Chin ups/Pull ups

TheSupremeBeing · 08-18-2001, 11:11 AM

Chin ups (undergrip) are FAR superior to pull ups (overhand). Use a slightly wider than should width grip, this position maximizes the range of motion and lat involvement.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

bharminder · 08-18-2001, 11:28 AM

oh yeah...it was you who told me that...i havent talked to you for a while my icq is messed up and i dunno how to fix it

TheSupremeBeing · 08-18-2001, 12:28 PM

ICQ sucks, I always use msn.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

bharminder · 08-18-2001, 12:38 PM

MSN sucks, I always use aim.

TheSupremeBeing · 08-18-2001, 12:44 PM

AIM is just as bad.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

mmafiter · 08-18-2001, 01:04 PM

TSB, why are underhand grip chin-ups better than pull-ups? I thought it would be the other way around. It seems to me I use less bicep when I do chins with a overhand grip.

Hmmm....just wondering.

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100000 Lemmings can't be wrong.

bharminder · 08-18-2001, 01:05 PM

Probably, but i'm too used to it to realize..anyways, i was just reading that dumbbell vs. barbell benching and i was wondering what u meant by that not changing ur workout thing..like are you sayin that when your workout gets stale you should keep doing it?

bharminder · 08-18-2001, 10:55 PM

Idecided to do these instead of barbell rowing...Should I do both or just chin ups? The only back working i'll be doing is deadlifting, shrugs, and which ever one is better between pull ups and chinups..I heard chinups were better somewhere..If so..how wide should my grip be?

TheSupremeBeing · 08-19-2001, 03:04 AM

What do you mean by "stale"? If you mean boared but you're still progressing then it;'s best to stick with it. If you mean progression has stopped then change it.

About the chins, no matter what grip we use the biceps will always be involved in the chin. The biceps are the weak link, meaning they limit how much you can stimulate your lats before they fail. So, by putting your hands in an undergrip position (supinated) you put your biceps in their strongest position, thus this will take longer to fatigue so you can train your lats with more weight/reps. Also, the range of motion is better. Yes you will feel your biceps working more, but that's a good thing...it just means they are working harder, and this means you can work your lats harder before the biceps give out on ya.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

w8lifter · 08-19-2001, 05:01 AM

What about wide grip pronated pull ups? Do those create better wings than a closer grip?....or is this one of those upper/lower/inner/outer pec questions

;D

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Behind every great man is his BUTT

My FitPit

TheSupremeBeing · 08-19-2001, 05:57 AM

That's definately a myth...could be classified as a upper/lower/inner/outer pec type thing.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

mmafiter · 08-19-2001, 08:19 AM

ok, thanks.

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100000 Lemmings can't be wrong.

Mule · 08-19-2001, 08:20 AM

I do them wide. Works for me. I just started to do them the other way!

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Im an Iron Addict!

ballast · 08-19-2001, 11:42 AM

I do them the way Supreme suggested.I went from wide/pronated chins to shoulder-width/supinated chins.Was able to use 15 extra pounds for the same amount of reps.

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"I'm just an ordinary guy with nothing to lose."

bharminder · 08-19-2001, 04:55 PM

Will chinups work both the teres major and the lats good, or should i had a set or two of bent over row or pullups? if not, then is 3-4 sets of chinups goood enough for that part of the back?

TheSupremeBeing · 08-19-2001, 05:06 PM

The chins and a row is sufficient.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

cytrix · 08-19-2001, 05:24 PM

isn't it so that widegrip pullups or pulldowns are targeting the upper outer parts of the lats more, and chinups more the lower lats? i do both

bharminder · 08-19-2001, 06:16 PM

So a chinup isnt enough for the back?

Jason Da Bodiful · 08-19-2001, 11:01 PM

BTW, how much will doing Chins/pull ups target on our Pecs? Cuz my routine is Chest on Monday, Back on Wendesday, thus if working on back will somewhat work on the Pecs, doesn't that mean I should do something in order for the latter to have enough rest?

TheSupremeBeing · 08-20-2001, 03:08 AM

LOL cytix are you serious? If you are, then no what you said is wrong.

A chin is primarily a bicep/lat exericse, so you may wanna add a row for the rhomboids, lower traps (separate insertion and origins, and fuction, thus can be separaretly targeted), teres, scapulea and all the other muscles in the middle of the back.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

**Prince** · 08-20-2001, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jason Da Bodiful:
BTW, how much will doing Chins/pull ups target on our Pecs? Cuz my routine is Chest on Monday, Back on Wendesday, thus if working on back will somewhat work on the Pecs, doesn't that mean I should do something in order for the latter to have enough rest?

If you're working your back correctly, it should not affect your pecs.

