48 Hours REST!.. Can Cardio be considered as REST?

[signedup]

HI

I want to go with the below routine for November

Mon: Jogging & Walking (Cardio)
Tue: Swimming (Toning & Cardio)
Wed: Chest, Shoulders, Abs (Moderate to High wts)
Thur: Quads, Hamstrings, Calves
Fri: Swimming (Toning & Cardio)
Sat: Collar, Back & Wings, Abs
Sun: Biceps, Triceps, Forearms, Calves

I am not going to do anything more than one hour/ either weights or Cardio

Q1) Do you think I would get enuf rest for muscles
Q2) Is the Cardio considered as a Break from the weights day or is it going to do harm than help?

 

[Gazhole]

Answer - No.

Rest is rest, ie- do nothing. You REST.

Its not about letting the muscles rest, its about giving your body a chance to recuperate. Your body isnt split into body parts, it is one connected unit.

If you want to do some cardio, put it after your weight training sessions and leave some days out to rest.

As an aside, i would take a look at the stickied topics on designing a training program. This is just a split, to get any sort of useful advice you need to post the actual program.

Remember - you grow/improve outside of the gym when your body actually has energy to repair itself, not while you're in the gym.

 

[signedup]

Thanks Sir, That helps. I realize that I would have to spend good amount of time educating myself... long way to go Thanks

 

[Ben dur]

i dont completely disagree

but i do sometimes run on what i would consider a resting day
your body is not recuperating while doing cardio, but you are not breaking down muscle...
if your stay properly hydrated cardio can help volumize the cells, and flush away toxins aswell


only problem i ever had is making sure im well hydrated


but i wouldnt run on EVERY rest day...

 

[KelJu]

i dont completely disagree

but i do sometimes run on what i would consider a resting day
your body is not recuperating, but you are not breaking down muscle...

only problem is ever had is making sure im well hydrated


but i wouldnt run on EVERY rest day...

This all depends on your body. The more muscular you become, the more this becomes false. If you carry a lot of muscle, cardio can rip right through muscle gains if you run on off days.

 

[Ben dur]

shut up!

its not my fault im skinny

 

[Gazhole]

^

But naw, i think the whole issue is a bit of a gray area to be honest. I'd rather err on the side of caution.

 

[Ben dur]

depends if your bulking cutting or maint too

on a cut it isnt unusual for someone to do cardio every other or even EVERY day

bulking however one may only do cardio once a week if ever

 

[Gazhole]

I find with my own recovery ability that i really need those days off to be OFF, lol. Anything above very low intensity and very short duration fucks me over somewhat - either physically or mentally.

I know some people who can do something almost every day and still improve. Maybe theyre just better at program design, or just have faster recovery rates

 

[P-funk]

it depends on how intense the cardio is and what you are trying to achieve with it.

in general, you need to have some rest during the week though if you ever want to get anything out of your training program.

 

[Merkaba]

To get to the bottom of this, try setting your alarm clock for three hours after you go to bed, wake up and do cardio, and see if cardio feels like resting.

 

[signedup]

i always find swimming pretty relaxing for the muscles like a good water massage.. Many consider it as High Intensity cardio.. But I dont really feel a fatigue even swimming on workout days.. I read something interesting... maybe you all would like to critic it. thanks

An effective mass building AND fat loss weight lifting routine

Regarding Bulking or cutting, I want to just add on some muscle to what I lost after my one year cardio and 15 kg loss so I was thinking of a combined program and hence i asked the question.

Regards

 

[P-funk]

Regarding Bulking or cutting, I want to just add on some muscle to what I lost after my one year cardio and 15 kg loss so I was thinking of a combined program and hence i asked the question.

Regards

Not sure I fully understand what you are trying to do.....you lost weight over the past year from doing cardio. So, to combat this, you want to still do cardio?

