Thread: Those damn shoulders!!

Have you thought maybe youve been over training them? are you letting them rest enough? Given they are small muscles and wouldnt take that long to repair.

Got Built? » The Shoulders of Giants

Also, Phil, have you gained any weight over the period of time you were trying to build your delts?

Im positive I work shoulders once a week, hit my rear delts twice a week but when i do i KILL them.

Originally Posted by Built

Also, Phil, have you gained any weight over the period of time you were trying to build your delts?

I've maintained my weight, so no. But i have seen growth in other muscles. Seems like its only my shoulders that arent gettin any bigger.

I used to be in the same boat as you. I love working delts too! But saw no results from it. It was just a couple of years ago that I started to see results. About the same time I started doing dumbell shoulder presses. This year, I started doing military presses and it added more mass to them. Prior to these, I was just doing all machine presses and lots of lateral raises.

People comment on my shoulders more than anything. Here is my routine..

Smith military 3x10
DB military 3x10
front raise 3x10
side raise 3x10
rear delt 3x10
shrugs 3x10

So you gained muscle but no weight?
Heavy chest and back work and eating. If you're not geared up or blessed with crazy genetics you're going to fall into the category of the folks that do a ton of shoulder work but no growth. Probably do back and chest what twice a week? Tons of sholder work. So your shoulders could be over trained. I know that word gets over used but it's true for the shoulders quite often. Then people are eating at a maintenance, like you I assume, or even at a slight deficit. Then wonder why they get no growth. What are your stats and how many calories are you eating?

^ this.

Military Press and more Military Press. Once I stopped going to failure I began to see results. I usually leave one or 2 in the tank for each set.

upright rows and military press are great for shoulder size. I don't really do any other front/side delt exercises.

A friend recently showed me a very interesting exercise for upper back/traps/rear delts that i've been doing at the beginning of every workout. I'm not sure what it's called but I never see people doing it and it seems to hit really well. You hold a bar behind your back(don't put any weight on it), stand up straight and arc your arm up behind you, meanwhile squeezing your shoulderblades together, and then stretching them apart on the way down. It's been working wonders on my upper back and rear delts. A tough one to get used to but when you do it's awesome.

COS, I'm glad you don't have any problems with them, but I hesitate to recommend upright rows to anyone. There are other exercises which are far more effective, without the potential for RC damage via loaded external rotation. Powercleans/clean and jerk are excellent mass builders for traps and shoulders (and forearms), and if you haven't tried them yet, so are Olympic barbell corner presses. I've linked a pic of that movement in the shoulder article I posted above.

I personally only train shoulders/traps 1x/week.

It is very important to hit all 3 heads when you train delts, front, medial, and rear. Simply doing presses will not help you build cannon ball delts.

I recommend hitting your weakest/most lacking delt head first in your workout so you can give it your all while you have the energy.

My routine for delts:

-Seated DB press
-Standing Military Press or Arnhold Press for speed activation (2 sets max)
-Bent over rear delt cable flyes RP'd (first exercise in video below)
-Seated lateral db raise
-Standing lateral cable raise RP'd
-front db raises (palms up)
-DB shrugs
-Upright Row


Video:

One thing that I can not overstate is this. Don't sacrifice form just to push heavier weight. Wether it's on your mass building excercises like your military press. Or your isolations like laterals. Too many beginners get into the mind set of lifting ad heavy as they can and form goes to shit. Keep your form tight. It's even more important for your trouble muscles

Originally Posted by ezsway

Military Press and more Military Press. Once I stopped going to failure I began to see results. I usually leave one or 2 in the tank for each set.

This works wonders! I think you're doing too much delt work in your routine.

Originally Posted by nugget13

I personally only train shoulders/traps 1x/week.

It is very important to hit all 3 heads when you train delts, front, medial, and rear. Simply doing presses will not help you build cannon ball delts.

I recommend hitting your weakest/most lacking delt head first in your workout so you can give it your all while you have the energy.

My routine for delts:

-Seated DB press
-Standing Military Press or Arnhold Press for speed activation (2 sets max)
-Bent over rear delt cable flyes RP'd (first exercise in video below)
-Seated lateral db raise
-Standing lateral cable raise RP'd
-front db raises (palms up)
-DB shrugs
-Upright Row


Video:

You look thick as a brick, but to be fair, an unassisted athlete probably shouldn't train this way. Shoulders have a lot of androgen receptors - it's the main reason why men have more meat in their delts than women. Add more androgen and they respond like crazy - and can totally handle the extra volume with one a week training like you do. Unassisted lifters often find they do better with more frequency, but less volume in each session.

My .02

btw rear delts get hit nicely with rows, and the front heads get hit with any and all pressing movements so these definitely "count" as part of your shoulder training.

Originally Posted by Built

You look thick as a brick, but to be fair, an unassisted athlete probably shouldn't train this way. Shoulders have a lot of androgen receptors - it's the main reason why men have more meat in their delts than women. Add more androgen and they respond like crazy - and can totally handle the extra volume with one a week training like you do. Unassisted lifters often find they do better with more frequency, but less volume in each session.

My .02

btw rear delts get hit nicely with rows, and the front heads get hit with any and all pressing movements so these definitely "count" as part of your shoulder training.

haha that's not me, i wish I was that size. perhaps in a few years.

Ah, then if you're unassisted, you may wish to revisit your strategy.

I f you can handle em, BNP is the best mass builder, supersetted with high rep, good form laterals.