Developing the mind/muscle connection---at home

Dante B. · 12-17-2003, 05:13 AM

I once posted this on another board, but to save time I'll cut and paste it. I can expand this as need be:

Most people just think "up and down," instead of "fire and contract," when they're doing an exercise/rep.

It's something you can do at home as well. For instance, sit down as though you were at the bottom position of an ass-to-the-grass squat. Now, lightly flex your quads in two second bursts. Then, fire your hips in the same manner, and then your hams, and then your calves.

Learn to consciously activate them in a stretched position.
It's almost stupid and pointless to learn how to flex from a contracted position, alone. Then again, most lifters display a unwavering devotion to the thoughtless and pointless.

Eventually, train your body to fire all the involved muscles in unison--light bursts, followed by brief but intense contractions.

This is far beyond the mere flexing of a muscle, which is incredibly myopic and pathetically misses the mark. And there's more, but that's something I will reveal at some later point.
-----

And when you're at the gym, you can learn to visualize the muscle(s) being trained, being able to consciously active them.

plouffe · 12-17-2003, 05:42 AM

Yeah alot of people I know move weight just to move weight. Until you're able to isolate that muscle group and learn to squeeze it - You aren't going to get the gains your looking for.

**Jodi** · 12-17-2003, 08:46 AM

Nice post Dante

ponyboy · 12-17-2003, 09:36 AM

Good post Dante - this is probably the biggest hurdle with new clients, getting them to really feel the muscles they are supposed to be firing. Sometimes even just using touch you can cue their body to reat properly.

Flex · 12-17-2003, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by plouffe
Yeah alot of people I know move weight just to move weight. Until you're able to isolate that muscle group and learn to squeeze it - You aren't going to get the gains your looking for.

right on bro

i try to preach that to everyone i know that BB's, but they don't wanna hear it. its "their way" or the "highway". and they wonder why i have such a better physique.......

BUSTINOUT · 12-17-2003, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ponyboy
Good post Dante - this is probably the biggest hurdle with new clients, getting them to really feel the muscles they are supposed to be firing. Sometimes even just using touch you can cue their body to reat properly.

This is a problem for new and old alike. Even after years of lifting and then long layoff, it takes a while to relearn. Thank God it comes back quickly. That has got to be one of the most frustrating feelings...to not feel "connected".

Downtown Guy · 12-17-2003, 07:03 PM

Dante, you be almost intelligent man! I'm impressed with your understanding of how the weightlifting/bodybuilding world works and how it don't work.

Again, you are "spot on" with this thread, even if it is a little more detail oriented than your some of your other "generalist" theories. I am constantly amazed and dismayed when I see a personal trainer having a conversation with a client while the client is moving a weight. Dat client don't be feeling nuthin'! Don't even know which muscle SHOULD be workin'! And he be paying big bucks to da trainer. How do dat make sense?

Dante B. · 12-18-2003, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Flex
right on bro

i try to preach that to everyone i know that BB's, but they don't wanna hear it. its "their way" or the "highway". and they wonder why i have such a better physique.......

Most lifters are too "hardcore" to actually think about what they're doing.

Grunting, and throwing around a large amount of weight, doesn't mean you have a single ****ing clue in hell as to what you're doing.

Think of lifting as active meditation; if you do, you will come across many revelations on your own, many of which having applications that extend well beyond the moment, and the gym.

Visualization is key.

Quote:

I am constantly amazed and dismayed when I see a personal trainer having a conversation with a client while the client is moving a weight. Dat client don't be feeling nuthin'! Don't even know which muscle SHOULD be workin'

Certainly.

When I'm lifting, and even after I'm done, I enter an almost trance-like state. I don't want anyone to talk to me, I don't wish to speak, and I'm lost in my own little world. I also use that time to rearrange my state of perception, speaking of applications beyond the gym.

Unfortunately, most prefer to take the "hardcore"---read mindless--approach. Mind you, I'm not some New Agey skinny geek, either. Well, I am a geek, but that's beside the point. If I'm going to do something--anything, I'm going to milk it for all it's worth.