If you goal is to increase muscle mass, then you need to:

1) lift
2) eat
3) recover
4) repeat


That simple. Were does cardio play in? A small amount of cardio can be used to:

1) maintain heart health
2) recovery between heavy sessions by promoting blood flow

Probably don't want to do much "intense" cardio as it will undoubtably burn calories needed for growth and lead to further tissue breakdown.

patrick

 

[signedup]

Patrick, Thanks for the reply. I do wish to do cardio just for maintenance. I lost 6 inches on the waist and when i attempt to put on some muscle, i do not wish to add any more inches to the waist. So I just want to do little cardio for maintenance. Whe you say tissue breakdown due to cardio, i didnt get it right. If I do swimming, would i still have a tissue breakdown? I plan to replinish any muscle glycogen loss due to swimming(30 mins only) by quick protein shakes and gatorade...

 

[P-funk]

When ever you train there is tissue breakdown. We improve when we rest. We breakdown when we train.

As far as your waist line and adding muscle mass goes....

It is impossible to add muscle without adding fat. You can't just add muscle (aside from taking pharmaceutical enhancement), so if adding size is your ultimate goal, you have to be ready for some fat gain to occur. The goal, obviously, is to limit the amount of fat gain as much as you can. One way to do this is to heavily monitor your diet (everything you put in your body) and take objective measurements (anthropometric measurements and/or skin folds being most importnat; body weight being less important). If you are gaining weight, and your measurements are staying close to the same....keep trucking. If you find yourself gaining weight and your measurements are going up, then you may have to tighten up the diet. it is a constant dance between the two. You may want to try and periodize your diet, in the same manner that we periodize our workouts. For example, it may be something like 3 weeks of hypercaloric (bulking) followed by 2 weeks of hyopcaloric (cutting).


patrick

 

[Logman]

So when is the best time to do cardio on a bulk? Say I train Monday, Wednesday, Friday after lunch. I do want to keep fit as the old ticker in men is not strong in my family and I'm worried that increased diet plus no exercise will equal 5 years off my life.

 

[signedup]

Patrick, your reply is good.. Merkaba.. this time your short reply doesnt sound serious.. you essentially saying that resting is sleeping.. man i am catching 7 hours sleep every night, i dont have to put up an alarm and do a cardio then.. i am worried of how i use the remaining 3 days of 7 days (when i am not weight training) so i rip off my body fat.....

Patrick, you are so right.. i am monitoring my intake stringently and i think muscle comes with fat... But muscle also aids in burning fat!!! So is this a vicious circle..I did my Skeletal Muscle Mass and lean Body Mass analysis at Golds gym and I have more than normal on for both, so naturally i am burning fat better..For next 2 weeks, i will be doing limited cardio (20 to 30 minutes) on the non weight training days and check the results... Only Metrics can help here...

my results as of today:

Weight 79.8 kg
Skeletal Muscle Mass: 36.7 kg
Body Fat mass: 15.3 kg (19% bodyfat)
Lean Body Mass: 64.5 kg
Total Body Water: 47.3 kg
Protein: 12.9 kg

BMI: 25.8
BMR: 1763

Conclusion: Fat control -4 kg


Cheers

 

[Ben dur]

how do you find your skeletal mass?

 

[soxmuscle]

Don't go out of your way to sit on your ass if it's a "rest day."

This is something that is way too stressed on this board IMO.

If you want to go on a low intensity jog, go for it.
If you want to toss the pig skin around, go for it.
If you want to play some horse or pig or something else that resembles doublebases wife, then by all means go for it.

Rest is fantastic and one of the three most important aspects of a productive weight training regimen, but feel free to do some low intensity excercise whenever you want.

 

[Merkaba]

Merkaba.. this time your short reply doesnt sound serious.. you essentially saying that resting is sleeping.. man i am catching 7 hours sleep every night, i dont have to put up an alarm and do a cardio then.. i am worried of how i use the remaining 3 days of 7 days (when i am not weight training) so i rip off my body fat.....

Oh my reply was as serious as asking "is doing cardio resting?"

