Super setting Biceps & Triceps provides amazing growth

**Mudge** · 05-29-2004, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaim91

What does that mean?

Pinks and blues are not found in every gym. They are 1 and 3 pounds or something like that. Pumped or not doesn't mean you are getting an effective workout, a lot of powerlifters will not experience bodybuilder-like pumps MOST of the time, yet they still grow just fine.

Johnnny · 05-29-2004, 01:24 PM

Mudge, it's possible, but for me if I don't get pumped in my back if it's back day or my chest on chest or biceps on bi day & so on I don't find I grow that well or get stronger.

**Mudge** · 05-29-2004, 01:28 PM

It has nothing to do with pump, if your body responds to a certain rep range thats another story completely unrelated. I dont like going very heavy on chest, unless I kept my sets very very low, I end up losing strength. So I get great chest pump because I start out at ~10 reps for my opening work set.

Johnnny · 05-29-2004, 02:01 PM

Mudge

So it is your opinion that getting the muscle pumped isn't important?

What if it's a guy who doest hit it that hard when he trains, never gets pumped & doesn't gain in size or strength? I had a friend like this & realized he wasn't training hard enough each work out. He started training harder & he was always getting pumped & from then on he started growing in size & strength without steroids.

**CowPimp** · 05-29-2004, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Mudge

So it is your opinion that getting the muscle pumped isn't important?

What if it's a guy who doest hit it that hard when he trains, never gets pumped & doesn't gain in size or strength? I had a friend like this & realized he wasn't training hard enough each work out. He started training harder & he was always getting pumped & from then on he started growing in size & strength without steroids.

Well, just because one person doesn't get the pump, and then they change their workout and they do get the pump and experience better gains, doesn't mean that pump definitely leads to better gains. You will get the best pump of your life if you do endurance type exercises. However, as we all know, endurance rep ranges don't lead to much hypertrophy and/or strength gains.

Johnnny · 05-29-2004, 05:28 PM

CowPimp

I use the 2-8 rep range or the 10-15 rep range if I'm trying to get leaner.

But either way with the 2-8 rep range or the 10-15rep range, I always do about 16mins of 15second sprints inlcine, decline & regular level set on the tredmill at a sprint speed for incline 7.5mph, decline 12mph, flat level 10mph.

**Mudge** · 05-29-2004, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

What if it's a guy who doest hit it that hard when he trains, never gets pumped & doesn't gain in size or strength?

Then his training or diet does not fit his bodytype. There is a book with a title something along the lines of "Training by Your Bloodtype." There are some articles here about training based on fiber type. I do not believe at all there there is some single answer that one can give to something like "I dont get pumped and I dont make gains." If it were THAT easy then a lot more people would be in better shape because there would be an ABC chart out there to getting 'buff.'

It takes time to find what works for you.

jaim91 · 05-29-2004, 07:05 PM

I'd say it is important to get the pump because that's a huge motivator. So, when you get it, it makes you want to conitnue, and do more.

**CowPimp** · 05-30-2004, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaim91

I'd say it is important to get the pump because that's a huge motivator. So, when you get it, it makes you want to conitnue, and do more.

This may be true. However, that still doesn't mean that getting the pump has any correlation to your workout being as effective as it could be scientifically speaking.

Johnnny · 05-30-2004, 07:24 PM

I still think getting the "pump" is still very important.

**CowPimp** · 05-30-2004, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

I still think getting the "pump" is still very important.

It may be one of many useful barometers to tell whether or not your workout was as effective as it could be. However, I wouldn't use the pump to determine whether or not a workout is effective for you in and of itself.

jaim91 · 05-31-2004, 05:34 AM

That's true pimp...

**Mudge** · 05-31-2004, 01:03 PM

If I sit down and bench 335x3 I wont get as much pump as 225x20, but I would much rather do 3 reps than 20. I'm not in the gym to get pumped and put my hands all over myself feeling how pumped I am.

Johnnny · 05-31-2004, 07:11 PM

Mudge

Quote:

If I sit down and bench 335x3 I wont get as much pump as 225x20, but I would much rather do 3 reps than 20. I'm not in the gym to get pumped and put my hands all over myself feeling how pumped I am.

When I was able to bench 320lbs for 4 reps my chest did get pumped, & then when I would lower the weight & work down to 225 or 205lbs my pecs would get amazingly pumped. If you're thinking I spend my time feeling myself up on how pumped I got, I don't.

Cowpimp

Quote:

It may be one of many useful barometers to tell whether or not your workout was as effective as it could be. However, I wouldn't use the pump to determine whether or not a workout is effective for you in and of itself.

