Primordialperformance.com


Muscle Soreness

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 51

Thread: Muscle Soreness

  1. #1
    Registered User

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    13
    Rep Points
    10

    Question soreness



    ahem i am rather confused... i go to the gym for about a month now.. and i have found that my body gets tired become i can get the soreness ...

    is it common ?? should i add more weights? but once i add weight i cannot lift it up my reps will go down ... what is this suppose to mean ? what is the best suggestion i should do inorder to get the sorness back ?

  2. #2
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    sounds like your body has adapted to your routine.

    There are several things you can do:

    change your routine, use different exercises, increase weight, add some techniques like super setting or forced reps.

    also, you do not always have to get sore from a work-out, there can still be progress (hypertrophy) with out soreness.

  3. #3
    Super Moderator
    SUPER MODERATOR

    Mudge's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Bay Area
    Posts
    24,268
    Rep Points
    52981667


    Almost the only times I ever get sore, are after coming off an extended layoff and overdoing it.
    Motivation Bench form Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu

    Disclaimer: All health, fitness, diet, nutrition, anabolic steroid & supplement information posted here is intended for educational and informational purposes only, and is not intended as a substitute for proper medical advice from a medical doctor. We do not condone the use of anabolic steroids (AAS), all information about AAS is for educational and entertainment purposes only. If you choose to use AAS it's your responsibility to know the laws of the country that you live in. Consult your physician or health care professional before performing any of the exercises, or following any diet, nutrition or supplement advice described on this website.

  4. #4
    The little feller

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    liverpool(u.k)
    Posts
    164
    Rep Points
    10

    i rareley get very sore any moor used to wen very first started though!

  5. #5
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Originally posted by Prince
    sounds like your body has adapted to your routine.
    Little query: Do you actually know what muscular adaption is?
    Being held down by The Man

  6. #6
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Re: soreness

    Originally posted by aurexie is it common ?? should i add more weights? but once i add weight i cannot lift it up my reps will go down ... what is this suppose to mean ? what is the best suggestion i should do inorder to get the sorness back ?
    Use progressive overload.

    Take a weight you can do 8 reps with.

    The next week aim fo more reps.

    Once you hit 12 reps with that weight, either up the weight slightly for your second set, or if you've done all your sets for the exercise, next week, up the weight.

    Reps usually go down in accordance.

    So you started with say, 200lbs for 8 reps and worked up to 12 reps.

    You then up the weight to, say, 210lbs, and your reps go down to say, 8. Work the reps up again to 12 over time (i.e. several weeks, or maybe between sessions if you're a newer lifter or on AAS).

    Repeat cycle so eventually, after a few months or a year, you'll have went from 200lbs @ 8 reps, to say, 300lbs at 8 reps. By then you'll have grown quite considerably providing adequate diet and not too much volume/frequency.
    Being held down by The Man

  7. #7
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
    Little query: Do you actually know what muscular adaption is?
    a term I have never heard... I think you mean muscular adaptation.

  8. #8
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Typo.

    Answer el questionio.
    Being held down by The Man

  9. #9
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    it's basically what the term says: the body, e.g muscles, "adapt" to training either by muscles getting larger and/or stronger...there are different types of adaptation as well.

    "Systematic training results in certain structural and physiological changes, or adaptations, in the body. The size and definition of the body's muscles indicate the level of adaptation. The magnitude of these adaptations is directly proportional to the demands placed upon the body by volume (quantity) of training, frequency of training and intensity (load) of training."

    Periodization for building muscle power and mass
    By Tudor O. Bompa, PhD & Lorenzo J. Cornacchia

  10. #10
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Originally posted by Prince
    it's basically what the term says: the body, e.g muscles, "adapt" to training either by muscles getting larger and/or stronger...there are different types of adaptation as well.

    "Systematic training results in certain structural and physiological changes, or adaptations, in the body. The size and definition of the body's muscles indicate the level of adaptation. The magnitude of these adaptations is directly proportional to the demands placed upon the body by volume (quantity) of training, frequency of training and intensity (load) of training."