No it wasn't serious at all. I was trying to make a point. If you didnt sleep, would it be sleeping? I can run for miles every day. Even taking a walk to the mailbox is not resting for me. Resting is resting. But I think you got that by now.

We're trying to keep you from going down the usual road of overtraining and overtaxing the body like 99 percent of every person does.

 

[Merkaba]

Don't go out of your way to sit on your ass if it's a "rest day."

This is something that is way too stressed on this board IMO.

If you want to go on a low intensity jog, go for it.
If you want to toss the pig skin around, go for it.
If you want to play some horse or pig or something else that resembles doublebases wife, then by all means go for it.

Rest is fantastic and one of the three most important aspects of a productive weight training regimen, but feel free to do some low intensity excercise whenever you want.

I disagree, with conditions:
1. If youre doing a low calorie diet while still working out hard
2. If you did something like true HIIT the day before and youre scheduled for it the next day and you bust your ass in the gym when youre there.

 

[Built]

To get to the bottom of this, try setting your alarm clock for three hours after you go to bed, wake up and do cardio, and see if cardio feels like resting.

Spongeworthy.

So when is the best time to do cardio on a bulk? Say I train Monday, Wednesday, Friday after lunch. I do want to keep fit as the old ticker in men is not strong in my family and I'm worried that increased diet plus no exercise will equal 5 years off my life.

How about this: finish your workout, then go sit on a bike or walk on a treadmill for 20 minutes while you sip your post-workout shake. The movement will help increase glucose uptake while clearing metabolites from lifting, and you'll maintain a little cardio base. If you want to bring your endurance base up in a hurry, try hill repeats. I have a nice little protocol you can do once a week for a month or so, on a non-training day. It's in my cardio article, on my blog. Just ctrl-f hill repeats.

 

[Logman]

Nice article.

So I tried this HIT business today. Ouch, were those my lungs that I just puked up.

Went for a jog. Jogged for 5 minutes then did a 20 second sprint (might have been less) then 40 seconds rest, then repeated. Did this 3 times and then called an ambulance.

But seriously, that hurts. But I'm not much of a runner at all and only just started jogging. So small steps I guess. I'll aim to up the reps by one per week and maybe do this 2 or 3 times a week. On that article that signedup posted it says to do this on off days in the early evening/late afternoon when your metabolism slows down so that's what I did. I'm also going to follow the directions on that article loosely as in eat less on non-training days and more on training days. Can't hurt I guess, heh.

 

[signedup]

"We're trying to keep you from going down the usual road of overtraining and overtaxing the body like 99 percent of every person does."

Well Merkaba: I fully take your advice on this then. I did legs today and was planning to swim a bit tomorrow.. but now I shun the idea... Let me see the benefits of rest...

I pretty much love swimming and HI Cardios as it gets me a high and energetic for the day.. So I take some earlier advice on this thread and will end my weight training with 1000 Skipping jumps and then Sleep like a log for the next rest day... Adding 10 minutes of Cardio post weight training for December then.. Let me see how that 4 kg of fat stores on my abs get used up during the cardio after the weights have burnt out glycogen stores before...

And yeah, I prefer Skipping to Jogging any time..Thats the only time the wrists really get used up like a machine...


Regards.

 

[signedup]

Ben: All the readings come from the machine. I was even wondering how the damn thing calculated my Waist to Hip ratio without even touching me....

"You cant control what you cant measure".. Lord Kelvin said once.... But I fail to measure my admiration for those curvy chicks at the gym .. Can you

 

[Merkaba]

"We're trying to keep you from going down the usual road of overtraining and overtaxing the body like 99 percent of every person does."

Well Merkaba: I fully take your advice on this then. I did legs today and was planning to swim a bit tomorrow.. but now I shun the idea... Let me see the benefits of rest...

I pretty much love swimming and HI Cardios as it gets me a high and energetic for the day.. So I take some earlier advice on this thread and will end my weight training with 1000 Skipping jumps and then Sleep like a log for the next rest day... Adding 10 minutes of Cardio post weight training for December then.. Let me see how that 4 kg of fat stores on my abs get used up during the cardio after the weights have burnt out glycogen stores before...