Downtown Guy · 12-18-2003, 08:06 PM

I feel you, Dante. Just like I feel my muscles working. "Active meditation" - good description of the sensation.

Dante B. · 12-28-2003, 02:17 PM

I posted this on another board, in response to 'what music do you lift to,' but it works in quite well here, as well.

To briefly touch upon several points:

The trick isn't knowing where to look for inspiration--speaking in general, and specifically for this discussion as well---but rather, knowing how to create it through filters and channels.

When I lift, I listen to the shit for music that's slapping my ears through the gym speakers. Actually, I don't listen to it, and that's the key. Music should serve as a guide, rather than a replacement for thought and inspiration. So you have to choose your weapons wisely, and if you learn to control your body and your mind---especially for lifting purposes---music should allow you to silently slip into another state of consciousness.

And when you're forced to listen to something you'd rather not listen to, or be around and hear people you'd rather not be around while lending an ear to their prattle, you have to learn to filter and channel it.

Note that I didn't say merely to drown it out. You have to create an active state of channeling whereby all outside influences become a new source of energy. More important than creating a conditioned response, is creating a general process of thought that lends itself to adaptability.

For example, if a certain work of music has always allowed you to lift with greater intensity, but in an instant is taken away, then you have to learn how to adapt by manipulating the output into visualized desired input.

In my (AL) journal, someone stated how it was "gay" to use the visualization techniques that I do; for he, had an 'intimate relationship with the weights.'

For anyone who thinks or lifts along these lines, where you allow too many outside influences to act upon you, instead of allowing them to impact you in accordance to your will:

There's no doubt that you're having an 'intimate relationship,' as you're doing nothing more than fucking around.

After I complete the article I'm working on, perhaps I'll do a training article along these lines. I thought of calling it----Jacked Magic: Incantations and Construction Rituals

katie64 · 12-28-2003, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dante B.
I posted this on another board, in response to 'what music do you lift to,' but it works in quite well here, as well.

To briefly touch upon several points:

The trick isn't knowing where to look for inspiration--speaking in general, and specifically for this discussion as well---but rather, knowing how to create it through filters and channels.

When I lift, I listen to the shit for music that's slapping my ears through the gym speakers. Actually, I don't listen to it, and that's the key. Music should serve as a guide, rather than a replacement for thought and inspiration. So you have to choose your weapons wisely, and if you learn to control your body and your mind---especially for lifting purposes---music should allow you to silently slip into another state of consciousness.

And when you're forced to listen to something you'd rather not listen to, or be around and hear people you'd rather not be around while lending an ear to their prattle, you have to learn to filter and channel it.

Note that I didn't say merely to drown it out. You have to create an active state of channeling whereby all outside influences become a new source of energy. More important than creating a conditioned response, is creating a general process of thought that lends itself to adaptability.

For example, if a certain work of music has always allowed you to lift with greater intensity, but in an instant is taken away, then you have to learn how to adapt by manipulating the output into visualized desired input.

In my (AL) journal, someone stated how it was "gay" to use the visualization techniques that I do; for he, had an 'intimate relationship with the weights.'

For anyone who thinks or lifts along these lines, where you allow too many outside influences to act upon you, instead of allowing them to impact you in accordance to your will:

There's no doubt that you're having an 'intimate relationship,' as you're doing nothing more than fucking around.

After I complete the article I'm working on, perhaps I'll do a training article along these lines. I thought of calling it----Jacked Magic: Incantations and Construction Rituals

Very nice Dante, I'm sure the new article will be great, good title too...............your interesting

**Mudge** · 12-28-2003, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dante B.
In my (AL) journal, someone stated how it was "gay" to use the visualization techniques that I do; for he, had an 'intimate relationship with the weights.'

I wonder if Trevor Smith is "gay" for practicing Zen. I wonder how many "gay" guys can incline press a raw 765 for reps anyway.

Dante B. · 12-29-2003, 01:29 PM

Too many people have the meathead mentality, even women, where they want to blindly work their way through everything, giving little thought to the matter.

"I don't think, I just do."

"I just deal with it."

