Thread: Gym arguement

It really depends. I don't think one can argue definitively one side or the other.

I'm a firm believer of core work. I understand that in order to build and work my core to it's full potential I should not use a belt for most movements. However, with my back problems I find it so much better to wear one. Obviously for me it's a medical issue, but I would never argue with another about it.

I don't squat any longer but I do deads with a belt. It takes away the fear for me. Without the belt I would've given up deads too. That would've sucked.

Originally Posted by largepkg

It really depends. I don't think one can argue definitively one side or the other.

I'm a firm believer of core work. I understand that in order to build and work my core to it's full potential I should not use a belt for most movements. However, with my back problems I find it so much better to wear one. Obviously for me it's a medical issue, but I would never argue with another about it.

I don't squat any longer but I do deads with a belt. It takes away the fear for me. Without the belt I would've given up deads too. That would've sucked.

Well yeah, by all means, I would use a belt if I had a bad back.

Originally Posted by fufu

So today I got into a civilized arguement with a guy about wearing a belt during squats and deadlifts. He said to always wear a belt when doing them. I said I never wear a belt and he gave me a "look". I tried arguing that you should only wear a belt if you are within 1-3 rep ME, personally I don't even then. He talked about how you must wear a belt blah blah and I was kind of poor in presenting my facts on why you shouldn't. I tried to explain how you have to have a strong posterior chain and wearing a belt takes your lower back out of the equation so it becomes weaker and creates an unbalance. I would have liked to say that but I ended up sounding like some misinformed kid.

So what is a good plan of attack for going about a debate like this?

I never bother to debate topics like that at a gym, but if he came up to me when I was lifting and started telling me how to lift I would just smile and tell him his opinions were interisting.

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

I never bother to debate topics like that at a gym, but if he came up to me when I was lifting and started telling me how to lift I would just smile and tell him his opinions were interisting.

Well I wouldn't screw out my workout over it but still it is a topic that comes up with my friends sometimes outside of the gym.

Today this kid asked me to spot him, so I did and we got talking and he told me how he was gonna get a routine soon, I asked him what, he told me that he was getting a body part routine made up and they are the best and they are awesome and bla blah blah. I just smiled and went back to my workout!

Originally Posted by fufu

So today I got into a civilized arguement with a guy about wearing a belt during squats and deadlifts. He said to always wear a belt when doing them. I said I never wear a belt and he gave me a "look". I tried arguing that you should only wear a belt if you are within 1-3 rep ME, personally I don't even then. He talked about how you must wear a belt blah blah and I was kind of poor in presenting my facts on why you shouldn't. I tried to explain how you have to have a strong posterior chain and wearing a belt takes your lower back out of the equation so it becomes weaker and creates an unbalance. I would have liked to say that but I ended up sounding like some misinformed kid.

So what is a good plan of attack for going about a debate like this?

i agree with you.

Originally Posted by MyK

Today this kid asked me to spot him, so I did and we got talking and he told me how he was gonna get a routine soon, I asked him what, he told me that he was getting a body part routine made up and they are the best and they are awesome and bla blah blah. I just smiled and went back to my workout!

That's cute.

Originally Posted by The13ig13adWolf

i agree with you.

thats how you would debate??

Originally Posted by fufu

So today I got into a civilized arguement with a guy about wearing a belt during squats and deadlifts. He said to always wear a belt when doing them. I said I never wear a belt and he gave me a "look". I tried arguing that you should only wear a belt if you are within 1-3 rep ME, personally I don't even then. He talked about how you must wear a belt blah blah and I was kind of poor in presenting my facts on why you shouldn't. I tried to explain how you have to have a strong posterior chain and wearing a belt takes your lower back out of the equation so it becomes weaker and creates an unbalance. I would have liked to say that but I ended up sounding like some misinformed kid.

So what is a good plan of attack for going about a debate like this?

