To:Prince/Scotty the Body/Gopro Advice Needed

goldtips · 03-23-2002, 08:44 PM

I recently was on my way to the gym, and so I stopped to talk to this guy who go's to my gym. I've been into bodybuilding for a while. I was speaking with this one guy who was seventeen & I'm eighteen. People have noticed I've bulked up, but this one dude who is seveenteen is huger than me. So I was speaking to him and I told him my frustrations of lifting and I don't like the results. First off I find out he eats 5 meals a day. I eat three. So I figured I need to eat more. Another thing he told me is use less weight, but more reps? For instance for shoulders frontal raises I told him I was doing 40 to 50 pound dumbbell Frontal Raises and this guy who I'm talking to who is bigger than me is using 20 pound dumbells? He told me to use the 20 pound dumbbells. He also takes those protein shakes. Do protein shakes help out with bulk? So is it more weight you use when you lift to get bulk? Or less weight more reps to get bulk? Here's my routine-

Monday-Chest/Tricep
Tuesday-Legs
Wendesday-Rest
Thursday-Back/Biceps
Friday-Shoulders
Sat/Sun- Rest

So it's 4 days total for me at the gym... All exercises I do 4 sets with a 10,8,6,3 rep range. Can I do 5 sets or 6 sets? With the 5 sets I can do a warm-up counting as one. What ever advice you have or what ever I need to be doing I'm a do it. My goal is for real bulk/mass in all areas, but especially my biceps,triceps, and chest. Biceps most of all... Gopro, Scotty the Body and Prince or anyone else please go to the Nutrition board I need your advice on that to. Thank you.....

Neil · 03-24-2002, 12:13 PM

That is the exact same split I use and it has been working well for me. I would recommend 6 meals a day. There are 2 reasons for protein drinks-1. convenience 2. Faster absorbtion. Try and get most of your meals from solid foods. I take 2 meal replacements a day so I don't spend my whole life in the kitchen. Also try and get down a protein drink within 15 minutes of finishing your workout.
This is one of those windows of opportunity were you will "suck up" all those nutrients and put them to use. I would also recommend throwing some carbs into that post W/O drink too. The amount depends on your size and your goals. The reason your bigger friend told you to use less weight is probably cause unless you are totally massive 50 pounds on front raises sounds like you may be using sloppy form. Also if you are trying to put on size I'd keep your reps in the 5-8 range to failure. You don't need high reps to get big, that guy is wrong on that one. Hope I helped. Good luck!

**gopro** · 03-24-2002, 01:04 PM

Some advice...
- Back is a very large bodypart...train it alone with low back and traps...put biceps with shoulders.
- Eat 6 meals per day...don't go longer than 3 hours without eating. Try 3-4 food meals and 2-3 protein drinks.
- Get in 1-1.5 grams of protein per lb of bodyweight and 2-2.5 grams of carbs for each lb.
- Biggest meals should be breakfast and post workout.
- Eat before bed...or at least have a protein drink.
- Train for no more than 1 hour at each session.
- Stick to basic, compound movements mostly...bench press, military press, squats, deadlifts, chins, bent rows, leg press, etc.
- Do 2 exercises for each bodypart, 3-4 sets each, not including warmup.
- Stay in the 6-10 rep range for best mass gains.
- Limit other draining activities when trying to bulk up.

Good luck!

**Prince** · 03-24-2002, 02:12 PM

Your main problem seems to be diet, increase your meals.

goldtips · 03-24-2002, 04:26 PM

Gopro can you give me an example for what you would work on bicep & shoulder day? I was told five exercises is okay. For instance what I was doing on Bicep/Back day I would do 5 exercises for bicep/back, four sets for back/bicep. Guess that's wrong?

**gopro** · 03-24-2002, 08:34 PM

Can you please give me a sample of your routine on back and bicep day....exercises, sets, reps. This will help me to help you

goldtips · 03-24-2002, 09:40 PM

Gopro I start off with biceps first and heres my routine-
1. Biceps- The main exercises for me the barbell preacher curl, standing up one arm at a time dumbbell arm curl, dumbbell hammer curls, and reverse preacher curls. With the reverse preacher curl instead of sitting down I stand up and do it the other way. Sometimes I do the concentration curls.