And so on. Of course, even with "experience," few people ever walk away from their circumstances knowing anything more than that which they entered the situation with-----which is almost always little to nothing.

And as they give little true thought to the matter, they become bricks without mortar. That of course is what separates common knowledge from common sense, and why too many people live and think in compartments; the essence of compartmentalization:

Building a house that isn't far removed from one of Picasso's works.

**Mudge** · 12-29-2003, 02:43 PM

If nothing else, its great that they "know it all" and have the connection, but how about the rest of us/those who dont.

Dante B. · 12-29-2003, 03:07 PM

Well, and not only that, but everything can always be improved.
Too many people rely on what they have, instead of what they could have.

Visualization as it relates to emotional, thought and physical processing has many applications.

True magic rituals have been unfortunately perverted by the frauds, but I'm working on developing a new theory/system of magic and philosophy.

**Mudge** · 12-29-2003, 04:04 PM

I was into that a little when I was in high school, I am a bit more skeptical now, but I suppose it depends what you actually think of as being "magik," where it comes from and what its purpose is.

Dante B. · 12-29-2003, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mudge
but I suppose it depends what you actually think of as being "magik," where it comes from and what its purpose is.

Exactly.

What people consider "magic," is nothing more than nonsense. I'm not talking about the "white" or "black" arts, or fairies and wizards.

12-17-2003, 05:13 AM	#1
Dante B. Non Compost Mentis Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Phoenix Posts: 598 Photos: 8	Developing the mind/muscle connection---at home BODYBUILDING SUPPLEMENTS High Quality Supplements For Bodybuilders and Athletes. www.ironmaglabs.com I once posted this on another board, but to save time I'll cut and paste it. I can expand this as need be: Most people just think "up and down," instead of "fire and contract," when they're doing an exercise/rep. It's something you can do at home as well. For instance, sit down as though you were at the bottom position of an ass-to-the-grass squat. Now, lightly flex your quads in two second bursts. Then, fire your hips in the same manner, and then your hams, and then your calves. Learn to consciously activate them in a stretched position. It's almost stupid and pointless to learn how to flex from a contracted position, alone. Then again, most lifters display a unwavering devotion to the thoughtless and pointless. Eventually, train your body to fire all the involved muscles in unison--light bursts, followed by brief but intense contractions. This is far beyond the mere flexing of a muscle, which is incredibly myopic and pathetically misses the mark. And there's more, but that's something I will reveal at some later point. ----- And when you're at the gym, you can learn to visualize the muscle(s) being trained, being able to consciously active them.
	Not to see many things, not to hear many things, not to permit many things to come close - first imperative of prudence, first proof that one is no mere accident but a necessity. Friedrich Nietzsche - Ecce Homo

12-17-2003, 05:42 AM	#2
plouffe is bulking Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,786 Photos: 6	Yeah alot of people I know move weight just to move weight. Until you're able to isolate that muscle group and learn to squeeze it - You aren't going to get the gains your looking for.
	These are my favorite faces : - - - Personal Bests: Bench - 235 Deadlift - 315 X 17 Squat - 315 X 11 40 yrd. - 4.65

12-17-2003, 08:46 AM	#3
Jodi Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 22,180 Photos: 1	Nice post Dante
	Essence EFA

12-17-2003, 09:36 AM	#4
ponyboy Training Trainer Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Running around somewhere Posts: 2,608 Photos: 1	Good post Dante - this is probably the biggest hurdle with new clients, getting them to really feel the muscles they are supposed to be firing. Sometimes even just using touch you can cue their body to reat properly.
	Today I can do what others will not so that tomorrow I will do what others cannot. The difference between winners and losers is that winners do things that losers don't want to do.