    Periodization for building muscle power and mass
    By Tudor O. Bompa, PhD & Lorenzo J. Cornacchia
    Correct.

    Providing he's getting stronger and heavier (within reason), then he's growing.

    Why would he want to change it around?

    You made it sound like his routine is now fruitless and something needs to be changed.

    Where was the option for keeping doing what he's doing?
    Being held down by The Man

  11. #11
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    yeah, I guess it sounded that way.

    we really need more info to determine whether or not he needs to change anything. I was just suggesting some techinques to keep his body off balance.

    by his post it sounded like he was going in and doing the same thing for the past month and is no longer seeing/feeling any results, hell it's possible that he's just over training

    but I also said that soreness is not neceassary, many poeple judge the effectiveness of their work-outs by soreness.

  12. #12
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    He's just equating soreness with growth.

    Once he realises the correlation is thinner than it appears, he should be right.

    Just as long as he's getting bigger and stronger.
    Being held down by The Man

  13. #13
    I'm Dead Sexxxxy!!
    ELITE MEMBER

    Scotty the Body's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    4,970
    Rep Points
    3488440

    My legs have hurt like hell for two days now, I must have done something right.
    Cool

  14. #14
    Registered User

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    13
    Rep Points
    10

    ahem my rountine is 3 days a week in a gym gor estimate 1.5hrs each session.

    monday arms and shoulder

    wednesday chest and back

    friday legs

    saturday will have a judo session

    Hmmpz... thanks ... that means i should increase my number of reps for lets say i am carrying 150lbs if i can manage to do it more then 12 that for 3 times means that it is time to add more weight till i am able to lift 8 reps for 3 times? till i can reach 12 reps??

  15. #15
    2 Samuel 24:24
    ELITE MEMBER

    Rissole's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    "OZTRAILYA" :D
    Posts
    8,290
    Rep Points
    4917942

    Originally posted by aurexie
    ahem my rountine is 3 days a week in a gym gor estimate 1.5hrs each session.

    monday arms and shoulder

    wednesday chest and back

    friday legs

    saturday will have a judo session

    Hmmpz... thanks ... that means i should increase my number of reps for lets say i am carrying 150lbs if i can manage to do it more then 12 that for 3 times means that it is time to add more weight till i am able to lift 8 reps for 3 times? till i can reach 12 reps??
    Yes that is correct. Always take notes when your working out. You'll know exactly what you gotta do for each exercise so you can try and beat your last workout.
    You dont have to do 3 sets on everything though, i do 3 on my overall exercise (like for chest is bench, legs-squat) then do 2 for my other 'targeting' type exercise ( flys, d/b decline whatever)

  16. #16
    Just me, being me.

    Trap-isaurus's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    !Da' Gym! Da Gym In Canada.
    Posts
    2,450
    Rep Points
    1731845

    I have a habit of always doing four sets am I alone in this?
    *^All good things come to those who weight (lift!!!)^*

    *^I'm the thread killer
    I'm the thread killer
    I'm the come from behind
    I'm the post attacker^*




  17. #17
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Drug use supports higher volume.

    If i was only doing one or two exercises, i may do 4 sets for each.

    But for the most part, 2 sets is the norm, with 3 sets max on certain days if i fancy.
    Being held down by The Man

  18. #18
    Peak Physiques™
    ELITE MEMBER

    Twin Peak's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    7,870
    Rep Points
    1669647

    I prefer three sets for most exercises.

    Also, I agree with Rob 100% on progressively overloading the muscles, however, I prefer a 6-10 rep range rather than 8-12 for optimal musclar hypertrophy (for most people).

    Further, I think Prince's idea of "switching it up" is a valuable tool; but not until one is much more advanced does it become remotely necessary.

    Lastly, I don't think soreness is always necessary, but I still get very sore from ALMOST every good workout. I do think it is a positive indicator of future hypertrophy and a lack of soreness, IMO, is due to muscular adaptation and, likely, not training at or near failure. I am not saying you cannot grow without getting sore, I am saying that I do not believe you are growing optimally.
    Last edited by Twin Peak; 11-11-2002 at 08:38 AM.

