Thread: How does my routine look?

i'm just a novice....but i can tell you one thing you are going to get criticized about.....you routine doesn't incorporate the push pull concept that most people follow here.

Well, I'm not a big fan of an arm day, but if you really find them lagging or something, then see how it works for you. I don't really consider CG bench pressing a tricep exercise, even if it does involve more tricep action than a standard bench press.

I feel like you should throw in some rear delt work rather than throwing in front and lateral delt work. Most people have lagging rear delts if anything.

Your balance of pushing to pulling is pretty decent. However, I think you should get some more hammy dominant moves in there. With a herniated disk, consider things like reverse DB lunging, stepups, and possibly pullthroughs. Also, I wouldn't superset the two big compound leg movements you have. If anything, superset those isolation moves and do them after the lunging and squats.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Well, I'm not a big fan of an arm day, but if you really find them lagging or something, then see how it works for you. I don't really consider CG bench pressing a tricep exercise, even if it does involve more tricep action than a standard bench press.

I feel like you should throw in some rear delt work rather than throwing in front and lateral delt work. Most people have lagging rear delts if anything.

Your balance of pushing to pulling is pretty decent. However, I think you should get some more hammy dominant moves in there. With a herniated disk, consider things like reverse DB lunging, stepups, and possibly pullthroughs. Also, I wouldn't superset the two big compound leg movements you have. If anything, superset those isolation moves and do them after the lunging and squats.

I'm curious about the CG bench comment Cowpimp. Could you explain further why it's not a tri move?

I wouldnt use this type of split, but if you want to, you need to even and cut some of the exercises out
Monday--Arms

EZ Bar Curl 3x8
Incline Hammer Curls 2x8
Tricep Rope Pushdown 3x8
Skull Crushers 2x8

Tuesday--Legs

DB Squats 3x10
DB Lunges 3x10
Leg Extensions 2x10
Leg Curls 2x10
Seated Calf Raise 4x10

Thursday--Chest/Shoulders

Flat Bench 3x8
Incline Bench 3x8
Shoulder Press 3x8
Flys- 3x10
Lateral Raises 3x10

Friday--Back
T Bar Row--3x8
Seated Machine Row 3x10
Pull Ups 3x10
Reverse Flys 3x10
Shrugs 3x10

im telling you your better off doing total body or upper/lower

Originally Posted by Pedigree

I'm curious about the CG bench comment Cowpimp. Could you explain further why it's not a tri move?

I'm going to throw that question back at you: why is it a tricep move? Just because it recruits more tricep than a wider grip bench press? That doesn't make sense. You are still using a lot of chest and anterior delt to move the bar via shoulder flexion.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I'm going to throw that question back at you: why is it a tricep move? Just because it recruits more tricep than a wider grip bench press? That doesn't make sense. You are still using a lot of chest and anterior delt to move the bar via shoulder flexion.

I agree with the front delt and chest use in CG bench, but isn't that true with almost any lift? I mean, dips are widely considered a tri move, but also utilize the chest and front delts.
Where do skullcrushers fit into your program design?
Regular flat bench involves chest, delts, tris, and back. So, do you consider bench a chest move or a delt move?
Isn't it true that all compound lifts utilize more than one muscle group?
With your logic, it would be fair to say that since squats also incorporate the lower back and abs, they're a lower back/ab move, just because the abs are involved in the lift. Talk about something not making any sense.
How about answering my questions instead of "throwing my question back at me"?

What CowPimp is saying makes perfect sense. All compound movements involve more than one muscle group (which is why they're called compound), but there is always a "primary" muscle group that the exercise is designed to promote development of. Any bench press, whether CG or standard is *primarily* a chest exercise. The fact that it recruits the triceps to *assist* the lift doesn't make it a tricep exercise.

Dips are the other way around - triceps are the primary focus, but yes it does use chest muscles to *assist*.

