Hack Squats

katt · 05-15-2006, 11:09 AM

Ok - so when I do hack squats, I only go parallel and then come back up. But I was watching a training video of Chris Comier before he did the 2004 Mr Olympia and he was going all the way down on his... Ok, so I've alway's heard (maybe false rumor) that if girls/guys did go below parallel on these and regular squats, it would give you the "boxy glute" look...

Is this true? Or should I be going below parallel for my hack squats for better development???

Seanp156 · 05-15-2006, 11:14 AM

I'm pretty sure whether you have a "boxy glute" look will be determined by your genetics, and your overall muscle size (and possibly BF%)... Most people around here will tell you the more range of motion, the better... Personally, I can't stand hack squats because they feel like hell on my knees, I'd much rather back squat, front squat, or leg press any time.

katt · 05-15-2006, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seanp156

I'm pretty sure whether you have a "boxy glute" look will be determined by your genetics, and your overall muscle size (and possibly BF%)... Most people around here will tell you the more range of motion, the better... Personally, I can't stand hack squats because they feel like hell on my knees, I'd much rather back squat, front squat, or leg press any time.

Thanks Sean.. I don't mind hacks,, but I can't do front squats - the position hurts my shoulders... I'll just have to try the full rom and see how it feels!

Bakerboy · 05-15-2006, 01:24 PM

Not sure about your hack squat question, as I don't do them, but from looking at your avitar you look like you are doing something right! Wow!

Favre · 05-15-2006, 01:28 PM

I bottom out on the hack squats but I don't go super heavy on them. They are hard on the knees. I do like them though. Some advice - start taking glucosamine/chondroitin everyday if you're not already.

katt · 05-15-2006, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Favre

I bottom out on the hack squats but I don't go super heavy on them. They are hard on the knees. I do like them though. Some advice - start taking glucosamine/chondroitin everyday if you're not already.

my husband takes glucosamine already - he has some joint issues... but I don't... Will taking this prevent them in the future if I don't have any problems with it now?

Favre · 05-15-2006, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by katt

my husband takes glucosamine already - he has some joint issues... but I don't... Will taking this prevent them in the future if I don't have any problems with it now?

Well speaking from past experience, I was doing hack squats exclusively for probably 3 years straight every week. I swore off back squats cause no matter how I did them with foot placement and what have you, they made the rear end grow more than anything else. Something I didn't really want. (This was before I discovered front squats)

Eventually though, as I got stonger with hacks and put on more weight my knees really began to hurt but I kept doing them anyways cause I liked the results. I was young and dumb. The pain got bad enough that I had to start using less and less weight but I kept doing them until finally I couldn't take it anymore. I stopped doing them for a good month and started taking a lot of glucosamine/chondroitin. I started back with front squats after a month off from squatting and still had a little pain but nothing compared to hacks. After about 2 months the pain in my knees was gone and I've been doing hacks and front squats for the past couple years since.

So, yeah I'd say if you're doing regular lifting and want to keep doing it especially squatting then it's worth taking glucosamine/chondroitin. It's one of the few supplements that works IMO. I've heard you can cycle it and you don't have to take it everyday but I do anyways cause I don't want to be feeling that knee pain again.

**gopro** · 05-15-2006, 02:03 PM

I go rock bottom on hack squats. By the nature of the angle, hip/quads placement, and plane of motion, you will not engage the glutes like you would on regular squats.

For 15 years I have gone hamstrings to calves on Hacks and my glutes are not effected.

katt · 05-15-2006, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Favre

Well speaking from past experience, I was doing hack squats exclusively for probably 3 years straight every week. I swore off back squats cause no matter how I did them with foot placement and what have you, they made the rear end grow more than anything else. Something I didn't really want. (This was before I discovered front squats)

Eventually though, as I got stonger with hacks and put on more weight my knees really began to hurt but I kept doing them anyways cause I liked the results. I was young and dumb. The pain got bad enough that I had to start using less and less weight but I kept doing them until finally I couldn't take it anymore. I stopped doing them for a good month and started taking a lot of glucosamine/chondroitin. I started back with front squats after a month off from squatting and still had a little pain but nothing compared to hacks. After about 2 months the pain in my knees was gone and I've been doing hacks and front squats for the past couple years since.

