Thread: Pyramiding?

Originally Posted by jimm

Just wondering what yous thought of pyramiding..

I dont usually do it but decided to switch up my routine the other day doing legs started low with 12-15 reps then increased the weight and decreased the reps ect.. felt great! my legs are still sore now 2 days later.. when i first started working out i would pyramid the other way on bench press id start with the heaviest i could lift then decrease the weight increase reps till i had nothing but the bar and was struggling lol.. just wondering if there is a right or wrong way? if one or the other was better for building muscle mass?

I pyramid to avoid injury. Starting out with the your max seems risky to me. Even if you warmed up. Say your max bench press is 300lbs. I would warm up with 135, then go to 185, then 225 then 275 then hit 300.

I just do warmups. Lots of warmups. Probably only one workset.

Originally Posted by Gazhole

I just do warmups. Lots of warmups. Probably only one workset.

Yeah but your workset differs from the average weight trainer.

I pyramid, always have, but I've dabbled in Mentzer's HIT and DC as well.

I like to do reverse pyramid, where I do 3-4 warmup sets then have one real work set followed by two lighter sets with the same amount of reps. I don't like doing the drop set method though.

On the last two warmups I'll only do 1-2 reps just to get acclimated to heavier weight.

Originally Posted by VolcomX311

I pyramid, always have, but I've dabbled in Mentzer's HIT and DC as well.

Nice one, im going to continue doing it as its working! definatly going to try mentzers HIT aswell been looking into it for a while now.. always good to keep things fresh i say!

Originally Posted by jimm

Nice one, im going to continue doing it as its working! definatly going to try mentzers HIT aswell been looking into it for a while now.. always good to keep things fresh i say!

Absolutely. Keeping things fresh is important for veteran lifters. The body is accustomed to the usual stimulus and the mind gets bored of the monotony of the same routine. I like to switch between higher intensity and high volume. I basically go with one until I've stopped adapting, then I move over to the other spectrum.

I've read one of Mentzer's books, he's a smart guy. I had some good success with HIT in the past as well and it can be fun pushing yourself to those levels of pain.

Pyramiding is great for me...

just depends on your age and injury history and your goals. i personally am young (25) with little to no injuries and my goal is mass building. hence i do a warm up set or two at the beginning of my workout with lots of stretching then from there its balls to the wall heavy for every set. whatever i can handle for a minimum of six reps. everyone knows to grow you got to lift heavy so i choose not to waste time or energy with pyramids. to quote the great mr olympian ronnie coleman-"everybody wants to be a bodybuilder, but aint no one want to lift no heavy ass weight." lol

Originally Posted by muscle37

just depends on your age and injury history and your goals. i personally am young (25) with little to no injuries and my goal is mass building. hence i do a warm up set or two at the beginning of my workout with lots of stretching then from there its balls to the wall heavy for every set. whatever i can handle for a minimum of six reps. everyone knows to grow you got to lift heavy so i choose not to waste time or energy with pyramids. to quote the great mr olympian ronnie coleman-"everybody wants to be a bodybuilder, but aint no one want to lift no heavy ass weight." lol

yes every one has there opinion i guess.. my goal is like every 1 on here i guess same as yours i want quality mass muscle im not into the power lifter build lol what i mean by that is theres some people in my gym who are big guys look good in a shirt but if they were to take there shirt off there is not alot of definition there theres size but no definition, and on the other hand theres big guys in there who are ripped to shreds and massive thats what im going for quality muscle. Me personally im 22 no real injurys broke my leg years ago but feels stronger then ever and far as balls to the wall heavy as you can for a min on six reps.. if you go really balls to the wall heavy u should be struggling to do 6 reps i think personally, but thats just me.. its not like i will be pyramiding for the rest of my life like i said previously keep it fresh! its working rite now tho so "if it aint broke dont fix it" and all that haha

peace bro..

Originally Posted by jimm

yes every one has there opinion i guess.. my goal is like every 1 on here i guess same as yours i want quality mass muscle im not into the power lifter build lol what i mean by that is theres some people in my gym who are big guys look good in a shirt but if they were to take there shirt off there is not alot of definition there theres size but no definition, and on the other hand theres big guys in there who are ripped to shreds and massive thats what im going for quality muscle. Me personally im 22 no real injurys broke my leg years ago but feels stronger then ever and far as balls to the wall heavy as you can for a min on six reps.. if you go really balls to the wall heavy u should be struggling to do 6 reps i think personally, but thats just me.. its not like i will be pyramiding for the rest of my life like i said previously keep it fresh! its working rite now tho so "if it aint broke dont fix it" and all that haha

peace bro..

when i first started working out years ago, i trained with this huge guy that had just got out of prison after serving 8 years. so i basically did his prison workout routine, which was badass. his motto was "six a set" so when i say balls to the wall i mea as heavy as i can go for 6 reps which pans out to be prob 75% of my max. anything less than that rep wise really isnt beneficial. now if i were powerlifting then 3 reps and maybe one on my last set would make since. i dont think that low is really condusive to growing though.

Yeah i know what your saying id say 6 a set is great for building mass definatly! just like me and volcamx311 were saying its good to switch things up tho i can guarantee ur buddy wasnt just doing six a set for the whole time he was in there.. the more you do some thing the more accustom your body gets to it, it gets bored of it because it knows whats coming so its good to switch things up and shock your body variety is key!