And yeah, I prefer Skipping to Jogging any time..Thats the only time the wrists really get used up like a machine...


Regards.

Generally, fat comes off of the body as a percentage of the whole, not from one area. I know everyone wants to "burn the fat on the abs" etc, etc, and other t.v. commercial spot reducing ideas.

Cardio doesnt equal fat burning. Creating a caloric deficit does. You don't need cardio to do this. If youre not worried about losing lean body mass and upping the chances of a pull strain or worse could lead to NO cardio or weight training, then do your cardio everyday! Hell, do it six times a day! Would you do cardio six times a day to try to get rid of your flab? Doesn't sound good huh? I like to use extremes to get the principle across. You could do it six times a day and burn all kinds of fat!

And don't worry, I won't tell anyone you go skipping for cardio!

 

[deadliftwarrior]

The strongest and best built guys are the lifters that dedicate time to work out their heart and lungs as well. When you run or do cardio of any kind, it increases the blood flow to all the muscles in your body. This not only flushes out lactic acid and broken-down proteins which make you sore, but it increases your ability to recover by sending higher volume of vitamins and new protein to the target muscle.
So yes and no- cardio is not exactly rest, but could be considered "active recovery" for the muscular system. The muscle fibers of the targeted muscle are helped to recuperate but the body as a whole loses glycogen supply and nervous energy. Which means you need to sleep well every night.

 

[Merkaba]

The strongest and best built guys are the lifters that dedicate time to work out their heart and lungs as well. When you run or do cardio of any kind, it increases the blood flow to all the muscles in your body. This not only flushes out lactic acid and broken-down proteins which make you sore, but it increases your ability to recover by sending higher volume of vitamins and new protein to the target muscle.
So yes and no- cardio is not exactly rest, but could be considered "active recovery" for the muscular system. The muscle fibers of the targeted muscle are helped to recuperate but the body as a whole loses glycogen supply and nervous energy. Which means you need to sleep well every night.

Oh I agree. I use light steady state many times when I'm sore.

All I'm saying is that its prudent to do slap nothing at least every once in a while.

 

[CowPimp]

Depends on the intensity at which you are working. Intensity is a continuum. At the low end of the spectrum is sleep. At the high end could be a variety of activities, but all carried out with a maximum intensity (Sprinting, jumping, etc.). So, there is a certain point along the continuum at which you exceed your body's recover capabilities if you exceed that on average, or on the days you are supposed to be "resting."

So, with that said, it is hard to draw the exact line to ensure adequate recovery. The only way to find out is through trial and error. People can make general suggestions about this and that relating to your recovery, but you are going to have to do some testing on yourself and be cognizant of the results.

With that said, I would include one day a week where you are not performing formal exercise beyond a leisurely walk or something that is also toward the low end of the intensity continuum. Most everyone needs at least a day, but many people need more.

 

[Built]

Nice article.

Thanks!

So I tried this HIT business today. Ouch, were those my lungs that I just puked up.

Looks like you did 'em right!

Went for a jog. Jogged for 5 minutes then did a 20 second sprint (might have been less) then 40 seconds rest, then repeated. Did this 3 times and then called an ambulance.

But seriously, that hurts. But I'm not much of a runner at all and only just started jogging. So small steps I guess. I'll aim to up the reps by one per week and maybe do this 2 or 3 times a week. On that article that signedup posted it says to do this on off days in the early evening/late afternoon when your metabolism slows down so that's what I did. I'm also going to follow the directions on that article loosely as in eat less on non-training days and more on training days. Can't hurt I guess, heh.

I'd actually suggest doing this on training days, so you get more rest on the off days. And I don't jog - I walk/sprint. There's no need to jog/sprint unless you're comfortable with it.

I find the low-high calorie days comfortable - I get more food when I'm using it, and less on the days when I'm not working up an appetite. Good luck!