So, yeah I'd say if you're doing regular lifting and want to keep doing it especially squatting then it's worth taking glucosamine/chondroitin. It's one of the few supplements that works IMO. I've heard you can cycle it and you don't have to take it everyday but I do anyways cause I don't want to be feeling that knee pain again.

Ok - thanks for the opinion - it may be a good idea to take for "preventative medicine"

katt · 05-15-2006, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gopro

I go rock bottom on hack squats. By the nature of the angle, hip/quads placement, and plane of motion, you will not engage the glutes like you would on regular squats.

For 15 years I have gone hamstrings to calves on Hacks and my glutes are not effected.

Thanks - so as far as foot placement - I always have my legs shoulder width apart - should that be varied with a wider stance in your opinion or does this matter?

**Gazhole** · 05-15-2006, 03:09 PM

I do as full ROM for hacks as i can, same foot stance as you - about shoulder width, but dont find it uses the glutes any more that regular squats do really.

Cheers to Favre for the heads up about knee pain though. Ill watch out for that.

Tough Old Man · 05-15-2006, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gopro

I go rock bottom on hack squats. By the nature of the angle, hip/quads placement, and plane of motion, you will not engage the glutes like you would on regular squats.

For 15 years I have gone hamstrings to calves on Hacks and my glutes are not effected.

I agree. All the way down and all the way back up is the only way. I also found that The hack is easier on my knees if i go all the way down.

**gopro** · 05-16-2006, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by katt

Thanks - so as far as foot placement - I always have my legs shoulder width apart - should that be varied with a wider stance in your opinion or does this matter?

Varying the stance is a good idea. By going wider you can work some of the inner thigh musculature to a greater degree, and by going closer will affect a bit more stimulation of the vastus lateralis, which helps with outer thigh sweep.

**gopro** · 05-16-2006, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tough Old Man

I agree. All the way down and all the way back up is the only way. I also found that The hack is easier on my knees if i go all the way down.

Same for me. No knee problems doing them full ROM. The key is a controlled descent.

**CowPimp** · 05-16-2006, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gopro

Varying the stance is a good idea. By going wider you can work some of the inner thigh musculature to a greater degree, and by going closer will affect a bit more stimulation of the vastus lateralis, which helps with outer thigh sweep.

I would think due to the fact that you don't have to stabilize the weight it would limit the effectiveness of a hack squat done with a wider stance to involve the hip adductors to a larger degree.

Also, I disagree that a closer stance will involve the vastus lateralis more, but we won't get into that, heh.

katt · 05-16-2006, 12:20 PM

Ok I won't ask why it wouldn't target the vastus lateralis, because I thought it would as well if your feet where positioned closer together..... but, cow pimp,, if you want to offer..

**CowPimp** · 05-16-2006, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by katt

Ok I won't ask why it wouldn't target the vastus lateralis, because I thought it would as well if your feet where positioned closer together..... but, cow pimp,, if you want to offer..

All 4 heads of the quadriceps insert into the same place, and 3 of the 4 heads (The lateralis being one of them) originate from the femur bone. So, the position of your leg doesn't alter the length-tension relationship in any way, though it might conceivably do so for the rectus femoris since it originates above the hip joint.

katt · 05-16-2006, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

All 4 heads of the quadriceps insert into the same place, and 3 of the 4 heads (The lateralis being one of them) originate from the femur bone. So, the position of your leg doesn't alter the length-tension relationship in any way, though it might conceivably do so for the rectus femoris since it originates above the hip joint.

Gotcha

Still learning

**gopro** · 05-16-2006, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I would think due to the fact that you don't have to stabilize the weight it would limit the effectiveness of a hack squat done with a wider stance to involve the hip adductors to a larger degree.

Also, I disagree that a closer stance will involve the vastus lateralis more, but we won't get into that, heh.

All you need to do is try wide leg hack squats once (or leg presses), and you will know that it more effectively involves the adductors...maybe not to an EQUAL degree as free weight squats, but still, to a decent degree.

As for close stance not affecting the vastus lateralis more...I remain a believer in EMG studies and anectodal evidence that has been presented again and again for many years.

