Train traps twice a week?

cpa55 · 05-07-2004, 09:34 PM

I have been thru Gopros routine once, took my week off and am half way thru the second cycle. My traps and legs are lagging behind compared to everything else. Is it counterproductive to train traps twice a week? My legs are improving, I just had farther to go with them. Very pleased with the increases everywhere else though.
Thanks for any input.

**CowPimp** · 05-08-2004, 10:54 AM

I say try it and see what happens. If what you are doing currently isn't working for you, then you can always try something new. If it still doesn't work, then keep trying stuff until it does; that is really all you can do.

Johnnny · 05-08-2004, 06:14 PM

It depends on how much you're doing once a week.

I do 2 exercises 4 sets each totaling 8 sets total for traps & that's plenty.

But again it depends on how much you're doing right now. In my opinion traps, forearms & calves are the hardest muscle groups to develop size/strength to so you have to hit them hard when you do train them.

**CowPimp** · 05-09-2004, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Johnnny
In my opinion traps, forearms & calves are the hardest muscle groups to develop size/strength to so you have to hit them hard when you do train them.

I disagree. Genetics determine what muscles are hard to develop for different people. I actually have halfway decent calves, and I only do 2 sets of direct calf work. Another friend of mine has freakish forearms, but he does no direct forearm work at all.

Johnnny · 05-09-2004, 08:41 AM

Sorry, but I still disagree. Even ppl with good genetics have to train just as hard. It's like if you take steroids & don't train, you won't get results.

I know one guy who played football with me. He used to train his calves 4 or 5 times a week. They got very huge & bulging & lean for a natural person & they were very small before. He started out by training them once or twice a week for the longest time. They didn't really grow much, so he started training them 4 or 5 times a week & they got huge like I said they are without drugs or supplements.

2 guys I know with big traps had to work hard. One guy only trained them once a week & they got pretty big & he already had traps to begin with. The other friend had absolutely no traps what so ever. He trained his traps 3 times a week & they got even bigger than the guy who only trained his already big traps once a week.

Point being, hard work will pay off. Ppl will probably say I have no credibility & blah blah blah. I'm just giving a few examples of ppl I know.

As for genetics, I still disagree. I don't have good genetics at all & I've been training for almost 10yrs. By 22yrs old I was about 227lbs with descent definition with a 34inch waist & was benching 320lbs for 4 reps & looking to add more weight before my hyper thyroid problem was caused by the ephedrine/ephedra supplements with no prior thyroid problem. I'm getting back there & currently weigh 215lbs with a 34 inch waist & descent definition benching 275 for 7 reps & I don't even take supplements.

Hard work & proper diet will give results that's the bottom line.

**CowPimp** · 05-09-2004, 11:34 AM

I'm not saying that good genetics equal good results without hard work. You misunderstood. I was responding to your statement that said cavles, forearms, and traps are the hardest body parts to develop. I said that genetics determine what body parts are the hardest for someone to develop; I didn't mean that genetics are going to allow those body parts to get big without hard work.

Some people don't need to directly train any of those body parts, because they get peripheral work from other exercises. Any exercise where you grip a bar works your forearms. Almost any freeweight leg exercise hits the calves a little bit as a stabilizer if nothing else. Also, various compound exercises hit up the traps; particularly various shoulder/back exercises. Most people aren't so lucky, but some are.

Johnnny · 05-09-2004, 06:22 PM

But if you directly target these muscles with hard work they will develop that much more as opposed to just being hit a little bit with calves or back exercises.

If someone said to you I don't need to train my shoulders because I do alot of deadlifts, wouldn't you tell them they're lazy & they won't grow?

Premo55 · 05-09-2004, 10:09 PM

Uh, I don't do any direct arm work, and I'm pretty happy with my arms. Your suggestion that training the same body part 3 times a week is better than training that body part once a week. While this MAY BE TRUE if you know how train a body part multiple times a week PROPERLY, genetics do ultimately determine what a muscle looks like/the ease with which it is developed.

I know guy with phenomenal traps who just do heavy deadlifting, cleans and snatches. I mean, explain why powerlifters are so damn thick and they NEVER do any direct work. Your argument is far from as bulletproof as you believe.

Training more doesn't mean better results. If that were true, then we wouldn't have guys who believe in HIT or HST.

Peace.