2. Back-barbell bent over upright row, cable seated row, cable underhand pulldown, lever seated row, and cable close grip pulldown.

Gopro I do all exercises both bicep/back 5 sets at a 10,8,6,3 rep range. The first set is the warm-up. Then I move my weight up five pounds each set. Again I'm frustrated with the growth of my biceps in particular. Your recommendation/thoughts on this? Gopro what contributed to growth of your biceps? Protein shakes? Or...? I'm going to try those pancakes you make with the Whey powder(right?) stuff when I get the chance.

kuso · 03-25-2002, 06:53 AM

Sorry, not gopro, but I`m pretty sure I know what he`ll say.

Your not effectively training your back by doing bi`s first......ALWAYS do the larger muscle first, then the secondary.

Tank316 · 03-25-2002, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kuso
Sorry, not gopro, but I`m pretty sure I know what he`ll say.

Your not effectively training your back by doing bi`s first......ALWAYS do the larger muscle first, then the secondary.

yes, always train the larger muscle group first. but there can be an exception to the rule, prioritize.meaning training a lagging body part alone or in some cases bi's first then the back.with biomechanics on how the bi's tie in to helping with back movements you can train bi's first then do your back work out.but dont expect a great back work out either..

pumpit · 03-25-2002, 11:25 AM

I would say to try and lower your sets to 4, two excersises per bodypart. Keep the reps 10,8,6,3 for the back, but for the biceps do a warmup of 8 reps then do 4 sets of 6,6,6 and 4 this has proven very effective for my biceps it caused them to peak at the top. Hope this helps

goldtips · 03-25-2002, 12:56 PM

Pumpit what exercises do you work for your biceps? What key factors have helped the growth of your biceps?

Scotty the Body · 03-25-2002, 01:12 PM

It looks to me like your biggest problem is diet, like the others said eat 5-7 times a day and up your protien.
As for your Bi's, your volume looks a little high, your doing like 16 sets, I would try to keep it around 9 total.
If you want to make them a priority, move them to your shoulder day as well but DON'T do them before back.

goldtips · 03-25-2002, 02:40 PM

Scotty the Body- So do you feels it's best I do biceps with shoulders? Also when you say I shouldn't do biceps before back do you mean on the day I would do biceps/back I shouldn't do biceps first? or do you mean the one day I do back I shouldn't do the biceps/ shoulders before I do back in the week? By the way do you like just back on one day then I pair my shoulders/biceps on one day? Or...?

Scotty the Body · 03-25-2002, 03:06 PM

If Bi's are a priority, I'd do them on a separate day with shoulders, if you’re going to do them with back, do them after back.

goldtips · 03-25-2002, 04:12 PM

Got my little notebook where I'm taking notes on what everybody saying. I'll pair shoulders with biceps.... What I don't understand is for example I go to the gym how many exercises should I do for my biceps and then for shoulders? Maybe 4 different exercises with four sets each exercise for biceps/shoulders? *Shrugs*....

Scotty the Body · 03-25-2002, 04:37 PM

Here's a shoulder/bi routine:
Shoulders
1- military press...3 x 4-6
2- wide grip upright row...3 x 6-8
3- side lateral...2 x 8-10
4- barbell shrug...3 x 8-10, 6-8, 4-6
Bi's
1-barbell curl...4 x 6-8
2-Preacher curl....4 x 6-8

next week workout:

Shoulder
1- dumbell press...3 x 6-8
2- bent lateral...3 x 8-10
3- single arm side lateral...2 x 10-12
4- dumbell shrug...3 x 10-12, 8-10, 6-8
Bi's
1-incline DB curl....4 x 6-8
2-concentration curls....4 x 6-8

Repeat.

