Thread: Pull Push Legs

Originally Posted by TBP

Hey guys, I am new to the forums. I just finished my season and I now have the time to workout seriously. I'll be able to workout three days a week and I plan on following a pull push legs routine. My goal is to gain mass.

height: 5'11''
weight: 170

Please critique my routine. Any help is appreciated. Thanks.

Pull-
a. BB Deadlift 2-3x6-8
b. WG Pull-up 2-3x8-10
c. Bent-over BB Row 2-3x8-10
d. BB Shrug 2-3x10-12
e. EZ-bar Curl 4-6x6-8
f. Hammer Curl 4-6x8-10
Push-
a. BB Bench Press 3-4x6-8
b. Incline DB Press 3-4x8-10
c. Flat DB Fly 3-4x10-12
d. Military Press 4-6x6-8
e. Lateral Raise 4-6x8-10
f. Dips 4-6x8-10
g. Rope Pushdowns 4-6x10-12
Legs-
a. BB Squat 4-6x6-8
b. DB Lunge 4-6x10-12
c. SLDL 4-6x6-8
d. Single Leg Curl 4-6x10-12
e. Single Leg Calf Raise 4-6x10-12
f. Seated Calf Raise 4-6x10-12

If you want to get techincal, isolation movements like curls are vertical push. While you may be "pulling" the weight, when contracting the target muscle (i.e. biceps) the object is moving away from the torso in a vertical plane. Therefore, curls would be a vertical push (at least traditional curls).

Deadlifts are a leg movement. I realize a lot of people classify them as "back work" but in your case (especially since you have another deadlift variation on "legs") you should put them in your leg training.

It seems like too much volume. Performing up to 6 sets an exercise each session is a bit much.

Also, I think you have too many isolation movements. Either add a fourth day for accessory work or ditch them all together in favour of more compound lifts. You have several pec-dominant pushes but only one delt-dominant push. Why not add corner press or follow your military press with push press? Just some food for thought.

I would pick either RDLs or deadlifts, do that lift with your lower body, and scrap the remaining one. Between those two lifts, barbell squats, bent over rows, and military pressing, I feel like your spine could use a break.

A little too much pressing vs pulling. Whichever hip dominant lift you decide to keep, throw in another pulling movement on your pull day to replace it. Also, dips are not a tricep exercise. They are a compound pressing movement and should be treated as such.

Throw in a little more isolation work on your back day (Like a face pull) if you're going to be throwing in multiple isolation movements on your push day.

Why so many more sets of all the pressing movements compared to the pulling movements? Again, balance is needed here. If anything, the other way around I would consider more appropriate.

Hey, definitely a good post. because this is what most do...

How long are you in the Gym?
Your overtraining(30 minutes and off the weights my friend!)
No spam

Originally Posted by maseco63

Hey, definitely a good post. because this is what most do...

How long are you in the Gym?
Your overtraining(30 minutes and off the weights my friend!)
No spam

I foam roll for 10 minutes, static stretch for 20 minutes, active warmup for 15-20 minutes, then perform progressive warmup sets for 10-12 minutes. So, after about an hour I hit my first working set. I guess I'm overtraining.

First of all, I don't buy into the whole "you can't work out for longer than 'x' amount of minutes". Bullshit. One person can spend 3 hours in the gym and do fuck all and another could perform heavy squats, deads, rows, clean and press, and pullups in 30 minutes.

Thanks for all of the help. I went back and revised my exercise choices. I got rid of traditional deadlifts all together and I've lowered the amount of exercises I perform for each day. I tried keeping it as basic as possible. What do you think? Also, if you guys can help me with the rep and set scheme. I know someone mentioned that I may have too much volume. Thanks.

Pull-
a. Chin-up
b. Bent-over BB Row
c. BB Shrug
d. EZ-Bar Curl
Push-
a. BB Bench Press
b. Incline DB Press
c. Military Press
d. Lateral Raise
e. Skull-crusher
Legs-
a. BB Squat
b. SLDL
c. Single Leg Calf Raise
d. Hanging Leg Raise
e. Weighted Sit-up

As far as exercise selection goes it's not bad. I would add in another upper body pulling movement there; some kind of row variation. You still have to fill in the other variables though.

I'm trying to quote your updated program to make suggestions but you have all that font formatting crap in the way. I'm not attempting that. I'll just have to open a second window to look at your post

Re: PULL

Again, technically curls and shrugs are vertical pushes, but that doesn't matter.

