military press - smith? free weight?

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 01:12 PM

Hey,
First of all my favorite exercises are for shoulders and legs.... and for shoulders I have a dilemma thats getting to me.

Is it best to do military press with a barbell? Or hit the smith machine? It's the first exerxise I do for my shoulders, and it is in my opinion the best shoulder exercise. So I want to do it right.

On the smith machine, which I have been doing for the past few months, is good, but it doesn't seem to make my shoulders feel it as much as a barbell press. But when doing the barbell press, I am unstable sometimes, and the chair moves around a bit from my pushing. Because of this instability, I can't do as much weight on the barbell than smith machine.

Is one of the two superior? Which ones do you guys do?

**P-funk** · 11-28-2005, 01:13 PM

barbell

dougnukem · 11-28-2005, 01:18 PM

BB, most definately.

BulkMeUp · 11-28-2005, 01:22 PM

I'v never done BB. I do DB's. Standing.

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 01:29 PM

hollaaaaaaaaaaa easy decision huh

ill start doing barbell

**CowPimp** · 11-28-2005, 01:29 PM

I don't like the smith machine. It is crap. The human body doesn't move in perfectly straight lines. You will probably improve your ability to stabilize the weight during a freeweight press if you stop confusing your central nervous system by pushing the weight through a false center of gravity.

The13ig13adWolf · 11-28-2005, 01:32 PM

smith machine = waste of space

The Monkey Man · 11-28-2005, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The13ig13adWolf

smith machine = waste of space

- (Don't be so general)

Myztek · 11-28-2005, 01:42 PM

Use logs. ;D

The Monkey Man · 11-28-2005, 01:46 PM

min0 lee · 11-28-2005, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey Man

Hey Monkey, what is that last exercise called?

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 02:01 PM

yeah thats a good leg workout.....

The13ig13adWolf · 11-28-2005, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey Man

- (Don't be so general)

you're right...it would make a good coat rack.

**P-funk** · 11-28-2005, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by min0 lee

Hey Monkey, what is that last exercise called?

it is called a press under.

**P-funk** · 11-28-2005, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The13ig13adWolf

you're right...it would make a good coat rack.

sometimes I do pull ups off the square beam on the top of it to work on my grip. Other then that it is just in my way all the time.

dougnukem · 11-28-2005, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The13ig13adWolf

you're right...it would make a good coat rack.

I use the bar on it for stretching. Since you adjust the level of it, it's great for different stretches.

**CowPimp** · 11-28-2005, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The13ig13adWolf

you're right...it would make a good coat rack.

I disagree. It's too damned big an clunky to make a good coat rack. Hehe.

The13ig13adWolf · 11-28-2005, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I disagree. It's too damned big an clunky to make a good coat rack. Hehe.

The Monkey Man · 11-28-2005, 03:02 PM

I have been using the smith to do hang snatch pulls (shrugs w/a toe raise)

I also have been using it to do stretching for my front squat form
(its helpful to get used to squatting the bar up in a straight line)

Plus for chinups

(and in the winter, I put one in the back of my pickup to aid traction)

The Monkey Man · 11-28-2005, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hlanderr

yeah thats a good leg workout.....

Go ahead and try them then, wise fuck -

If you don't want any advice, dont ask a question shithead!

The13ig13adWolf · 11-28-2005, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey Man

Go ahead and try them then, wise fuck -

If you don't want any advice, dont ask a question shithead!

::cracking up::

Duncans Donuts · 11-28-2005, 04:05 PM

Quote:

I don't like the smith machine. It is crap. The human body doesn't move in perfectly straight lines. You will probably improve your ability to stabilize the weight during a freeweight press if you stop confusing your central nervous system by pushing the weight through a false center of gravity.

Ah, I love the smith machine as a way to change up. Confusion of the central nervous system shouldn't be considered a bad thing. I've always believed that disruption of stasis was the best way to instigate growth anyway. I went through two weeks of doing seated BB military presses followed by burn out style behind the neck presses on a smith machine. The results were good.

The problem with smith machines is with too much weight you could damage a rotator cuff or something because as was said the linearity of a smith machine isn't good for muscles, which create torque. Clearly a lot of effort during a straight press will go to stabilizing joint position and so forth. But that's not necessarily bad for a few weeks. Good smith machines are designed around this and won't be perfectly straight up and down, though it's impossible to have a machine perfectly adapt to the person in question.

Uses sparingly I don't think they're a problem, just be aware of how much weight you use and how your body is reacting to the motion.

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey Man

Go ahead and try them then, wise fuck -

If you don't want any advice, dont ask a question shithead!

what the fuck is wrong with you
im obviously looking for military press
that is NOT a FUCKING military press

i used to do those in HS when i played football.... it uses your legs
since i split my days for legs and shoulders, i wouldnt do that. are you gunna tell me that that doesnt work your legs? thrusting up like that?

just to make it clear: i asked for advice on free weight military press. get it now asshole? all i said was that exercise is good on your legs. your wise ass comments are not fucking appreciated.

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncans Donuts

Ah, I love the smith machine as a way to change up. Confusion of the central nervous system shouldn't be considered a bad thing. I've always believed that disruption of stasis was the best way to instigate growth anyway. I went through two weeks of doing seated BB military presses followed by burn out style behind the neck presses on a smith machine. The results were good.

