Range of Motion Exercises: Overrated?

zakk · 02-11-2004, 10:38 AM

Too many people are doing this at my gym to think its a fluke. So I'll ask.

at least 20% of the people at my neighborhood gym are doing these 2-4" range of motion exercises. They do them on the machines and free weights. A lot of the time they are so out of control the whole body is gyrating.

Example: Old guy puts some weight on the bench. He lifts it off the rack. puts it back down....twice. And of course there is the obligatory screaming so everyone knows he is lifting.

Different guy using the machine pull down. The weight is pulling him off the seat and I'm not sure if he's even pulling the weight down at all, or if its inertia.

So, am I missing the next big thing here? Is this a "power" move I'm not privy to?

**Prince** · 02-11-2004, 10:48 AM

I do not see the point of ever doing so much weight that you cannot get in at least 4 solid reps, no cheating, good form... the only exception would be a powerlifting routine.

Using weight that is too heavy for at least 4 reps not only is it ineffective for hypertrophy, it puts you at great risk for an injury.

ponyboy · 02-11-2004, 11:08 AM

Agreed. These people are only hurting themselves but it's probably going to take blowing a joint for them to realize that.

The only reason you should not to full ROM is if your joints are already hypermobile and stretched out too far.

DrChiro · 02-11-2004, 12:20 PM

It is a concept known as Power Factor Training...developed by sisco and little.
I tried it for a while and it is a bunch of crap if you use it as your only method of training...you MUST take the muscle through its full ROM in order to stimulate it fully.
Partial reps used to get past a sticking point are excellent and are used by many powerlifters...the problem with partial ROM is that you only become strong in that small ROM..not good for devloping overall muscle growth and definition...plus you look like a dumbass doing it!

JohnnyDgo · 02-12-2004, 11:03 AM

I followed Sisco's PFT program for 8 months. I think I was stronger b4 that 8 months. Was constantly tired. Moving 500 lbs only half a foot on a leg press didn't do much accept make me look like an a$$. Which reminds me .... sorry if anyone actually seen me at those pathetic attempts at strength gains.

iron jock · 02-12-2004, 02:58 PM

Sounds like a good way to get hurt or killed to me, the damn bar could fall on you neck if your muslce give out. If you can't lift the damn weight safely than don't do it at all. I always try to get 7 rep in each set or till the form goes to hell.

OmarJackson · 02-13-2004, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JohnnyDgo
I followed Sisco's PFT program for 8 months. I think I was stronger b4 that 8 months. Was constantly tired. Moving 500 lbs only half a foot on a leg press didn't do much accept make me look like an a$$. Which reminds me .... sorry if anyone actually seen me at those pathetic attempts at strength gains.

LMAO!

powerfactor training has to be the biggest bunch of crap ever written.

brodus · 02-13-2004, 03:49 PM

People in my gym do that too.

I'm convinced that they do it to look cool w/ that much weight.

I think a person looks a lot "cooler" totally dominating an excercise in both control and form, like a machine.

I agree, anything less than 4 reps is asking for injury or death if there's no spotter.

neanderthal · 02-13-2004, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by brodus
I agree, anything less than 4 reps is asking for injury or death if there's no spotter.

I remember reading an article in my local newspaper a long time ago, it must of been about 5 years ago. Anyway, a guy was benching and he was the only one in the gym at the time. He must of failed on a rep or let the weight get out of control or something because somehow the bar ended up on his throat and it choked him to death.

brodus · 02-13-2004, 04:12 PM

Ooooo....that is a nightmare of mine...especially when I lived in the country and worked out alone.

Once I got stuck on bench and couldn't get the bar off my chest. I had to roll the bar down my chest to get it to a point where I could sit up. It was so heacy that I was afriad I would fracture my hip, since i had no bodyfat at the time. It then smashed my balls and decided I would never lift alone again!

The total ghetto solution is to lift without collars and do a tipsy/turvey if you get stuck, but that's dangerous, loud, and stupid too. (I may have actually done this as a teenager when I was only benching 80 pounds)

I'm also afraid of using some of the cheaper weight benches out there. I bought one on sale, and that thing was so rickity, I thought for sure it was going to collapse. There should be regulations on those.

brodus · 02-13-2004, 04:20 PM

Can you imagine getting f'd like that while squatting and being crushed to the ground by like 400 pounds, snapping your knees...oooo....I will never lift alone!

neanderthal · 02-13-2004, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by brodus
Once I got stuck on bench and couldn't get the bar off my chest. I had to roll the bar down my chest to get it to a point where I could sit up. It was so heacy that I was afriad I would fracture my hip, since i had no bodyfat at the time. It then smashed my balls and decided I would never lift alone again!

The total ghetto solution is to lift without collars and do a tipsy/turvey if you get stuck, but that's dangerous, loud, and stupid too. (I may have actually done this as a teenager when I was only benching 80 pounds)

i have done both of these things too when i would train alone in my basement back in the day.

brodus · 02-13-2004, 04:38 PM

We are lucky to be alive!

**Mudge** · 02-13-2004, 05:47 PM

Plateau breakers yes, strength in a certain range of motion yes, a complete routine hell no.