12-28-2003, 02:17 PM	#10
Dante B. Non Compost Mentis Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Phoenix Posts: 598 Photos: 8	I posted this on another board, in response to 'what music do you lift to,' but it works in quite well here, as well. To briefly touch upon several points: The trick isn't knowing where to look for inspiration--speaking in general, and specifically for this discussion as well---but rather, knowing how to create it through filters and channels. When I lift, I listen to the shit for music that's slapping my ears through the gym speakers. Actually, I don't listen to it, and that's the key. Music should serve as a guide, rather than a replacement for thought and inspiration. So you have to choose your weapons wisely, and if you learn to control your body and your mind---especially for lifting purposes---music should allow you to silently slip into another state of consciousness. And when you're forced to listen to something you'd rather not listen to, or be around and hear people you'd rather not be around while lending an ear to their prattle, you have to learn to filter and channel it. Note that I didn't say merely to drown it out. You have to create an active state of channeling whereby all outside influences become a new source of energy. More important than creating a conditioned response, is creating a general process of thought that lends itself to adaptability. For example, if a certain work of music has always allowed you to lift with greater intensity, but in an instant is taken away, then you have to learn how to adapt by manipulating the output into visualized desired input. In my (AL) journal, someone stated how it was "gay" to use the visualization techniques that I do; for he, had an 'intimate relationship with the weights.' For anyone who thinks or lifts along these lines, where you allow too many outside influences to act upon you, instead of allowing them to impact you in accordance to your will: There's no doubt that you're having an 'intimate relationship,' as you're doing nothing more than fucking around. After I complete the article I'm working on, perhaps I'll do a training article along these lines. I thought of calling it----Jacked Magic: Incantations and Construction Rituals
	Not to see many things, not to hear many things, not to permit many things to come close - first imperative of prudence, first proof that one is no mere accident but a necessity. Friedrich Nietzsche - Ecce Homo

12-17-2003, 07:03 PM	#7
Downtown Guy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Kentucky Posts: 121	Dante, you be almost intelligent man! I'm impressed with your understanding of how the weightlifting/bodybuilding world works and how it don't work. Again, you are "spot on" with this thread, even if it is a little more detail oriented than your some of your other "generalist" theories. I am constantly amazed and dismayed when I see a personal trainer having a conversation with a client while the client is moving a weight. Dat client don't be feeling nuthin'! Don't even know which muscle SHOULD be workin'! And he be paying big bucks to da trainer. How do dat make sense?

12-18-2003, 08:06 PM	#9
Downtown Guy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Kentucky Posts: 121	I feel you, Dante. Just like I feel my muscles working. "Active meditation" - good description of the sensation.

12-29-2003, 01:29 PM	#13
Dante B. Non Compost Mentis Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Phoenix Posts: 598 Photos: 8	Too many people have the meathead mentality, even women, where they want to blindly work their way through everything, giving little thought to the matter. "I don't think, I just do." "I just deal with it." And so on. Of course, even with "experience," few people ever walk away from their circumstances knowing anything more than that which they entered the situation with-----which is almost always little to nothing. And as they give little true thought to the matter, they become bricks without mortar. That of course is what separates common knowledge from common sense, and why too many people live and think in compartments; the essence of compartmentalization: Building a house that isn't far removed from one of Picasso's works.
	Not to see many things, not to hear many things, not to permit many things to come close - first imperative of prudence, first proof that one is no mere accident but a necessity. Friedrich Nietzsche - Ecce Homo

12-29-2003, 02:43 PM	#14
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 22,966 Photos: 1	If nothing else, its great that they "know it all" and have the connection, but how about the rest of us/those who dont.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

12-29-2003, 03:07 PM	#15
Dante B. Non Compost Mentis Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Phoenix Posts: 598 Photos: 8	Well, and not only that, but everything can always be improved. Too many people rely on what they have, instead of what they could have. Visualization as it relates to emotional, thought and physical processing has many applications. True magic rituals have been unfortunately perverted by the frauds, but I'm working on developing a new theory/system of magic and philosophy.
	Not to see many things, not to hear many things, not to permit many things to come close - first imperative of prudence, first proof that one is no mere accident but a necessity. Friedrich Nietzsche - Ecce Homo

12-29-2003, 04:04 PM	#16
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 22,966 Photos: 1	I was into that a little when I was in high school, I am a bit more skeptical now, but I suppose it depends what you actually think of as being "magik," where it comes from and what its purpose is.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

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