at night....no more, thanks to, I never thought I'd say it......freakin' beaners!

  17. #17
    Un~Bulking
    ELITE MEMBER
    DaMayor's Avatar


    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Right Here. No, HERE.
    Posts
    7,855
    Rep Points
    76758723

    Oops, I'm sorry....the gentleman said he was from Puerto Rico.




  18. #18
    Bohemian Extraordinaire
    ELITE MEMBER
    maniclion's Avatar


    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Mēns Incognita
    Posts
    26,846
    Rep Points
    800780946

    You never know they could have been running to get guns to come back and finish off the old man. I think he did the right thing, if he hadn't they very well would've come back to kill his ass just for getting in their way....
    Coarse edged youth, the irish pendants string from their smiles
    not yet plucked as to slacken the seams
    and drag down the features of age,
    no folds or creases from unkempt wear
    eyes of tranquilty, crystalline-beads
    no sign of despair in their hair, nor their hearts
    but oh they have yet to be experienced and that makes aging so very worth it...ML circa2012

  19. #19
    ..is bulking up!
    ELITE MEMBER
    BulkMeUp's Avatar


    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Cana-dah
    Posts
    5,681
    Rep Points
    4531477

    I saw this on CNN where they played his call to 911. The guys wernt robbing his house. They were robbing his neighbors house. He saw that happening and called 911. 911 said the cops were on the way but he decided to go and confront the crooks himself before they got away. The 911 operator tried to dissuade him for his own safety but he decided to go out anyway. He left the phone off the hook when he went out and you could hear the shots being fired. He shot them in the back and killed them. But that part is said to have happened on his property. I guess the crooks were trying to get away via his property when he shot them in the back.

  20. #20
    Registered User
    Goodfella9783's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    4,227
    Rep Points
    2716110

    Quote Originally Posted by DaMayor View Post
    And another thing. What the hell does shooting at criminals have to do with race? I wish these civil rights wussies would get their facts straight before crying a river of tears.
    I agree. The man is 61 and the two men were across the street. There's probably a chance it was night too. Are we even sure he identified their race before he told the 911 operator he was going to shoot? I'm guessing there would be no rights activists crying about race if it were two whites victimized by a minority.

    I'm surprised this guy got off though. I don't know about Texas, but usually self defense statutes only allow a person to use a reasonable amount of force to fend off an attacker. If these two saw the gun, started running and then this dude shot them, it's hard to believe he was in any imminent danger. The judge was probably trying to make an example out of the victims to deter others.

  21. #21
    Registered User
    bio-chem's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    9,176
    Rep Points
    346951410

    Quote Originally Posted by Goodfella9783 View Post
    I agree. The man is 61 and the two men were across the street. There's probably a chance it was night too. Are we even sure he identified their race before he told the 911 operator he was going to shoot? I'm guessing there would be no rights activists crying about race if it were two whites victimized by a minority.

    I'm surprised this guy got off though. I don't know about Texas, but usually self defense statutes only allow a person to use a reasonable amount of force to fend off an attacker. If these two saw the gun, started running and then this dude shot them, it's hard to believe he was in any imminent danger. The judge was probably trying to make an example out of the victims to deter others.
    or maybe it was a jury?

  22. #22
    Registered User
    Goodfella9783's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    4,227
    Rep Points
    2716110

    Quote Originally Posted by bio-chem View Post
    or maybe it was a jury?
    Judge/jury whatever, both are guided by the law.

    Deadly Force in Defense of Person
    (Texas Penal Code)
    (Briggs p. 94)

    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another if he would be justified in using force under Section 9.31 of the statute when and to the degree he reasonable believes that deadly force is immediately necessary to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force, if a reasonable person in the same situation would have not retreated. The use of deadly force is also justified to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, rape or robbery."


    Deadly Force to Protect Property
    (Texas Penal Code)
    (Briggs p. 96)
    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect his property to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, theft during the nighttime or criminal mischief during the nighttime, and he reasonably believes that the property cannot be protected by any other means."
    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another to prevent the other who is fleeing after committing burglary, robbery, or theft during the nighttime, from escaping with the property and he reasonable believes that the property cannot be recovered by any other means; or, the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the property would expose him or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury. (Nighttime is defined as the period 30 minutes after sunset until 30 minutes before sunrise.)"

  23. #23
    Registered User
    bio-chem's Avatar


    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    9,176
    Rep Points
    346951410






    Quote Originally Posted by Goodfella9783 View Post
    Judge/jury whatever, both are guided by the law.

    Deadly Force in Defense of Person
    (Texas Penal Code)
    (Briggs p. 94)

    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another if he would be justified in using force under Section 9.31 of the statute when and to the degree he reasonable believes that deadly force is immediately necessary to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force, if a reasonable person in the same situation would have not retreated. The use of deadly force is also justified to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, rape or robbery."


    Deadly Force to Protect Property
    (Texas Penal Code)
    (Briggs p. 96)
    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect his property to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, theft during the nighttime or criminal mischief during the nighttime, and he reasonably believes that the property cannot be protected by any other means."
    "A person is justified in using deadly force against another to prevent the other who is fleeing after committing burglary, robbery, or theft during the nighttime, from escaping with the property and he reasonable believes that the property cannot be recovered by any other means; or, the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the property would expose him or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury. (Nighttime is defined as the period 30 minutes after sunset until 30 minutes before sunrise.)"
    judge/jury both guided by law. sure, yet one is someone schooled in the law and the other is 12 "peers" usually with little to no learning in the law.

Similar Threads

  1. Finally, someone has cleared this up.
    By jagbender in forum Anything Goes
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 09-13-2011, 10:17 PM
  2. Police Seek Suspects in YouTube Beating
    By GFR in forum Open Chat
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 02-09-2011, 06:47 PM
  3. Replies: 35
    Last Post: 09-19-2009, 07:08 PM
  4. Wash. burglary victim outwits thieves, steals van
    By Hoglander in forum Open Chat
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-15-2009, 03:36 AM
  5. PH Ban cleared for White House------>
    By Redneck in forum Supplements
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 10-12-2004, 11:07 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
DISABLED END -->