I would probably ask him why he uses a belt, specifically. If he mentions protecting his back, say something like, "Oh, so it helps by taking some of the load off the back, right?" He agrees and I say, "So the point of working out is to put a load on a muscle or group of muscles. After all, they can't get bigger without resistance, right?" Again, he should agree. Then I'd say, "So if the point of lifting is to put a strain on a muscle or group of muscles in the form of resistance, which is the only way to make it grow in size or strength, and the belt takes that stress away, why use a belt? Medical reasons and special cases are fine, but why take away the very thing that will help us achieve our goals?" And then maybe he would see what I'm saying, or maybe he would sit there and try to tell me to be respectful to my elders, in which case I would be forced to reply again. And so on...

Originally Posted by Squaggleboggin

I would probably ask him why he uses a belt, specifically. If he mentions protecting his back, say something like, "Oh, so it helps by taking some of the load off the back, right?" He agrees and I say, "So the point of working out is to put a load on a muscle or group of muscles. After all, they can't get bigger without resistance, right?" Again, he should agree. Then I'd say, "So if the point of lifting is to put a strain on a muscle or group of muscles in the form of resistance, which is the only way to make it grow in size or strength, and the belt takes that stress away, why use a belt? Medical reasons and special cases are fine, but why take away the very thing that will help us achieve our goals?" And then maybe he would see what I'm saying, or maybe he would sit there and try to tell me to be respectful to my elders, in which case I would be forced to reply again. And so on...

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

I never bother to debate topics like that at a gym, but if he came up to me when I was lifting and started telling me how to lift I would just smile and tell him his opinions were interisting.

Yup same here, I never debate in a gym. Got my mp3 cranked, no one bothers me. F**k em

I'm a decently aggressive girl, but I do avoid gym fights when possible. Just seems like they wise thing to do when the other guy has an extra helping of aggression, and a decent chance of carrying a knife.

Originally Posted by ablc

I'm a decently aggressive girl, but I do avoid gym fights when possible. Just seems like they wise thing to do when the other guy has an extra helping of aggression, and a decent chance of carrying a knife.

It wasn't a "fight" at all. We were the only two people in the gym and we were talking about training and such in between sets. Plus the guy was a cop.

Nothing like a good arguement to give the brain some exercise.

I would explain to him that using a belt ALL the time leads to it becoming a crutch. You don't develop the level of core stability that you should have for dealing with heavy weights. Yes, a belt increases intrabdominal pressure and helps stabilize your spine, but at the same time you will lack the strength to do so without the belt if such a situation ever arises.

Also, if this means anything to you, the textbook I'm studying to get my PT certification defines two criteria for the usage of a lifting belt:

The exercise loads the trunk: overhead pressing, deadlifts, squats, etc.
You are lifting at 90% of your 1RM or greater.

This recommendation is backed by numerous studies.

You should also explain to him that by developing musculature that dynamically and statically stabilizes your core to a fuller extent, you are reducing the chance of injury outside of the gym. You will most likely maintain better posture, improved lifting mechanics, and of course have that additional stabilization effect when you aren't wearing the belt.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I would explain to him that using a belt ALL the time leads to it becoming a crutch. You don't develop the level of core stability that you should have for dealing with heavy weights. Yes, a belt increases intrabdominal pressure and helps stabilize your spine, but at the same time you will lack the strength to do so without the belt if such a situation ever arises.

Also, if this means anything to you, the textbook I'm studying to get my PT certification defines two criteria for the usage of a lifting belt:

The exercise loads the trunk: overhead pressing, deadlifts, squats, etc.
You are lifting at 90% of your 1RM or greater.

This recommendation is backed by numerous studies.

You should also explain to him that by developing musculature that dynamically and statically stabilizes your core to a fuller extent, you are reducing the chance of injury outside of the gym. You will most likely maintain better posture, improved lifting mechanics, and of course have that additional stabilization effect when you aren't wearing the belt.

Know it all!

Originally Posted by ablc

I'm a decently aggressive girl, but I do avoid gym fights when possible. Just seems like they wise thing to do when the other guy has an extra helping of aggression, and a decent chance of carrying a knife.

do people often stab each other at your gym? maybe its time to get a membership somewhere else............

Originally Posted by squanto

do people often stab each other at your gym? maybe its time to get a membership somewhere else............

I bet nobody hogs the equipment there....

I agree w/ the above. I don't wear a belt unless I am gonna be doing a weight that I can only do for sets of 5 or less.

