bigger or stronger?

rangers97 · 11-08-2004, 01:45 PM

We know there are different "types" of training for strength and size. So the question is, would you rather be the "big" guy who looks intimidating and is heavier and therefore harder to knock over, who is strong but not as strong as his size would lead you to believe, or would you rather be the "smaller" guy, the guy who doesn't look intimidating at all, his shirts are loose, not tight around his arm, but trains with low reps and when he hits you, he surprises you with his strength?

I only ask since I play hockey and I happen to consider myself the "smaller" type guy, at 5'10 190pounds. I kind of actually feel small sometimes, I dont think I look very intimidating at all, and people always try to come after me when we play, but when I decide enoughs enough, I often find myself destroying people with checks or pushes, or stuff. I throw people down sometimes with one arm, I KNOW for a fact they didn't expect it.

Only thing is, when you are smaller, you get knocked down too, just because you are strong doesn't mean you are heavy, lol, so I find myself on the receiving end a lot too, it's just that when i am on the giving side, I find I give a lot harder than I receive, lol.....

your thoughts?

sabre81 · 11-08-2004, 02:08 PM

im with you. im 6'1 200. I consider myself smaller i suppose, since many of my friends are more bulky, however i got them beat in the strength department. My goal is actually to get to 215-220 so im not sure if ill be considered small then.

shiek49 · 11-08-2004, 02:08 PM

I'm an average size and used to tend to get into "disagreements" in high school/college. I try to stay away from any trouble now days. That being said... I'd rather be the guy that looks big and not as strong. I don't care how much I can lift as long as I look good.... you know, for the ladies.

Duncans Donuts · 11-08-2004, 02:12 PM

I'd rather be strong, fast, and big.

sabre81 · 11-08-2004, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncans Donuts

I'd rather be strong, fast, and big.

i second that

Duncans Donuts · 11-08-2004, 02:20 PM

KarlW · 11-08-2004, 02:27 PM

I never see the **BIG** guys (you know the bulky-ish types) do Pull Ups. The guys I see doing them well are the skinnier (but heaps strong for their size) types.

Karl

Duncans Donuts · 11-08-2004, 02:30 PM

pullups are harder when you weigh more

**Mudge** · 11-08-2004, 02:33 PM

Strength is great but you also need bodyweight to stand your ground, Newton's law would apply here.

Bigger stronger faster leaner sexier, how about all of those, and make me 23 again while your at it.

Saturday Fever · 11-08-2004, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudge

Strength is great but you also need bodyweight to stand your ground, Newton's law would apply here.

Newton's first law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newton

An object at rest tends to stay at rest and an object in motion tends to stay in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

Accompanied by his second law in this context:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newton

The acceleration of an object as produced by a net force is directly proportional to the magnitude of the net force, in the same direction as the net force, and inversely proportional to the mass of the object.

Saturday Fever · 11-08-2004, 02:46 PM

But let's face it, if you eat right and lift, you're going to get big. But you have to train specifically for strength. So why not train for strength and eat for size and enjoy both benefits?

shutupntra1n · 11-08-2004, 02:49 PM

Bigger 4 me

Who cares what I can lift as long as I look like I can lift a lot

shutupntra1n · 11-08-2004, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncans Donuts

pullups are harder when you weigh more

This stinks for me

chris mason · 11-08-2004, 03:04 PM

As Duncan Donuts said I would like to be a combination of both.

MaxMirkin · 11-08-2004, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutupntra1n

Bigger 4 me

Who cares what I can lift as long as I look like I can lift a lot

Wouldn't strength be very important to a police officer?

DOMS · 11-08-2004, 03:38 PM

No, that's what the gun is for.