Originally Posted by jimm

Yeah i know what your saying id say 6 a set is great for building mass definatly! just like me and volcamx311 were saying its good to switch things up tho i can guarantee ur buddy wasnt just doing six a set for the whole time he was in there.. the more you do some thing the more accustom your body gets to it, it gets bored of it because it knows whats coming so its good to switch things up and shock your body variety is key!

Absolutely. Your body responds to stress as a form of self preservation, not because it cares to grow for aesthetics. For example, your chest grows to preserve the heart & lungs, because a heavy bench press sends the signal of stress over the thoracic region of the body and your body responds to that stress by increasing the size & strength of the pectoral muscles to make sure that it can guard your thoracic (heart & lungs) region from the potential dangers of that stress.

Muscles "maximally" responds to new stressors for self preservation, however, over time, when your body feels it has become efficient at the current levels of stress you put it through, it no longer needs to respond to such stressors as urgently. Therefore, introducing new stressors from time to time to put your body in a responsive, self preservation mode from time to time is the most effective way for continual growth.

You can certainly grow without doing this, but the key term is "maximal" growth.

I think there are more effective programs out there for people who have been training for a while
Id say that pyramiding would be more aimed at people who are not used to lifting realy heavy weights and wish to build up to it IMO. In that respect it would be usefull

Originally Posted by cshea2

I like to do reverse pyramid, where I do 3-4 warmup sets then have one real work set followed by two lighter sets with the same amount of reps. I don't like doing the drop set method though.

On the last two warmups I'll only do 1-2 reps just to get acclimated to heavier weight.

I'm confused, what you described IS the drop set method.

Originally Posted by ALBOB

I'm confused, what you described IS the drop set method.

I was under the impression that a drop set would be repping out a weight for say 10 reps, take some weight off the bar immediately rep out that weight, and just keep going down until you fully exhausted that muscle.

I guess I am dropping the weight, but I’m taking rests and the last two sets are not even remotely close to failure, these sets are just for improving my form. That one heavy work set is the only one that’s a real challenge

Originally Posted by cshea2

I was under the impression that a drop set would be repping out a weight for say 10 reps, take some weight off the bar immediately rep out that weight, and just keep going down until you fully exhausted that muscle.

I guess I am dropping the weight, but I’m taking rests and the last two sets are not even remotely close to failure, these sets are just for improving my form. That one heavy work set is the only one that’s a real challenge

Both things you described are drop sets, they're just different variations. I LOVE drop sets and have been incorporating them into my workouts for 20 years. They allow you to work the muslce more than if you stuck with a single working weight. They're GREAT!

Best gains I ever had were with pyramiding. In Physical Therapy we call it PRE's. Progressive Resistance Exercises. There is tons of research to that shows the effects of PRE's in strengthening of all levels. I use it daily with my geriatric patients. It's very effective with muscle atrophy, specially quad issues after a total knee replacement.
Probably TMI

I pyramid on all the major compound lifts. I use the following pattern

I'll just use my seated military press numbers from this morning

95X15, 135X15, 185X12, 225X10, 245X5, 205X9, 135X17

Then I just do straight sets for everything else. maybe a warm up set and then I go as heavy as I can for 8-12 and stay there or close for 3-5 sets depending on the exercise.

So is one way better than the other. ie after warm up to start at the highest weight go to failure drop weight 20lbs or so go to failure and continue to repeat all the way down to nothing reachin failure each time. break between sets only long enough to drop weight, 15 seconds or so.

Or should it be start light and pyramid up.

Im newer to lifting so bare with me. I did the first I mentioned here this past monday for most of my lifts. Seated Bench, Flys, Lat pulls, Bicep curls, Shoulder press, Etc Etc. Felt pretty bada$$ muscles felt like they were going to POP after each series of lifts.

Originally Posted by VolcomX311

For example, your chest grows to preserve the heart & lungs, because a heavy bench press sends the signal of stress over the thoracic region of the body and your body responds to that stress by increasing the size & strength of the pectoral muscles to make sure that it can guard your thoracic (heart & lungs) region from the potential dangers of that stress.

Hmm. and for the same reason and logic the triceps grows huge to protect my brain when doing scull-crusher I suppose? Must be for the same reason that triceps kick-back isnt good for building large triceps...

I do for lat pulldowns and most chest exercises.

Originally Posted by Mr Gorbag

Hmm. and for the same reason and logic the triceps grows huge to protect my brain when doing scull-crusher I suppose? Must be for the same reason that triceps kick-back isnt good for building large triceps...

Triceps exist to move your elbow joint (in conjuction with your biceps), the stress you exert on your elbow joint when performing extensions of any kind is a stressor your triceps want to protect your elbow joints against, which is the purpose of muscle hypertrophy and the recruitment of motor units within the triceps muscles for the purpose of strength in that instance.

You're right the triceps do not exist to protect an organ as the pecs and core may help to serve, but the premise that the reason muscles hypertrophy and grow in strength in order to protect the body against stressors still stands.

yep

who blew the dust of this old thread

persoanlly i still like to pyramid heavy to light i find EVERY time i start light and build up to heavy im fatiged by the time i get to my heavyest set..

gotta use what works best for you and for me i like it this way but its obviously a bit more risky with injurys ect... so if you have torn muscles or have any joint problems or any previous injurys this method is not reccomended!

I pyramid light to heavy on dead lift and following up with bent over rowing going heavy to light...