Johnnny · 05-09-2004, 10:51 PM

For one those huge power lifters are on massive ammounts of steroids, so every muscle on them grows pretty easily with minimal effort as the steroids will develop traps from deadlifts.

I never said that training more is better. I just believe in training every muscle once a week & hitting it hard when you do train that muscle. I do forearms, calves & traps with isolation movements as well as deadlifts & cleans.

**Mudge** · 05-09-2004, 11:09 PM

My traps have gotten a lot stronger doing even a single set of deadlifts per week, but I dont seem to get size without direct work.

KataMaStEr · 05-10-2004, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Johnnny
For one those huge power lifters are on massive ammounts of steroids, so every muscle on them grows pretty easily with minimal effort as the steroids will develop traps from deadlifts.

Minimal effort? You’re kidding right. Taking steroids don’t mean your muscles magically get huge without doing anything. Most of those guys will leave the majority of us in the dust when it comes to training intensity.

**Mudge** · 05-10-2004, 12:19 AM

Yeah minimal effort my ass

I'm guessing this quote came from someone who wouldn't know better, it doesn't mean you dont have to go to the gym or work hard. Quite often not only is the eating heavier, but so is the training, to make use of the increased anabolic ability of the athlete in question. I dont screw off when I hit the gym nor do I just "work less" because of magical supplements.

Premo55 · 05-10-2004, 01:16 AM

Johnnny, I'd like to see you try a powerlifter workout and try to match their intensity.

Steroids is not the magical answer to more mass, it's like you're saying ROnnie Coleman didn't have to work as hard to get where he is, or Mike Mentzner, etc....

What if I told you that I PERSONALLY KNOW POWERLIFTERS who are thicker than anyone I have ever seen in person and are completely natural? PLUS, their training volume is probably a quarter of ours as bodybuilders/people seeking hypertrophy, yet their body fat % is in the single digits and they look phenomenal?

Peace.

Johnnny · 05-10-2004, 08:18 AM

Did I ever say I was a powerlifter? No.

What is this a competition all of a sudden? Did I ever say those guys don't have to work hard? NO I didn't.

What I said was their secondary muscles such as traps, forearms, calves, side & rear delts grow when they are training hard with say barbell curls, delt lifts & lots of rowing for back & lots of military pressing along with the help of massive steroids to get to their size. I bet before their 1st injection some of them were 6ft3 or whatever & only wieghted 220lbs. & the amounts of food they eat is incredible.

You all have misunderstood completely. I didn't say they don't have to train hard, eat a lot or take lots of drugs.

But I've met & had the chance to talk to a few powerlifters & ask them about their drug use, training routines & diets. I talked to a guy who 5ft7 200lbs in good condition bench presses about 680lbs maximum & another power lifter who was around 6ft4 300lbs & his max bench was just over 700lbs.

Both these guys told me their drug use, training & diet habits. First they use a lot of drugs, their eating is they eat around 8 meals a day every 2hrs, & their training is very hard but mostly involves compound movements such as bench/incline bench, squats, deadlifts & lots of rowing, military presses, lots of barbell curls using the 45lb bar. They told me they don't waist time on side lateral raises very much or forearms. Also that their traps grow from all the back exercises they do & don't do isolation movements. This is one of the reasons why many of them are just huge & thick without a lot of shape. Although I see some powerlifters today who have good shape with their size.

But this is the point I was making. They don't need to spend as much time on secondary muscles as they grown on their own with their diet, training & drug use.

**Mudge** · 05-10-2004, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Johnnny
But this is the point I was making. They don't need to spend as much time on secondary muscles as they grown on their own with their diet, training & drug use.

The largest bodybuilders have always had powerlifting backgrounds, they dont lack shape, most of them simply carry a good load of fat and/or only specialize in one or two movements where a bodybuilder does it all.

Does Ronnie lack shape? No but he doesn't look picture perfect either.

I think if you are getting by doing wussy lifts then you are going to have to accept your wussy body.

LAM · 05-10-2004, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mudge
The largest bodybuilders have always had powerlifting backgrounds, they dont lack shape, most of them simply carry a good load of fat and/or only specialize in one or two movements where a bodybuilder does it all.

it is always easy to tell the bodybuilders who don't have a background in powerlifting. they are the ones who look good from the front and rear but disappear when they turn sideways as they lack true thickness in their muscles...