  19. #19
    Bearded Attacker

    Freeman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Orlando, FL
    Posts
    2,667
    Rep Points
    191467

    So, to get stronger, do heavier weights, lesser reps..right? I've been using the 8-12 rep range...slowly getting stronger, although I'm still a weakling compared to most of you guys! bastards! I'll catch you some day!

    Also, I usually have to do smith-machine bench or hammer strength b/c I don't have a lift partner..this could be affecting my progress..a good lift partner can motivate you to do more, and I miss those good ol' days of lifting in high school with my buds.

  20. #20
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Originally posted by Twin Peak
    I prefer three sets for most exercises.

    Also, I agree with Rob 100% on progressively overloading the muscles, however, I prefer a 6-10 rep range rather than 8-12 for optimal musclar hypertrophy (for most people).
    Well i just used 8-12 as an example.

    I personally use 4-6 for the first set (or first two sets) and then 8-12 for the second.

    Lastly, I don't think soreness is always necessary, but I still get very sore from ALMOST every good workout. I do think it is a positive indicator of future hypertrophy and a lack of soreness, IMO, is due to muscular adaptation and, likely, not training at or near failure. I am not saying you cannot grow without getting sore, I am saying that I do not believe you are growing optimally.

    If i went into the gym and did 40 sets for every bodypart for the next 20 weeks, i'd be sore as hell. Would i be growing optimally?

    Obviously this isn't the best example, since 20 weeks of that and i'd be overtrained to hell and back so i'd not grow from that, but a person can actually grow quite nicely from a few weeks of high volume, cause when they come off it, the supercompensation can be a very anabolic environment, so i could say 40 sets for 4 weeks.

    But you get the point i'm trying to convey.
    Being held down by The Man

  21. #21
    Peak Physiques™
    ELITE MEMBER

    Twin Peak's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    7,870
    Rep Points
    1669647

    Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
    If i went into the gym and did 40 sets for every bodypart for the next 20 weeks, i'd be sore as hell. Would i be growing optimally?

    Obviously this isn't the best example, since 20 weeks of that and i'd be overtrained to hell and back so i'd not grow from that, but a person can actually grow quite nicely from a few weeks of high volume, cause when they come off it, the supercompensation can be a very anabolic environment, so i could say 40 sets for 4 weeks.

    But you get the point i'm trying to convey.
    So you have established that there is a sliding scale of hypertrophy, which I agree with.

    In other words, lets use a scale of 1-20. 1 is where you have not trained at all and thus no gains would result and there us zero soreness.

    Twenty is the worst form of overtraining humanly possible, like your first example Rob. Extreme soreness results and no hypertrophy results but rather atrophy.

    10 is the OPTIMAL workout, producing the most size gains possible.

    IMO, you are probably getting sore, if only slightly when you hit a 7 or 8. Thus, if you are not typically getting sore you are only achieving a 6, at best, falling short of your potential.

    11-13 you are getting sore, probably too sore and slightly overtraining but probably producing better results than a 6. 14 and up and you are in trouble, but yes sore.

    This is a very black and white example, but you get my point.

  22. #22
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    your example is stating that soreness is necessary for hypertrophy to occur.

  23. #23
    Peak Physiques™
    ELITE MEMBER

    Twin Peak's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    7,870
    Rep Points
    1669647

    Sorry, guess I left out that on this scale 2-6 included training that produced hypertrophy in to an escalating degree.

  24. #24
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    Hypertrophy resides under a bell-shaped curve.

    Too little and no hypertrophy.

    Too much and no hypertrophy (or atrophy is greater).

    Under the curve and you're bang on.

    Supply enough calories (and nutrients) to support the growth, but not too many to promote the growth of fat cells, and you're sorted.

    Aim to outlift your previous week's accomplishment or use techniques to damage the muscle (in a good way).