Not EVERYTHING is explainable through simple length-tension relationships. Varying motor unit pools can be activated uniquely through changes in stances and grips.

But, like you said...agree to disagree.

**CowPimp** · 05-17-2006, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gopro

All you need to do is try wide leg hack squats once (or leg presses), and you will know that it more effectively involves the adductors...maybe not to an EQUAL degree as free weight squats, but still, to a decent degree.

Yeah, I wouldn't doubt this is the case. I meant what I said relative to freeweights, but I see now the way I phrased it kind of exaggerated my intentions. When I said limit, I didn't mean cripple, but that's kind of how it came off. Heh.

Quote:

As for close stance not affecting the vastus lateralis more...I remain a believer in EMG studies and anectodal evidence that has been presented again and again for many years.

Not EVERYTHING is explainable through simple length-tension relationships. Varying motor unit pools can be activated uniquely through changes in stances and grips.

But, like you said...agree to disagree.

Fair enough. I do think EMGs have some bearing, but it's not really enough to convince me that such is the case. I certainly respect the origin of your thoughts on the matter though. Perhaps I will change my mind one day. I'm certainly open to the possibility via some type of manipulation of MU recruitment.

**gopro** · 05-17-2006, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Yeah, I wouldn't doubt this is the case. I meant what I said relative to freeweights, but I see now the way I phrased it kind of exaggerated my intentions. When I said limit, I didn't mean cripple, but that's kind of how it came off. Heh.

Fair enough. I do think EMGs have some bearing, but it's not really enough to convince me that such is the case. I certainly respect the origin of your thoughts on the matter though. Perhaps I will change my mind one day. I'm certainly open to the possibility via some type of manipulation of MU recruitment.

As long as you keep an open mind my friend, that is all I can ask, LOL!

05-15-2006, 11:09 AM	#1
katt Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 4,121 Photos: 37	Hack Squats Ok - so when I do hack squats, I only go parallel and then come back up. But I was watching a training video of Chris Comier before he did the 2004 Mr Olympia and he was going all the way down on his... Ok, so I've alway's heard (maybe false rumor) that if girls/guys did go below parallel on these and regular squats, it would give you the "boxy glute" look... Is this true? Or should I be going below parallel for my hack squats for better development???

05-15-2006, 11:14 AM	#2
Seanp156 Myostatin Whore Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 6,266 Photos: 11	I'm pretty sure whether you have a "boxy glute" look will be determined by your genetics, and your overall muscle size (and possibly BF%)... Most people around here will tell you the more range of motion, the better... Personally, I can't stand hack squats because they feel like hell on my knees, I'd much rather back squat, front squat, or leg press any time.
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05-15-2006, 02:03 PM	#8
gopro NGA/IFPA Pro Bodybuilder Moderator Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Ft. Lauderdale Florida Posts: 10,521	I go rock bottom on hack squats. By the nature of the angle, hip/quads placement, and plane of motion, you will not engage the glutes like you would on regular squats. For 15 years I have gone hamstrings to calves on Hacks and my glutes are not effected.
	Monthly columnist for Muscular Development and Ironman magazines. GOLIATH LABS Sponsored Athlete/Board Rep www.prrstraining.com Time to GROW Without Plateau! Personal Training Gopro is available for online personal training, dietary guidance, and contest prep coaching. Send me a PM or e-mail if interested. Thank you.

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05-15-2006, 01:24 PM	#4
Bakerboy cat burglar Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: the city of champions Posts: 4,146 Photos: 3	Not sure about your hack squat question, as I don't do them, but from looking at your avitar you look like you are doing something right! Wow!

05-15-2006, 01:28 PM	#5
Favre 3 Join Date: May 2005 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 141 Photos: 3	I bottom out on the hack squats but I don't go super heavy on them. They are hard on the knees. I do like them though. Some advice - start taking glucosamine/chondroitin everyday if you're not already.

05-16-2006, 12:20 PM	#16
katt Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 4,121 Photos: 37	Ok I won't ask why it wouldn't target the vastus lateralis, because I thought it would as well if your feet where positioned closer together..... but, cow pimp,, if you want to offer..