Johnnny · 05-10-2004, 11:33 AM

The point is that the power lifters spend most of their time on compound movements that build mass, power & strength. They don't spend much time on secondary muscles that I mentioned above as they grow anyway with their training, diet & drugs.

There are some power lifters like Manfred Hoeberl who have great shape & sometimes mistaken for a bodybuilder. Before his car accident when he was still doing World's strongest Man competitions he was saying that he constantly had to correct ppl that he wasn't a bodybuilder because of his great condition with his mass compared to most powerlifters. Here is his website:

http://hoback.ncsa.uiuc.edu/~prajlic..._noframes.html

05-07-2004, 09:34 PM	#1
cpa55 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: alabama Posts: 50	Train traps twice a week? I have been thru Gopros routine once, took my week off and am half way thru the second cycle. My traps and legs are lagging behind compared to everything else. Is it counterproductive to train traps twice a week? My legs are improving, I just had farther to go with them. Very pleased with the increases everywhere else though. Thanks for any input.

05-08-2004, 10:54 AM	#2
CowPimp Fueled by Testosterone Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 15,428	I say try it and see what happens. If what you are doing currently isn't working for you, then you can always try something new. If it still doesn't work, then keep trying stuff until it does; that is really all you can do.
	The only time it's bad to feel the burn is when you're peeing... CowPimp Picks Up Heavy Shit MySpace YouTube Videos

05-09-2004, 11:34 AM	#6
CowPimp Fueled by Testosterone Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 15,428	I'm not saying that good genetics equal good results without hard work. You misunderstood. I was responding to your statement that said cavles, forearms, and traps are the hardest body parts to develop. I said that genetics determine what body parts are the hardest for someone to develop; I didn't mean that genetics are going to allow those body parts to get big without hard work. Some people don't need to directly train any of those body parts, because they get peripheral work from other exercises. Any exercise where you grip a bar works your forearms. Almost any freeweight leg exercise hits the calves a little bit as a stabilizer if nothing else. Also, various compound exercises hit up the traps; particularly various shoulder/back exercises. Most people aren't so lucky, but some are.
	The only time it's bad to feel the burn is when you're peeing... CowPimp Picks Up Heavy Shit MySpace YouTube Videos

05-09-2004, 10:09 PM	#8
Premo55 Mic Murderer Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 1,059	Uh, I don't do any direct arm work, and I'm pretty happy with my arms. Your suggestion that training the same body part 3 times a week is better than training that body part once a week. While this MAY BE TRUE if you know how train a body part multiple times a week PROPERLY, genetics do ultimately determine what a muscle looks like/the ease with which it is developed. I know guy with phenomenal traps who just do heavy deadlifting, cleans and snatches. I mean, explain why powerlifters are so damn thick and they NEVER do any direct work. Your argument is far from as bulletproof as you believe. Training more doesn't mean better results. If that were true, then we wouldn't have guys who believe in HIT or HST. Peace.
	T DOT O.

05-09-2004, 11:09 PM	#10
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	My traps have gotten a lot stronger doing even a single set of deadlifts per week, but I dont seem to get size without direct work.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

05-08-2004, 06:14 PM	#3
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	It depends on how much you're doing once a week. I do 2 exercises 4 sets each totaling 8 sets total for traps & that's plenty. But again it depends on how much you're doing right now. In my opinion traps, forearms & calves are the hardest muscle groups to develop size/strength to so you have to hit them hard when you do train them.

05-09-2004, 08:41 AM	#5
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Sorry, but I still disagree. Even ppl with good genetics have to train just as hard. It's like if you take steroids & don't train, you won't get results. I know one guy who played football with me. He used to train his calves 4 or 5 times a week. They got very huge & bulging & lean for a natural person & they were very small before. He started out by training them once or twice a week for the longest time. They didn't really grow much, so he started training them 4 or 5 times a week & they got huge like I said they are without drugs or supplements. 2 guys I know with big traps had to work hard. One guy only trained them once a week & they got pretty big & he already had traps to begin with. The other friend had absolutely no traps what so ever. He trained his traps 3 times a week & they got even bigger than the guy who only trained his already big traps once a week. Point being, hard work will pay off. Ppl will probably say I have no credibility & blah blah blah. I'm just giving a few examples of ppl I know. As for genetics, I still disagree. I don't have good genetics at all & I've been training for almost 10yrs. By 22yrs old I was about 227lbs with descent definition with a 34inch waist & was benching 320lbs for 4 reps & looking to add more weight before my hyper thyroid problem was caused by the ephedrine/ephedra supplements with no prior thyroid problem. I'm getting back there & currently weigh 215lbs with a 34 inch waist & descent definition benching 275 for 7 reps & I don't even take supplements. Hard work & proper diet will give results that's the bottom line.