Squaggleboggin · 11-08-2004, 04:38 PM

I'm on the bigger side (for my age at least) and I do like not having to deal with people (for the most part they just leave me alone). While I'm not weak, I'd rather be very strong and a little smaller than bigger and weak. After all, when it comes down to it, if you were in a fight would you want to look tough and get beaten or look normal and do the beating?

shutupntra1n · 11-08-2004, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cfs3

No, that's what the gun is for.

easton · 11-08-2004, 04:46 PM

as a short guy, id rather be stronger... if i get too large id look just as stupid as the people i have laughed at in the past for being strangely out of proportion :/

wtfzor · 11-08-2004, 06:21 PM

nobody wants to be small and weak.

Quote:

pullups

It's called strength-to-weight ratio

X-Cop · 11-08-2004, 10:32 PM

Bigger. For the fact that my size may prevent someone from trying to fight me while I arrest them.

It seems like the some of the smaller cops I work with have the most Obstruction cases.

**Mudge** · 11-08-2004, 10:57 PM

Yep, and that was the reasoning behind a height rule in the old days until a certain group of peoples had it overturned as being racist.

*It should be noted I am not racist.

**Mudge** · 11-08-2004, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saturday Fever

Newton's first law.
Accompanied by his second law in this context:

Thank you Dr.Mudge, err Newton.

rangers97 · 11-09-2004, 08:18 AM

what is really happening to your body when you lift heavy weights? What is a set of 4 going to do for you as opposed to a set of 8? and dont say make you stronger, lol that is a given.
I mean what goes on inside? when doing a higher rep workout, typically what they call the size rep range, your cells are becoming bigger, but they dont exert as much force? When you do the strength rep range, your muscles are not getting as large per say, they are getting harder or denser, and able to produce more force? Is that right? but that force is very finite is it not? Since there is no endurance in the muscle? You will be able to pick something very heavy up, but you will only be able to hold it for a short amount of time before you get tired, whereas, maybe the guy who trains with 8-10 reps can hold something somewhat lighter but for a longer period of time?

so this begs the question....how often will you "use" all this strength that you train for? Personally, I would have to say it is an ego/personal accomplishment thing, unless you need it for a specific reason like sports or something like that. In my day to day life, why do I need to be strong? I think more people will be looking at me as opposed to me using my strength, so maybe it would be better for the average person to look better than to be stronger, you know you may need that strength, but maybe once or twice a week you do something where you need to be strong, whereas people look at you every day.....hmmm interesting point

**Mudge** · 11-09-2004, 09:14 AM

Endurance for me still goes up with training heavy, i.e. if one week I decide to go light I can do the same amount of reps with a given weight that will corellate to my max on the max chart.

A lot of strength training is simply training the body to be forced to use a larger percentage of your muscle fibers at a given time, since for self preservation (safety and energy conservation) it will want to use the least muscle percentage it can. THIS is at least one reason why many animals that are abnormally strong or fast lose energy rapidly and tire out.

rangers97 · 11-09-2004, 09:37 AM

very interesting Mudge......so by training heavy I am training my body to use more of the muscle fibres that I have as opposed to "size" training which just increases the size of individual muscle fibres? So if my chest has for example 100 fibres in it, we kind of know we cant make more fibres, so if i train for "size" my body may only be using 50 of those fibres but because of the training style, those fibres become enlarged and appear bigger. But, by training for strength, now i am training my body to use say 75 of those fibres but not necessarily making them become enlarged? is that accurate? more fibres used=more force=very high energy requirement=less perceived endurance???

**Mudge** · 11-09-2004, 12:09 PM

Plenty of powerlifters are very big, but much of that is a function of diet. I think people put too much thought into rep ranges as to make it a religious sort of thing.

The higher the workload (20 MPH instead of 15 MPH) then your endurance will be reduced.