If when I don't check to see if I got pumped or not, I always get really pumped from every set I do whether it's a weight for 4 reps, or a weight for 15 reps. I always get the "pump".

jaim91 · 06-01-2004, 05:25 AM

You also get "the pump" if you do your reps quickly...

nikegurl · 06-01-2004, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

CowPimp

I use the 2-8 rep range or the 10-15 rep range if I'm trying to get leaner.

Using higher reps when you are cutting is a myth. Higher reps don't get you lean - diet does. If anything dieting is the time it's most important to continue to train heavy so you hang onto as much muscle as possible.

Novo · 06-01-2004, 02:26 PM

NG, silly - high reps, low reps, whatever ... it's all about the PUMP (apparently?!)

Now, get back here in the kitchen with me where we belong, hush woman ....

**gopro** · 06-01-2004, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudge

I'm not in the gym to get pumped and put my hands all over myself feeling how pumped I am.

You're not? Hmmm, I better rethink this whole thing...

Saturday Fever · 06-01-2004, 02:50 PM

And here I thought Mudge thoroughly enjoyed feeling himself.

V Player · 06-01-2004, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikegurl

If anything dieting is the time it's most important to continue to train heavy so you hang onto as much muscle as possible.

That makes about the best sense I have ever heard on this issue. Glad I decided to read this thread. Im going to have to seriously re-think my cutting cycle that starts in 2 weeks.

Johnnny · 06-05-2004, 10:43 AM

Nikegirl

I know that you think the 10-15 or more rep range with a weight that you can do that many reps to get leaner & tighter is a myth. But I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I've been only doing one set with a really heavy weight in the 2-4 rep range with everything else being in the 8-15 or more rep range. In just a couple of weeks I find myself getting much tighter than when doing everything in the 2-4 rep range. When I do everything in the 2-4 rep range I get bulky. Like you guys say, you have to find what works for your body depending on what you want.

**Prince** · 06-05-2004, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Nikegirl

I know that you think the 10-15 or more rep range with a weight that you can do that many reps to get leaner & tighter is a myth. But I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I've been only doing one set with a really heavy weight in the 2-4 rep range with everything else being in the 8-15 or more rep range. In just a couple of weeks I find myself getting much tighter than when doing everything in the 2-4 rep range. When I do everything in the 2-4 rep range I get bulky. Like you guys say, you have to find what works for your body depending on what you want.

you'd better go take a physiology class, and learn about hypertrophy.

**Mudge** · 06-05-2004, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saturday Fever

And here I thought Mudge thoroughly enjoyed feeling himself.

To some degree yes, but I love the feeling of filling out my sweaty shirt more than anything else I guess. I'm there to work out though, not look in the mirror and think I've reached my goals, but I swear every summer lifter seems to think in 2 weeks they have reached some huge goal judging by the way they look in the mirror and walk around.

We've got guys that work out with the little weights in limited ranges of motion and get up from the bench/squat area and scream.

Johnnny · 06-05-2004, 04:17 PM

Robert DiMaggio

You always promote telling us to find out what works for our bodies depending on what our goals are.

Are you telling me my results from this change are not real?

I haven't changed my diet at all. Nor have I changed my cardio. I still do 15mins of intervals on the treadmill with sprints.

With this said, I've in just 3 weeks or so managed to get my body tighter than when I was training with 2-4 reps on every excersize with every set.

With all of this said, in your professional opinion how come I've managed to get tighter training with a minimum of 10 reps or more of each set for every exercise, for every muscle instead of very heavy with the 2-4 rep range on every exercise for every set without changing my diet or my cardio?

Like I said I haven't changed my cardio or my diet which is always clean & getting enough complex carbs & protein, fruit/vegetables & water.

All I did change was my training. I used weights that I could do 10-15 reps with.

I'm taking your advice from the past about finding out what works for us individually depending on what our goals are physique wise. & now my goals physique wise is to get really tight & hard. What I've done the last month has been working much more to help me achieve my goals.

I'm going to stick with this method for the next while as it's providing me with good results & hopefully I'll be getting pictures up sooner than I planned.

**CowPimp** · 06-05-2004, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Robert DiMaggio
With this said, I've in just 3 weeks or so managed to get my body tighter than when I was training with 2-4 reps on every excersize with every set.

If you have really been training as long as you said you have, then I doubt you will have noticed any perceptable difference in your physique in 3 weeks. As well, I think you are just telling yourself you got tighter, therefore you believe it is true. The word psychosomatic comes to mind, but it is usually used in the context of disease or illness.