The problem with smith machines is with too much weight you could damage a rotator cuff or something because as was said the linearity of a smith machine isn't good for muscles, which create torque. Clearly a lot of effort during a straight press will go to stabilizing joint position and so forth. But that's not necessarily bad for a few weeks. Good smith machines are designed around this and won't be perfectly straight up and down, though it's impossible to have a machine perfectly adapt to the person in question.

Uses sparingly I don't think they're a problem, just be aware of how much weight you use and how your body is reacting to the motion.

word man.... very imformative....thanks.... ill mix it up on it... keeps it interesting

i definetly dont think its trash at all..... if it was trash then it wouldnt be in every gym

i do upright rows on it because as i get tired with free weight i start to sway the barbell to one side.... very annoying... i can also get more reps out

The13ig13adWolf · 11-28-2005, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hlanderr

i can also get more reps out

ofcourse you can....cuz it's easier and it takes your stabilizer muscles out of the equation entirely.

Hlanderr · 11-28-2005, 04:21 PM

with a barbell swaying side to side in the last few reps i cant get the same time of lift... i have to stop before i would stop on a smith machine
there i can also do partial reps by swinging the weight up with my legs and slwly lowering it back down
thats kinda dangerous on free weights

try it. to failure. youll see the difference

what is stabalizing anyways... your back muscles? not what is being worked on an upright now? and its not entirely.... you dont have the balance the bar, but your body is still free from any form of a seat or bench... you still need to balance your movements

Duncans Donuts · 11-28-2005, 04:28 PM

Quote:

ofcourse you can....cuz it's easier and it takes your stabilizer muscles out of the equation entirely.

In certain regards, it is more of an isolation exercise. But if you're looking to focus on your shoulders (or whatever muscle), why is there a problem with it? I do isolation movements at times, which allows for more focus on contracting and performing the task at hand, without worrying about ancillary fatigue (so called stabilizer movements) influencing the rest of the work.

11-28-2005, 01:12 PM	#1
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774	military press - smith? free weight? Hey, First of all my favorite exercises are for shoulders and legs.... and for shoulders I have a dilemma thats getting to me. Is it best to do military press with a barbell? Or hit the smith machine? It's the first exerxise I do for my shoulders, and it is in my opinion the best shoulder exercise. So I want to do it right. On the smith machine, which I have been doing for the past few months, is good, but it doesn't seem to make my shoulders feel it as much as a barbell press. But when doing the barbell press, I am unstable sometimes, and the chair moves around a bit from my pushing. Because of this instability, I can't do as much weight on the barbell than smith machine. Is one of the two superior? Which ones do you guys do?
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774

11-28-2005, 01:13 PM	#2
P-funk Patrick Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: AZ Posts: 30,625	barbell
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11-28-2005, 01:29 PM	#5
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774	hollaaaaaaaaaaa easy decision huh ill start doing barbell
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774

11-28-2005, 01:29 PM	#6
CowPimp Fueled by Testosterone Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 15,428	I don't like the smith machine. It is crap. The human body doesn't move in perfectly straight lines. You will probably improve your ability to stabilize the weight during a freeweight press if you stop confusing your central nervous system by pushing the weight through a false center of gravity.
	The only time it's bad to feel the burn is when you're peeing... CowPimp Picks Up Heavy Shit MySpace YouTube Videos

11-28-2005, 01:32 PM	#7
The13ig13adWolf IM Ball Buster Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: I win... Posts: 1,367	smith machine = waste of space
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11-28-2005, 01:18 PM	#3
dougnukem The American Dream Elite Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Fort Walton Beach, FL Posts: 1,802 Photos: 6	BB, most definately.

11-28-2005, 01:22 PM	#4
BulkMeUp ..is bulking up! Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Cana-dah Posts: 5,317	I'v never done BB. I do DB's. Standing.

11-28-2005, 01:42 PM	#9
Myztek Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Mississippi Posts: 143	Use logs. ;D

11-28-2005, 01:46 PM	#10
The Monkey Man Magical Apelikemenace Elite Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: New Delhi, India Posts: 13,791 Photos: 35
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11-28-2005, 02:01 PM	#12
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774	yeah thats a good leg workout.....
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774

11-28-2005, 03:02 PM	#19
The Monkey Man Magical Apelikemenace Elite Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: New Delhi, India Posts: 13,791 Photos: 35	I have been using the smith to do hang snatch pulls (shrugs w/a toe raise) I also have been using it to do stretching for my front squat form (its helpful to get used to squatting the bar up in a straight line) Plus for chinups (and in the winter, I put one in the back of my pickup to aid traction) Last edited by The Monkey Man : 11-28-2005 at 03:34 PM.
	Have Problems?... Chances are its due to overpopulation Save The Oceans, Save the Planet, Save Your Family, Save Yourself!

11-28-2005, 04:21 PM	#26
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774	with a barbell swaying side to side in the last few reps i cant get the same time of lift... i have to stop before i would stop on a smith machine there i can also do partial reps by swinging the weight up with my legs and slwly lowering it back down thats kinda dangerous on free weights try it. to failure. youll see the difference what is stabalizing anyways... your back muscles? not what is being worked on an upright now? and its not entirely.... you dont have the balance the bar, but your body is still free from any form of a seat or bench... you still need to balance your movements
Hlanderr Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 774