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Just because the majority believes it, does not make it true!

bharminder · 08-20-2001, 08:12 AM

so 3 sets of chins and 2 rows? I'm also doing 2 sets of shrugs so that works the traps...for the barbell row..should i bring the weight up to my chest or tummy? because when i bring it up to my chest after a few reps my leg starts to cramp up and i heard its bad for you if you pull to the chest.

cytrix · 08-20-2001, 04:51 PM

hey TSB,
i actually was serious, this is what i've been reading over and over,but after reading what you said, it (you)makes sense, because i know fibers either contract or not, not only on top or bottom. i have another question for you, what do you think about barbell rowing undergrip - would that be an alternative for chinups or closegrip/underhand pulldowns? and what do you think about behind the neck pulldowns?

TheSupremeBeing · 08-20-2001, 04:58 PM

I do my rows undergrip. I like it better, and the same weak link thing applies to rows too.

Don't do behind the neck exercises.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

cytrix · 08-20-2001, 05:52 PM

TSB, i was serious

, but after reading your reply, it makes sense, since musclefibers either contract lenghwise, or not. what's your opinion regarding behind the neck pulldowns as alternative for a regular bentover row for the midback)and undergrip/close row (as alternative for the chinup or closegrip pulldown)?

bharminder · 08-20-2001, 06:39 PM

Wouldn't doing chin ups and underhand grip rows be the same thing or would the underhand grip work the same muscles as the wide overhand grip? also, do you do them wide undergrip or close undergrip?

<FONT COLOR="#000002" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">[Edited 1 time by bharminder on 08-20-2001 at 08:49 PM]</font>

TheSupremeBeing · 08-21-2001, 04:57 AM

Don't do behind the neck exercises.

I do them slightly wider than shoulder width with an undergrip.

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

bharminder · 08-21-2001, 08:48 AM

ok Supreme...one last time..
3 sets of deadlifts
3 sets of chins(underhand slightly wider than shoulder width grip)
2 sets barbell row(underhand slightly wider than shoulder width grip)
2 sets shrugs

is that good enough or should i make it 3 sets or make it a wide overhand grip on the rows?

TheSupremeBeing · 08-21-2001, 09:12 AM

Yes that's fine you pain in the ass

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Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

cytrix · 08-21-2001, 05:49 PM

sorry, i pretty much posted the same thing twice previously

, but i thought the first one didn't get posted, 'cause i couldn't see it within the next 15 min., i guess it takes a little while sometimes

08-18-2001, 10:55 PM	#8
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	Chin ups/Pull ups Idecided to do these instead of barbell rowing...Should I do both or just chin ups? The only back working i'll be doing is deadlifting, shrugs, and which ever one is better between pull ups and chinups..I heard chinups were better somewhere..If so..how wide should my grip be?

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08-18-2001, 11:11 AM	#1
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	Chin ups (undergrip) are FAR superior to pull ups (overhand). Use a slightly wider than should width grip, this position maximizes the range of motion and lat involvement. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-18-2001, 11:28 AM	#2
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	oh yeah...it was you who told me that...i havent talked to you for a while my icq is messed up and i dunno how to fix it

08-18-2001, 12:28 PM	#3
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	ICQ sucks, I always use msn. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-18-2001, 12:38 PM	#4
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	MSN sucks, I always use aim.

08-18-2001, 12:44 PM	#5
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	AIM is just as bad. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-18-2001, 01:04 PM	#6
mmafiter Red Rocket! Red Rocket! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Do you EVEN FUQQING care? Posts: 2,020	TSB, why are underhand grip chin-ups better than pull-ups? I thought it would be the other way around. It seems to me I use less bicep when I do chins with a overhand grip. Hmmm....just wondering. ------------------ 100000 Lemmings can't be wrong.

08-18-2001, 01:05 PM	#7
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	Probably, but i'm too used to it to realize..anyways, i was just reading that dumbbell vs. barbell benching and i was wondering what u meant by that not changing ur workout thing..like are you sayin that when your workout gets stale you should keep doing it?

08-19-2001, 03:04 AM	#9
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	What do you mean by "stale"? If you mean boared but you're still progressing then it;'s best to stick with it. If you mean progression has stopped then change it. About the chins, no matter what grip we use the biceps will always be involved in the chin. The biceps are the weak link, meaning they limit how much you can stimulate your lats before they fail. So, by putting your hands in an undergrip position (supinated) you put your biceps in their strongest position, thus this will take longer to fatigue so you can train your lats with more weight/reps. Also, the range of motion is better. Yes you will feel your biceps working more, but that's a good thing...it just means they are working harder, and this means you can work your lats harder before the biceps give out on ya. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-19-2001, 05:01 AM	#10
w8lifter Join Date: May 2001 Location: Around..... Posts: 14,964	What about wide grip pronated pull ups? Do those create better wings than a closer grip?....or is this one of those upper/lower/inner/outer pec questions ;D ------------------ Behind every great man is his BUTT My FitPit

08-19-2001, 05:57 AM	#11
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	That's definately a myth...could be classified as a upper/lower/inner/outer pec type thing. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-19-2001, 08:19 AM	#12
mmafiter Red Rocket! Red Rocket! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Do you EVEN FUQQING care? Posts: 2,020	ok, thanks. ------------------ 100000 Lemmings can't be wrong.