03-23-2002, 08:44 PM	#1
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	To:Prince/Scotty the Body/Gopro Advice Needed I recently was on my way to the gym, and so I stopped to talk to this guy who go's to my gym. I've been into bodybuilding for a while. I was speaking with this one guy who was seventeen & I'm eighteen. People have noticed I've bulked up, but this one dude who is seveenteen is huger than me. So I was speaking to him and I told him my frustrations of lifting and I don't like the results. First off I find out he eats 5 meals a day. I eat three. So I figured I need to eat more. Another thing he told me is use less weight, but more reps? For instance for shoulders frontal raises I told him I was doing 40 to 50 pound dumbbell Frontal Raises and this guy who I'm talking to who is bigger than me is using 20 pound dumbells? He told me to use the 20 pound dumbbells. He also takes those protein shakes. Do protein shakes help out with bulk? So is it more weight you use when you lift to get bulk? Or less weight more reps to get bulk? Here's my routine- Monday-Chest/Tricep Tuesday-Legs Wendesday-Rest Thursday-Back/Biceps Friday-Shoulders Sat/Sun- Rest So it's 4 days total for me at the gym... All exercises I do 4 sets with a 10,8,6,3 rep range. Can I do 5 sets or 6 sets? With the 5 sets I can do a warm-up counting as one. What ever advice you have or what ever I need to be doing I'm a do it. My goal is for real bulk/mass in all areas, but especially my biceps,triceps, and chest. Biceps most of all... Gopro, Scotty the Body and Prince or anyone else please go to the Nutrition board I need your advice on that to. Thank you.....

03-24-2002, 01:04 PM	#3
gopro NGA/IFPA Pro Bodybuilder Moderator Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Ft. Lauderdale Florida Posts: 10,521	Some advice... - Back is a very large bodypart...train it alone with low back and traps...put biceps with shoulders. - Eat 6 meals per day...don't go longer than 3 hours without eating. Try 3-4 food meals and 2-3 protein drinks. - Get in 1-1.5 grams of protein per lb of bodyweight and 2-2.5 grams of carbs for each lb. - Biggest meals should be breakfast and post workout. - Eat before bed...or at least have a protein drink. - Train for no more than 1 hour at each session. - Stick to basic, compound movements mostly...bench press, military press, squats, deadlifts, chins, bent rows, leg press, etc. - Do 2 exercises for each bodypart, 3-4 sets each, not including warmup. - Stay in the 6-10 rep range for best mass gains. - Limit other draining activities when trying to bulk up. Good luck!
	Monthly columnist for Muscular Development and Ironman magazines. GOLIATH LABS Sponsored Athlete/Board Rep www.prrstraining.com Time to GROW Without Plateau! Personal Training Gopro is available for online personal training, dietary guidance, and contest prep coaching. Send me a PM or e-mail if interested. Thank you.

03-24-2002, 02:12 PM	#4
Prince the one & only Administrator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Colorado Posts: 33,980 Blog Entries: 25 Photos: 320	Your main problem seems to be diet, increase your meals.
	SBMuscle.com - Discount Supplement Superstore AlltheWhey.com - Bulk Protein Powders CEM Products - Research Chemicals & Supplements MusclePharm - Complete Nutritional Arsenal BigBackGrips - If you lift weights you've got to try these grips! HumaneVoLabs - Foaming Transdermal Delivery System. Creatine Ethyl Ester HCL (CEE) On Sale $17.49 per bottle!

03-24-2002, 08:34 PM	#6
gopro NGA/IFPA Pro Bodybuilder Moderator Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Ft. Lauderdale Florida Posts: 10,521	Can you please give me a sample of your routine on back and bicep day....exercises, sets, reps. This will help me to help you
	Monthly columnist for Muscular Development and Ironman magazines. GOLIATH LABS Sponsored Athlete/Board Rep www.prrstraining.com Time to GROW Without Plateau! Personal Training Gopro is available for online personal training, dietary guidance, and contest prep coaching. Send me a PM or e-mail if interested. Thank you.

03-25-2002, 11:25 AM	#10
pumpit Madman Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: London Posts: 111	I would say to try and lower your sets to 4, two excersises per bodypart. Keep the reps 10,8,6,3 for the back, but for the biceps do a warmup of 8 reps then do 4 sets of 6,6,6 and 4 this has proven very effective for my biceps it caused them to peak at the top. Hope this helps
	The harder you try the tougher you will be!