JLB001 · 06-05-2004, 05:35 PM

More blah blah blah....

05-29-2004, 01:28 PM	#93
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	It has nothing to do with pump, if your body responds to a certain rep range thats another story completely unrelated. I dont like going very heavy on chest, unless I kept my sets very very low, I end up losing strength. So I get great chest pump because I start out at ~10 reps for my opening work set.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

05-31-2004, 01:03 PM	#103
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	If I sit down and bench 335x3 I wont get as much pump as 225x20, but I would much rather do 3 reps than 20. I'm not in the gym to get pumped and put my hands all over myself feeling how pumped I am.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

06-01-2004, 02:50 PM	#109
Saturday Fever Pimp Gimp Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: California Posts: 2,142 Photos: 4	And here I thought Mudge thoroughly enjoyed feeling himself.
	yay.

06-05-2004, 05:35 PM	#116
JLB001 I see YOU!! Elite Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 8,293 Photos: 5	More blah blah blah....
	"When you get to the end of your rope, tie a knot in it and hang on."

05-29-2004, 01:24 PM	#92
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Mudge, it's possible, but for me if I don't get pumped in my back if it's back day or my chest on chest or biceps on bi day & so on I don't find I grow that well or get stronger.

05-29-2004, 02:01 PM	#94
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Mudge So it is your opinion that getting the muscle pumped isn't important? What if it's a guy who doest hit it that hard when he trains, never gets pumped & doesn't gain in size or strength? I had a friend like this & realized he wasn't training hard enough each work out. He started training harder & he was always getting pumped & from then on he started growing in size & strength without steroids.

05-29-2004, 05:28 PM	#96
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	CowPimp I use the 2-8 rep range or the 10-15 rep range if I'm trying to get leaner. But either way with the 2-8 rep range or the 10-15rep range, I always do about 16mins of 15second sprints inlcine, decline & regular level set on the tredmill at a sprint speed for incline 7.5mph, decline 12mph, flat level 10mph.

05-29-2004, 07:05 PM	#98
jaim91 Ms. Olympia Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,484 Photos: 16	I'd say it is important to get the pump because that's a huge motivator. So, when you get it, it makes you want to conitnue, and do more.

05-30-2004, 07:24 PM	#100
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	I still think getting the "pump" is still very important.

05-31-2004, 05:34 AM	#102
jaim91 Ms. Olympia Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,484 Photos: 16	That's true pimp...

06-01-2004, 05:25 AM	#105
jaim91 Ms. Olympia Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,484 Photos: 16	You also get "the pump" if you do your reps quickly...

06-01-2004, 02:26 PM	#107
Novo Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Australia Posts: 220	NG, silly - high reps, low reps, whatever ... it's all about the PUMP (apparently?!) Now, get back here in the kitchen with me where we belong, hush woman ....

06-05-2004, 10:43 AM	#111
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Nikegirl I know that you think the 10-15 or more rep range with a weight that you can do that many reps to get leaner & tighter is a myth. But I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I've been only doing one set with a really heavy weight in the 2-4 rep range with everything else being in the 8-15 or more rep range. In just a couple of weeks I find myself getting much tighter than when doing everything in the 2-4 rep range. When I do everything in the 2-4 rep range I get bulky. Like you guys say, you have to find what works for your body depending on what you want.

06-05-2004, 04:17 PM	#114
Johnnny Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,844	Robert DiMaggio You always promote telling us to find out what works for our bodies depending on what our goals are. Are you telling me my results from this change are not real? I haven't changed my diet at all. Nor have I changed my cardio. I still do 15mins of intervals on the treadmill with sprints. With this said, I've in just 3 weeks or so managed to get my body tighter than when I was training with 2-4 reps on every excersize with every set. With all of this said, in your professional opinion how come I've managed to get tighter training with a minimum of 10 reps or more of each set for every exercise, for every muscle instead of very heavy with the 2-4 rep range on every exercise for every set without changing my diet or my cardio? Like I said I haven't changed my cardio or my diet which is always clean & getting enough complex carbs & protein, fruit/vegetables & water. All I did change was my training. I used weights that I could do 10-15 reps with. I'm taking your advice from the past about finding out what works for us individually depending on what our goals are physique wise. & now my goals physique wise is to get really tight & hard. What I've done the last month has been working much more to help me achieve my goals. I'm going to stick with this method for the next while as it's providing me with good results & hopefully I'll be getting pictures up sooner than I planned.