Ditch the isolation and add one more compound for your vertical and horizontal push. One more pullup or pulldown variation and one more row.

Re: PUSH

Drop the isolation. You have two pec-dominant pushes but only one delt-dominant vertical push. Add another vertical push.

Re: LEGS

If you're doing only one calf exercise a week I'd suggest a bilateral movement so you can push heavier loads.

One more compound for push and pull. How about front squats, hack squats, lunges, bulgarian split squats etc for push and sumo deads, romanian deads, unilteral DB romanians, good mornings, rack pulls etc for pull?

I assume you're using hangling leg raises as direct ab work and not to work the hip flexors. If that' the case, make sure you curve in the torso, or else you're training only your hip flexors. Even so, I don't know that these are necessary.

Curls and shrugs are not technically vertical pushes, not unless you a supernaturally low center of mass... Furthermore, the classification of pressing and pulling movements are generally reserved for compound movements.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Curls and shrugs are not technically vertical pushes, not unless you a supernaturally low center of mass... Furthermore, the classification of pressing and pulling movements are generally reserved for compound movements.

Thanks for the clarification.

My apologies to TBP for being a douch!

The push pull and legs system is an efficient way to train. The routine you posted looks ok. You may not need to do all those sets. 1 or 2 warmups then a working set will be enough per exercise. Just make sure you give yourself enough time to recover between workouts. Get the most out of a handful of basic exercises and you can't go wrong. There's no one right way to train.
This is something I have used before:

leg-ext
Squat
leg-curl
calf raise

chins
row
deads
curl

fly
BP
Lat raise or MP
tri pull

It's up to you though. By listening to your body will determine how and when you train.

hahah no worries, sorry about the formatting crap, it doesnt show on my computer. I've added in " BB corner rows" into my pull day. Am I missing anything else now?

Ok guys, Ive moved some things around and Ive added a few things. I now have two vertical pushes for my push day, two rows for my pull day with two vertical pulls, and something for posterior delts. Are there any other suggestions? Is the exercise order fine or should I alternate between rows and vertical pulls on pull day? What rep set scheme should I be using? Thanks for all of the help.

I also wrote out the program this time so hopefully there isnt any formatting crap.

Push-

1. BB Bench Press
2. Incline DB Press
3. Military Press
4. DB Shoulder Press
5. Skull-crusher

Pull-

1. Bent-over BB Row
2. One-arm DB Row
3. Chin-up
4. Lat Pulldown
5. Face-pull
6. EZ-bar Curl

Legs-

1. BB Squat
2. Leg Press
3. SLDL
4. Leg Curl
5. Single Leg Calf Raise

Originally Posted by TBP

Ok guys, Ive moved some things around and Ive added a few things. I now have two vertical pushes for my push day, two rows for my pull day with two vertical pulls, and something for posterior delts. Are there any other suggestions? Is the exercise order fine or should I alternate between rows and vertical pulls on pull day? What rep set scheme should I be using? Thanks for all of the help.

I also wrote out the program this time so hopefully there isnt any formatting crap.

Push-

1. BB Bench Press
2. Incline DB Press
3. Military Press
4. DB Shoulder Press
5. Skull-crusher

Pull-

1. Bent-over BB Row
2. One-arm DB Row
3. Chin-up
4. Lat Pulldown
5. Face-pull
6. EZ-bar Curl

Legs-

1. BB Squat
2. Leg Press
3. SLDL
4. Leg Curl
5. Single Leg Calf Raise

Hahaha, you still have the formatting. You must have a different font selected than the default?

Anyway, I think this program looks much better

My only suggestions would be to drop the leg curls and use one more lower pull (ham/glute-dominant) compound. You have two compounds for each other plane of motion so lower pull should be balanced.

And, while you can use leg press, it'd be wiser to use another free-weight compound. Maybe something out of the rack to make setup easier and take pressure of your spine. How about DB Bulgarian Split Squats? They're intense.

If you keep the leg press, I'd suggest using the unilateral variation. It takes a lot of the stress of your lower back due to the position change it causes. I had a brief lower back problem because of a leg press. I don't use them anymroe!

Solid program. Glad to see isolation as an afterthought!

Damn, I don't know why its messed up. I switched out leg press with DB Bulgarian Split Squats (thanks for the suggestion). Do you have a suggestion for the second ham/glue exercise, how about good mornings or pullthroughs? And do you have advice about the rep set scheme? Thanks for all of the help.

Can someone please help with the rep/set scheme? Thanks.