I see people wearing belts for EVERYTHING...'um...you're benching..WTF are you wearing a belt for???'
i just found its better to let them do their thing..and gives me a mild distraction between sets.

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

I never bother to debate topics like that at a gym, but if he came up to me when I was lifting and started telling me how to lift I would just smile and tell him his opinions were interisting.

Exactly.

Some dude came up to me a while ago and told me I should restrict my range of motion to avoid injury. I just looked at him with a blank stare, I thought about saying something really sarcastic but didn't. After a few seconds he could see I wasn't going to respond, so he said something like "Man, I used to be a personal trainer back in the day. I aint bullshittin you are nuttin." Then I just gave him another blank stare and he left me alone.

I would wear headphones so people don't talk to me.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I would explain to him that using a belt ALL the time leads to it becoming a crutch. You don't develop the level of core stability that you should have for dealing with heavy weights. Yes, a belt increases intrabdominal pressure and helps stabilize your spine, but at the same time you will lack the strength to do so without the belt if such a situation ever arises.

Also, if this means anything to you, the textbook I'm studying to get my PT certification defines two criteria for the usage of a lifting belt:

The exercise loads the trunk: overhead pressing, deadlifts, squats, etc.
You are lifting at 90% of your 1RM or greater.

This recommendation is backed by numerous studies.

You should also explain to him that by developing musculature that dynamically and statically stabilizes your core to a fuller extent, you are reducing the chance of injury outside of the gym. You will most likely maintain better posture, improved lifting mechanics, and of course have that additional stabilization effect when you aren't wearing the belt.

Thank you, another quality repsonse. Exactly what I'm looking for.

Originally Posted by clemson357

Exactly.

Some dude came up to me a while ago and told me I should restrict my range of motion to avoid injury. I just looked at him with a blank stare, I thought about saying something really sarcastic but didn't. After a few seconds he could see I wasn't going to respond, so he said something like "Man, I used to be a personal trainer back in the day. I aint bullshittin you are nuttin." Then I just gave him another blank stare and he left me alone.

What a tool.

Let me just say this: I do agree about the not wearing the belt unless you are lifting at 90% plus.

But I look at it like this:

If I am doing squats, I am trying to get a good leg workout, not a core workout.
You see what I am saying? If I want to do core work, then I do it seperately.
I think belts should be used to make sure you are being safe.
You can always do exercises to work your core.

Thats just my opinion.

myCATpowerlifts - i agree with what you are saying. When doing squats, I will wear a belt, but I prefer not to when doing deadlifts.

The thing that really gets me are people who wear a belt irrespective of what exercise they are doing.

Originally Posted by MyK

thats how you would debate??

did you read anything prior to the last sentence of his first post?

Originally Posted by myCATpowerlifts

Let me just say this: I do agree about the not wearing the belt unless you are lifting at 90% plus.

But I look at it like this:

If I am doing squats, I am trying to get a good leg workout, not a core workout.
You see what I am saying? If I want to do core work, then I do it seperately.
I think belts should be used to make sure you are being safe.
You can always do exercises to work your core.

Thats just my opinion.

why would you want to work it separately? to spend unnecessary time in the gym? eliminating your core from an exercise and not enabling it to be doing what it's supposed to be doing throughout a squat or a deadlift is not being safe.

Originally Posted by myCATpowerlifts

Let me just say this: I do agree about the not wearing the belt unless you are lifting at 90% plus.

But I look at it like this:

If I am doing squats, I am trying to get a good leg workout, not a core workout.
You see what I am saying? If I want to do core work, then I do it seperately.
I think belts should be used to make sure you are being safe.
You can always do exercises to work your core.

Thats just my opinion.

If you're going to take the core out of the equation, why not just use machines and spend even more time doing separate core exercises? Isn't that the whole point of compound movements?

The points you made were all valid.

Whats the problem? You wear a belt if and when you need it.

There is no one *right* answer here. It's situationally-dependent.

(this is what big-bad-wolf was referring to, in her terse comment).


I also am single-minded when I workout. Somebody walks up to me and starts to debade a move or talk about their training, I politely nod. Its not your place to train them, and you're breaking up the rhythm of your training session.

Like Dale, I wear headphones to dissuade unnecessary interruptions.