03-24-2002, 12:13 PM	#2
Neil Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 171	That is the exact same split I use and it has been working well for me. I would recommend 6 meals a day. There are 2 reasons for protein drinks-1. convenience 2. Faster absorbtion. Try and get most of your meals from solid foods. I take 2 meal replacements a day so I don't spend my whole life in the kitchen. Also try and get down a protein drink within 15 minutes of finishing your workout. This is one of those windows of opportunity were you will "suck up" all those nutrients and put them to use. I would also recommend throwing some carbs into that post W/O drink too. The amount depends on your size and your goals. The reason your bigger friend told you to use less weight is probably cause unless you are totally massive 50 pounds on front raises sounds like you may be using sloppy form. Also if you are trying to put on size I'd keep your reps in the 5-8 range to failure. You don't need high reps to get big, that guy is wrong on that one. Hope I helped. Good luck!

03-24-2002, 04:26 PM	#5
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	Gopro can you give me an example for what you would work on bicep & shoulder day? I was told five exercises is okay. For instance what I was doing on Bicep/Back day I would do 5 exercises for bicep/back, four sets for back/bicep. Guess that's wrong?

03-24-2002, 09:40 PM	#7
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	Gopro I start off with biceps first and heres my routine- 1. Biceps- The main exercises for me the barbell preacher curl, standing up one arm at a time dumbbell arm curl, dumbbell hammer curls, and reverse preacher curls. With the reverse preacher curl instead of sitting down I stand up and do it the other way. Sometimes I do the concentration curls. 2. Back-barbell bent over upright row, cable seated row, cable underhand pulldown, lever seated row, and cable close grip pulldown. Gopro I do all exercises both bicep/back 5 sets at a 10,8,6,3 rep range. The first set is the warm-up. Then I move my weight up five pounds each set. Again I'm frustrated with the growth of my biceps in particular. Your recommendation/thoughts on this? Gopro what contributed to growth of your biceps? Protein shakes? Or...? I'm going to try those pancakes you make with the Whey powder(right?) stuff when I get the chance.

03-25-2002, 06:53 AM	#8
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,047 Photos: 15	Sorry, not gopro, but I`m pretty sure I know what he`ll say. Your not effectively training your back by doing bi`s first......ALWAYS do the larger muscle first, then the secondary.

03-25-2002, 12:56 PM	#11
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	Pumpit what exercises do you work for your biceps? What key factors have helped the growth of your biceps?

03-25-2002, 01:12 PM	#12
Scotty the Body I'm Dead Sexxxxy!! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Canada Posts: 4,970	It looks to me like your biggest problem is diet, like the others said eat 5-7 times a day and up your protien. As for your Bi's, your volume looks a little high, your doing like 16 sets, I would try to keep it around 9 total. If you want to make them a priority, move them to your shoulder day as well but DON'T do them before back.
	Cool

03-25-2002, 02:40 PM	#13
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	Scotty the Body- So do you feels it's best I do biceps with shoulders? Also when you say I shouldn't do biceps before back do you mean on the day I would do biceps/back I shouldn't do biceps first? or do you mean the one day I do back I shouldn't do the biceps/ shoulders before I do back in the week? By the way do you like just back on one day then I pair my shoulders/biceps on one day? Or...?

03-25-2002, 03:06 PM	#14
Scotty the Body I'm Dead Sexxxxy!! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Canada Posts: 4,970	If Bi's are a priority, I'd do them on a separate day with shoulders, if you’re going to do them with back, do them after back.
	Cool

03-25-2002, 04:12 PM	#15
goldtips Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MD Posts: 25	Got my little notebook where I'm taking notes on what everybody saying. I'll pair shoulders with biceps.... What I don't understand is for example I go to the gym how many exercises should I do for my biceps and then for shoulders? Maybe 4 different exercises with four sets each exercise for biceps/shoulders? Shrugs....

03-25-2002, 04:37 PM	#16
Scotty the Body I'm Dead Sexxxxy!! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Canada Posts: 4,970	Here's a shoulder/bi routine: Shoulders 1- military press...3 x 4-6 2- wide grip upright row...3 x 6-8 3- side lateral...2 x 8-10 4- barbell shrug...3 x 8-10, 6-8, 4-6 Bi's 1-barbell curl...4 x 6-8 2-Preacher curl....4 x 6-8 next week workout: Shoulder 1- dumbell press...3 x 6-8 2- bent lateral...3 x 8-10 3- single arm side lateral...2 x 10-12 4- dumbell shrug...3 x 10-12, 8-10, 6-8 Bi's 1-incline DB curl....4 x 6-8 2-concentration curls....4 x 6-8 Repeat.
	Cool

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