11-08-2004, 01:45 PM	#1
rangers97 2006 Stanley Cup Champs! Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: New York Posts: 245	bigger or stronger? We know there are different "types" of training for strength and size. So the question is, would you rather be the "big" guy who looks intimidating and is heavier and therefore harder to knock over, who is strong but not as strong as his size would lead you to believe, or would you rather be the "smaller" guy, the guy who doesn't look intimidating at all, his shirts are loose, not tight around his arm, but trains with low reps and when he hits you, he surprises you with his strength? I only ask since I play hockey and I happen to consider myself the "smaller" type guy, at 5'10 190pounds. I kind of actually feel small sometimes, I dont think I look very intimidating at all, and people always try to come after me when we play, but when I decide enoughs enough, I often find myself destroying people with checks or pushes, or stuff. I throw people down sometimes with one arm, I KNOW for a fact they didn't expect it. Only thing is, when you are smaller, you get knocked down too, just because you are strong doesn't mean you are heavy, lol, so I find myself on the receiving end a lot too, it's just that when i am on the giving side, I find I give a lot harder than I receive, lol..... your thoughts?

11-08-2004, 02:12 PM	#4
Duncans Donuts Stay puffed, baby. Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: CA Posts: 2,774 Photos: 2	I'd rather be strong, fast, and big.
	"in the howling bleeding nights, the dogs plunge into the Volga and swim desperately to gain the other bank. The nights of Stalingrad are a terror for them. Animals flee this hell; the hardest stones cannot bear it for long; only men endure."

11-08-2004, 02:20 PM	#6
Duncans Donuts Stay puffed, baby. Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: CA Posts: 2,774 Photos: 2
	"in the howling bleeding nights, the dogs plunge into the Volga and swim desperately to gain the other bank. The nights of Stalingrad are a terror for them. Animals flee this hell; the hardest stones cannot bear it for long; only men endure."

11-08-2004, 02:30 PM	#8
Duncans Donuts Stay puffed, baby. Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: CA Posts: 2,774 Photos: 2	pullups are harder when you weigh more
	"in the howling bleeding nights, the dogs plunge into the Volga and swim desperately to gain the other bank. The nights of Stalingrad are a terror for them. Animals flee this hell; the hardest stones cannot bear it for long; only men endure."

11-08-2004, 02:33 PM	#9
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	Strength is great but you also need bodyweight to stand your ground, Newton's law would apply here. Bigger stronger faster leaner sexier, how about all of those, and make me 23 again while your at it.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

11-08-2004, 02:08 PM	#2
sabre81 mmmm weights.. Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Western New York Posts: 386	im with you. im 6'1 200. I consider myself smaller i suppose, since many of my friends are more bulky, however i got them beat in the strength department. My goal is actually to get to 215-220 so im not sure if ill be considered small then.

11-08-2004, 02:08 PM	#3
shiek49 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: wilmington,nc Posts: 85	I'm an average size and used to tend to get into "disagreements" in high school/college. I try to stay away from any trouble now days. That being said... I'd rather be the guy that looks big and not as strong. I don't care how much I can lift as long as I look good.... you know, for the ladies.

11-08-2004, 02:27 PM	#7
KarlW My Little Man Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Oz Posts: 1,030	I never see the BIG guys (you know the bulky-ish types) do Pull Ups. The guys I see doing them well are the skinnier (but heaps strong for their size) types. Karl

11-08-2004, 02:46 PM	#11
Saturday Fever Pimp Gimp Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: California Posts: 2,142 Photos: 4	But let's face it, if you eat right and lift, you're going to get big. But you have to train specifically for strength. So why not train for strength and eat for size and enjoy both benefits?
	yay.

11-08-2004, 02:49 PM	#12
shutupntra1n Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 2,905	Bigger 4 me Who cares what I can lift as long as I look like I can lift a lot

11-08-2004, 03:04 PM	#14
chris mason Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 407	As Duncan Donuts said I would like to be a combination of both.