02-11-2004, 10:38 AM	#1
zakk Right 20 cut to straight Elite Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 92	Range of Motion Exercises: Overrated? Too many people are doing this at my gym to think its a fluke. So I'll ask. at least 20% of the people at my neighborhood gym are doing these 2-4" range of motion exercises. They do them on the machines and free weights. A lot of the time they are so out of control the whole body is gyrating. Example: Old guy puts some weight on the bench. He lifts it off the rack. puts it back down....twice. And of course there is the obligatory screaming so everyone knows he is lifting. Different guy using the machine pull down. The weight is pulling him off the seat and I'm not sure if he's even pulling the weight down at all, or if its inertia. So, am I missing the next big thing here? Is this a "power" move I'm not privy to?
	-zakk 7-21-03: 353 lbs. 2-7-04: 264 lbs. 3-6-04: 258 lbs. 4-6-04: 250 lbs. 5-2-04: 242 lbs. 9-1-04: 225 lbs. Headed south

02-11-2004, 10:48 AM	#2
Prince the one & only Administrator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Colorado Posts: 33,721 Blog Entries: 25 Photos: 320	I do not see the point of ever doing so much weight that you cannot get in at least 4 solid reps, no cheating, good form... the only exception would be a powerlifting routine. Using weight that is too heavy for at least 4 reps not only is it ineffective for hypertrophy, it puts you at great risk for an injury.
	SBMuscle.com - Discount Supplement Superstore AlltheWhey.com - Bulk Protein Powders CEM Products - Research Chemicals & Supplements MusclePharm - Complete Nutritional Arsenal BigBackGrips - If you lift weights you've got to try these grips! HumaneVoLabs - Foaming Transdermal Delivery System.

02-11-2004, 11:08 AM	#3
ponyboy Training Trainer Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Running around somewhere Posts: 2,608 Photos: 1	Agreed. These people are only hurting themselves but it's probably going to take blowing a joint for them to realize that. The only reason you should not to full ROM is if your joints are already hypermobile and stretched out too far.
	Today I can do what others will not so that tomorrow I will do what others cannot. The difference between winners and losers is that winners do things that losers don't want to do.

02-11-2004, 12:20 PM	#4
DrChiro addicted to the crack Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: houston, tx Posts: 798	It is a concept known as Power Factor Training...developed by sisco and little. I tried it for a while and it is a bunch of crap if you use it as your only method of training...you MUST take the muscle through its full ROM in order to stimulate it fully. Partial reps used to get past a sticking point are excellent and are used by many powerlifters...the problem with partial ROM is that you only become strong in that small ROM..not good for devloping overall muscle growth and definition...plus you look like a dumbass doing it!
	My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right. When one door closes another door opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully upon the closed door that we do not see the ones which open for us.

02-12-2004, 02:58 PM	#6
iron jock Time to get Brutal Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Canada, Alberta Posts: 134	Sounds like a good way to get hurt or killed to me, the damn bar could fall on you neck if your muslce give out. If you can't lift the damn weight safely than don't do it at all. I always try to get 7 rep in each set or till the form goes to hell.
	Put Up or Shut Up

02-12-2004, 11:03 AM	#5
JohnnyDgo Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Illinois Posts: 6	I followed Sisco's PFT program for 8 months. I think I was stronger b4 that 8 months. Was constantly tired. Moving 500 lbs only half a foot on a leg press didn't do much accept make me look like an a$$. Which reminds me .... sorry if anyone actually seen me at those pathetic attempts at strength gains.

02-13-2004, 03:49 PM	#8
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	People in my gym do that too. I'm convinced that they do it to look cool w/ that much weight. I think a person looks a lot "cooler" totally dominating an excercise in both control and form, like a machine. I agree, anything less than 4 reps is asking for injury or death if there's no spotter.
	Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

02-13-2004, 04:12 PM	#10
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	Ooooo....that is a nightmare of mine...especially when I lived in the country and worked out alone. Once I got stuck on bench and couldn't get the bar off my chest. I had to roll the bar down my chest to get it to a point where I could sit up. It was so heacy that I was afriad I would fracture my hip, since i had no bodyfat at the time. It then smashed my balls and decided I would never lift alone again! The total ghetto solution is to lift without collars and do a tipsy/turvey if you get stuck, but that's dangerous, loud, and stupid too. (I may have actually done this as a teenager when I was only benching 80 pounds) I'm also afraid of using some of the cheaper weight benches out there. I bought one on sale, and that thing was so rickity, I thought for sure it was going to collapse. There should be regulations on those.
	Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

02-13-2004, 04:20 PM	#11
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	Can you imagine getting f'd like that while squatting and being crushed to the ground by like 400 pounds, snapping your knees...oooo....I will never lift alone!
	Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

02-13-2004, 04:38 PM	#13
brodus Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 945	We are lucky to be alive!
	Graham Cousens Band My Space http://www.flymantell.com http://www.bifunkal.com http://www.livebandkaraokechicago.com http://www.worldclassnoise.com

02-13-2004, 05:47 PM	#14
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,027 Photos: 1	Plateau breakers yes, strength in a certain range of motion yes, a complete routine hell no.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

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