05-09-2004, 06:22 PM	#7
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	But if you directly target these muscles with hard work they will develop that much more as opposed to just being hit a little bit with calves or back exercises. If someone said to you I don't need to train my shoulders because I do alot of deadlifts, wouldn't you tell them they're lazy & they won't grow?

05-09-2004, 10:51 PM	#9
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	For one those huge power lifters are on massive ammounts of steroids, so every muscle on them grows pretty easily with minimal effort as the steroids will develop traps from deadlifts. I never said that training more is better. I just believe in training every muscle once a week & hitting it hard when you do train that muscle. I do forearms, calves & traps with isolation movements as well as deadlifts & cleans.

05-10-2004, 12:19 AM	#12
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	Yeah minimal effort my ass I'm guessing this quote came from someone who wouldn't know better, it doesn't mean you dont have to go to the gym or work hard. Quite often not only is the eating heavier, but so is the training, to make use of the increased anabolic ability of the athlete in question. I dont screw off when I hit the gym nor do I just "work less" because of magical supplements.

05-10-2004, 01:16 AM	#13
Premo55 Mic Murderer Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 1,059	Johnnny, I'd like to see you try a powerlifter workout and try to match their intensity. Steroids is not the magical answer to more mass, it's like you're saying ROnnie Coleman didn't have to work as hard to get where he is, or Mike Mentzner, etc.... What if I told you that I PERSONALLY KNOW POWERLIFTERS who are thicker than anyone I have ever seen in person and are completely natural? PLUS, their training volume is probably a quarter of ours as bodybuilders/people seeking hypertrophy, yet their body fat % is in the single digits and they look phenomenal? Peace.
	T DOT O.

05-10-2004, 08:18 AM	#14
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Did I ever say I was a powerlifter? No. What is this a competition all of a sudden? Did I ever say those guys don't have to work hard? NO I didn't. What I said was their secondary muscles such as traps, forearms, calves, side & rear delts grow when they are training hard with say barbell curls, delt lifts & lots of rowing for back & lots of military pressing along with the help of massive steroids to get to their size. I bet before their 1st injection some of them were 6ft3 or whatever & only wieghted 220lbs. & the amounts of food they eat is incredible. You all have misunderstood completely. I didn't say they don't have to train hard, eat a lot or take lots of drugs. But I've met & had the chance to talk to a few powerlifters & ask them about their drug use, training routines & diets. I talked to a guy who 5ft7 200lbs in good condition bench presses about 680lbs maximum & another power lifter who was around 6ft4 300lbs & his max bench was just over 700lbs. Both these guys told me their drug use, training & diet habits. First they use a lot of drugs, their eating is they eat around 8 meals a day every 2hrs, & their training is very hard but mostly involves compound movements such as bench/incline bench, squats, deadlifts & lots of rowing, military presses, lots of barbell curls using the 45lb bar. They told me they don't waist time on side lateral raises very much or forearms. Also that their traps grow from all the back exercises they do & don't do isolation movements. This is one of the reasons why many of them are just huge & thick without a lot of shape. Although I see some powerlifters today who have good shape with their size. But this is the point I was making. They don't need to spend as much time on secondary muscles as they grown on their own with their diet, training & drug use.

05-10-2004, 11:33 AM	#17
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	The point is that the power lifters spend most of their time on compound movements that build mass, power & strength. They don't spend much time on secondary muscles that I mentioned above as they grow anyway with their training, diet & drugs. There are some power lifters like Manfred Hoeberl who have great shape & sometimes mistaken for a bodybuilder. Before his car accident when he was still doing World's strongest Man competitions he was saying that he constantly had to correct ppl that he wasn't a bodybuilder because of his great condition with his mass compared to most powerlifters. Here is his website: http://hoback.ncsa.uiuc.edu/~prajlic..._noframes.html

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