11-08-2004, 03:38 PM	#16
DOMS Metrosexual Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: In a van, down by the river... Posts: 21,725 Photos: 6	No, that's what the gun is for.
	I never lie because I don't fear anyone. You only lie when you're afraid.—John Gotti

11-08-2004, 04:38 PM	#17
Squaggleboggin Functional Lifting = Life Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 3,540 Photos: 3	I'm on the bigger side (for my age at least) and I do like not having to deal with people (for the most part they just leave me alone). While I'm not weak, I'd rather be very strong and a little smaller than bigger and weak. After all, when it comes down to it, if you were in a fight would you want to look tough and get beaten or look normal and do the beating?

11-08-2004, 04:46 PM	#19
easton Currently: 161lbs Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Australia Posts: 95	as a short guy, id rather be stronger... if i get too large id look just as stupid as the people i have laughed at in the past for being strangely out of proportion :/
	Max Lifts ( 1x3 ) Bench: 200lbs Squat: 260lbs Dead: 265lbs

11-08-2004, 10:32 PM	#21
X-Cop Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Georgia Posts: 44	Bigger. For the fact that my size may prevent someone from trying to fight me while I arrest them. It seems like the some of the smaller cops I work with have the most Obstruction cases.

11-08-2004, 10:57 PM	#22
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	Yep, and that was the reasoning behind a height rule in the old days until a certain group of peoples had it overturned as being racist. *It should be noted I am not racist.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

11-09-2004, 08:18 AM	#24
rangers97 2006 Stanley Cup Champs! Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: New York Posts: 245	what is really happening to your body when you lift heavy weights? What is a set of 4 going to do for you as opposed to a set of 8? and dont say make you stronger, lol that is a given. I mean what goes on inside? when doing a higher rep workout, typically what they call the size rep range, your cells are becoming bigger, but they dont exert as much force? When you do the strength rep range, your muscles are not getting as large per say, they are getting harder or denser, and able to produce more force? Is that right? but that force is very finite is it not? Since there is no endurance in the muscle? You will be able to pick something very heavy up, but you will only be able to hold it for a short amount of time before you get tired, whereas, maybe the guy who trains with 8-10 reps can hold something somewhat lighter but for a longer period of time? so this begs the question....how often will you "use" all this strength that you train for? Personally, I would have to say it is an ego/personal accomplishment thing, unless you need it for a specific reason like sports or something like that. In my day to day life, why do I need to be strong? I think more people will be looking at me as opposed to me using my strength, so maybe it would be better for the average person to look better than to be stronger, you know you may need that strength, but maybe once or twice a week you do something where you need to be strong, whereas people look at you every day.....hmmm interesting point

11-09-2004, 09:14 AM	#25
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	Endurance for me still goes up with training heavy, i.e. if one week I decide to go light I can do the same amount of reps with a given weight that will corellate to my max on the max chart. A lot of strength training is simply training the body to be forced to use a larger percentage of your muscle fibers at a given time, since for self preservation (safety and energy conservation) it will want to use the least muscle percentage it can. THIS is at least one reason why many animals that are abnormally strong or fast lose energy rapidly and tire out.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

11-09-2004, 09:37 AM	#26
rangers97 2006 Stanley Cup Champs! Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: New York Posts: 245	very interesting Mudge......so by training heavy I am training my body to use more of the muscle fibres that I have as opposed to "size" training which just increases the size of individual muscle fibres? So if my chest has for example 100 fibres in it, we kind of know we cant make more fibres, so if i train for "size" my body may only be using 50 of those fibres but because of the training style, those fibres become enlarged and appear bigger. But, by training for strength, now i am training my body to use say 75 of those fibres but not necessarily making them become enlarged? is that accurate? more fibres used=more force=very high energy requirement=less perceived endurance???

11-09-2004, 12:09 PM	#27
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,071 Photos: 1	Plenty of powerlifters are very big, but much of that is a function of diet. I think people put too much thought into rep ranges as to make it a religious sort of thing. The higher the workload (20 MPH instead of 15 MPH) then your endurance will be reduced.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

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