08-19-2001, 08:20 AM	#13
Mule Great American Nightmare Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Wheeling Posts: 888	I do them wide. Works for me. I just started to do them the other way! ------------------ Im an Iron Addict!

08-19-2001, 11:42 AM	#14
ballast Registered User Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Kalamazoo,MI USA Posts: 350	I do them the way Supreme suggested.I went from wide/pronated chins to shoulder-width/supinated chins.Was able to use 15 extra pounds for the same amount of reps. ------------------ "I'm just an ordinary guy with nothing to lose."

08-19-2001, 04:55 PM	#15
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	Will chinups work both the teres major and the lats good, or should i had a set or two of bent over row or pullups? if not, then is 3-4 sets of chinups goood enough for that part of the back?

08-19-2001, 05:06 PM	#16
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	The chins and a row is sufficient. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-19-2001, 05:24 PM	#17
cytrix Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: chicago, il , usa Posts: 287	isn't it so that widegrip pullups or pulldowns are targeting the upper outer parts of the lats more, and chinups more the lower lats? i do both

08-19-2001, 06:16 PM	#18
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	So a chinup isnt enough for the back?

08-19-2001, 11:01 PM	#19
Jason Da Bodiful Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 47	BTW, how much will doing Chins/pull ups target on our Pecs? Cuz my routine is Chest on Monday, Back on Wendesday, thus if working on back will somewhat work on the Pecs, doesn't that mean I should do something in order for the latter to have enough rest?

08-20-2001, 03:08 AM	#20
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	LOL cytix are you serious? If you are, then no what you said is wrong. A chin is primarily a bicep/lat exericse, so you may wanna add a row for the rhomboids, lower traps (separate insertion and origins, and fuction, thus can be separaretly targeted), teres, scapulea and all the other muscles in the middle of the back. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-20-2001, 08:12 AM	#22
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	so 3 sets of chins and 2 rows? I'm also doing 2 sets of shrugs so that works the traps...for the barbell row..should i bring the weight up to my chest or tummy? because when i bring it up to my chest after a few reps my leg starts to cramp up and i heard its bad for you if you pull to the chest.

08-20-2001, 04:51 PM	#23
cytrix Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: chicago, il , usa Posts: 287	hey TSB, i actually was serious, this is what i've been reading over and over,but after reading what you said, it (you)makes sense, because i know fibers either contract or not, not only on top or bottom. i have another question for you, what do you think about barbell rowing undergrip - would that be an alternative for chinups or closegrip/underhand pulldowns? and what do you think about behind the neck pulldowns?

08-20-2001, 04:58 PM	#24
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	I do my rows undergrip. I like it better, and the same weak link thing applies to rows too. Don't do behind the neck exercises. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-20-2001, 05:52 PM	#25
cytrix Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: chicago, il , usa Posts: 287	TSB, i was serious , but after reading your reply, it makes sense, since musclefibers either contract lenghwise, or not. what's your opinion regarding behind the neck pulldowns as alternative for a regular bentover row for the midback)and undergrip/close row (as alternative for the chinup or closegrip pulldown)?

08-20-2001, 06:39 PM	#26
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	Wouldn't doing chin ups and underhand grip rows be the same thing or would the underhand grip work the same muscles as the wide overhand grip? also, do you do them wide undergrip or close undergrip? <FONT COLOR="#000002" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">[Edited 1 time by bharminder on 08-20-2001 at 08:49 PM]</font>

08-21-2001, 04:57 AM	#27
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	Don't do behind the neck exercises. I do them slightly wider than shoulder width with an undergrip. ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-21-2001, 08:48 AM	#28
bharminder Registered User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Detroit, Michigan, USA Posts: 129	ok Supreme...one last time.. 3 sets of deadlifts 3 sets of chins(underhand slightly wider than shoulder width grip) 2 sets barbell row(underhand slightly wider than shoulder width grip) 2 sets shrugs is that good enough or should i make it 3 sets or make it a wide overhand grip on the rows?

08-21-2001, 09:12 AM	#29
TheSupremeBeing Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Chillin' in mah cribb, yo. Posts: 598	Yes that's fine you pain in the ass ------------------ Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers.

08-21-2001, 05:49 PM	#30
cytrix Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: chicago, il , usa Posts: 287	sorry, i pretty much posted the same thing twice previously , but i thought the first one didn't get posted, 'cause i couldn't see it within the next 15 min., i guess it takes a little while sometimes