    Here's the real key:

    repeat.

    Seriously, consistancy is a severely overlooked principle.
    Being held down by The Man

  25. #25
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    If i give that a really fancy name i could make quite a bit of money.
    Being held down by The Man

  26. #26
    Peak Physiques™
    ELITE MEMBER

    Twin Peak's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    7,870
    Rep Points
    1669647

    I agree with all of that. How about the Consistent_Daddy_Principle?

    The point though, of this discussion was not whether you are under the bell curve. The curve is quite large. You can be anywhere within two standard deviations of the mean and still cause growth. The question is how do you KNOW you are dead on.

    The answer, of course, is you don't.

    But I have suggested, and still maintain, that if you are not regularly getting sore, you KNOW you are not dead on.

  27. #27
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    It's valid enough, but it's just a belief m'afraid.

    If it ever gets scientifically proven then you habe my official stamp of approval to be very smarmy and smug.
    Being held down by The Man

  28. #28
    I'm CEO, Bitch!
    ADMINISTRATOR

    Prince's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    A Virtual Reality
    Posts
    53,758
    Rep Points
    1600942420


    Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
    If i give that a really fancy name i could make quite a bit of money.
    sorry, it's posted at IM, so I now own it, thanks.

    j/k

  29. #29
    Designer Supplements

    Robboe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    5,141
    Rep Points
    3607030

    The Consistancy Theory.

    Prince, i give it to you as a gift.
    Being held down by The Man

  30. #30
    Peak Physiques™
    ELITE MEMBER

    Twin Peak's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    7,870
    Rep Points
    1669647

    Sounds like a movie. One with Julia Roberts.

    Smarmy and smug huh? Can't wait.

    I did say all along its just my opinion. Hell almost everything I say is opinion (I have never cited studies), however, like all of my opinion that I make public it is grounded in something. And here I have noticed personally that over the years I have made better gains when I have lifted with the intensity that brings soreness. Course it could be that I am a wuss and get sore at the drop of a hat.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Muscle Soreness, Help!
    By dontchaknow in forum Training
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 03-05-2008, 08:22 AM
  2. Muscle Soreness
    By BillsFan4life in forum General Health & Awareness
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-19-2006, 07:52 AM
  3. muscle soreness
    By assassin in forum Training
    Replies: 44
    Last Post: 05-19-2006, 03:30 PM
  4. Muscle Soreness...
    By Mr.T in forum Training
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 04-25-2006, 08:50 PM
  5. Muscle Soreness
    By DanK in forum Training
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 07-17-2005, 07:05 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


DISCLAIMER:
All health, fitness, diet, nutrition & supplement information presented on IronMagazineForums.com's pages is intended as an educational resource and is not intended as a substitute for proper medical advice. We do not condone the use of anabolic steroids (AAS), all information about AAS is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Consult your physician or health care professional before performing any of the exercises, or following any diet, nutrition or supplement advice described on this website. As well as any exercise technique or regimen, diet, supplement, etc., particularly if you are pregnant or nursing, or if you are elderly or have chronic or recurring medical conditions. Discontinue any exercise that causes you pain or severe discomfort and consult a medical expert. The statements made about products have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration (U.S.). They are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any condition or disease. Please consult with your own physician or health care practitioner regarding the suggestions and recommendations made at IronMagazineForums.com. Neither the author of the information, nor the producer, nor distributors of such information make any warranty of any kind in regard to the content of the information presented on this website. Except as specifically stated on this site, neither IronMagazineForums.com, nor any of its authors or other representatives will be liable for damages arising out of, or in connection with the use of this site. This is a comprehensive limitation of liability that applies to all damages of any kind, including (without limitation) compensatory, direct, indirect or consequential damages, loss of data, income or profit, loss of or damage to property and claims of third parties. Sponsors pay for advertising space, we have no affiliation with the companies that have banners displayed on our websites. Please be advised it is your responsibility to check the laws that govern your country, state, or province in regards to items offered by some companies you may read about on this site.