Originally Posted by willapp

What CowPimp is saying makes perfect sense. All compound movements involve more than one muscle group (which is why they're called compound), but there is always a "primary" muscle group that the exercise is designed to promote development of. Any bench press, whether CG or standard is *primarily* a chest exercise. The fact that it recruits the triceps to *assist* the lift doesn't make it a tricep exercise.

Dips are the other way around - triceps are the primary focus, but yes it does use chest muscles to *assist*.

I'm pretty sure I covered the definition of compound moves in my posts, but thanks for explaining it again.
Unfortunately, you're wrong. The tris are the primary mover in close-grip bench.

Fairplay, it seems you are right:

http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...enchPress.html

I've never done them as a tricep exercise though, probably just personal preference.

Originally Posted by willapp

Fairplay, it seems you are right:

http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...enchPress.html

I've never done them as a tricep exercise though, probably just personal preference.

Originally Posted by Pedigree

I agree with the front delt and chest use in CG bench, but isn't that true with almost any lift? I mean, dips are widely considered a tri move, but also utilize the chest and front delts.
Where do skullcrushers fit into your program design?
Regular flat bench involves chest, delts, tris, and back. So, do you consider bench a chest move or a delt move?
Isn't it true that all compound lifts utilize more than one muscle group?
With your logic, it would be fair to say that since squats also incorporate the lower back and abs, they're a lower back/ab move, just because the abs are involved in the lift. Talk about something not making any sense.
How about answering my questions instead of "throwing my question back at me"?

I would never consider dips a tricep move for the same reasons mentioned about the CG bench press.

Some people use their delts to such a large extent when they are bench pressing that their chest does considerably less work than it should. So to answer your question, it depends on the biomechanics of the person in question.

Skullcrushers would be a tricep move because they are an isolation exercise. It's just plain old elbow extension.

Your lower back and abs are merely stabilizers during the squat. They contract isometrically, just like they do when you deadlift, overhead press, or do any exercise standing.

This is why I say designating exercises according to body part is pretty stupid when you're talking compound lifts. So many people train deadlifts on back day. Why? Nothing in your back is a prime mover; everything is merely maintaining a static contraction. Your glutes and hamstrings are the prime movers in this lift.

I did answer it, and then I threw it back at you.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

This is why I say designating exercises according to body part is pretty stupid when you're talking compound lifts.

exactly. train movements, not bodyparts

What's a better 4 days split then?

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I would never consider dips a tricep move for the same reasons mentioned about the CG bench press.

Some people use their delts to such a large extent when they are bench pressing that their chest does considerably less work than it should. So to answer your question, it depends on the biomechanics of the person in question.

Skullcrushers would be a tricep move because they are an isolation exercise. It's just plain old elbow extension.

Your lower back and abs are merely stabilizers during the squat. They contract isometrically, just like they do when you deadlift, overhead press, or do any exercise standing.

This is why I say designating exercises according to body part is pretty stupid when you're talking compound lifts. So many people train deadlifts on back day. Why? Nothing in your back is a prime mover; everything is merely maintaining a static contraction. Your glutes and hamstrings are the prime movers in this lift.

I did answer it, and then I threw it back at you.

I totally agree with movements as opposed to body parts. BP splits suck. Besides, that was never in question.
Are you actually saying that triceps aren't the primary mover in dips? WOW! I'm amazed that a guy who has many people convinced that he knows what he's talking about could be so wrong about something so simple...and obvious. Do you have knowledge? Sure...you've made some great points in many of the threads I've read. Are you right about everything all of the time? Obviously not, especially in this case. It's just a shame that you won't man up and admit it. It doesn't make you less knowledgable or less credible, so just be honest with yourself and all of the people who believe every word you say with regard to training.
The triceps are the primary movers in close-grip bench. The triceps are also the primary movers in dips, with the pecs, anterior delts, even lats and rhomboids being involved as well.
Now for the biomechanics part. A guy who is 5'8", 165 pounds does close-grip bench, and a guy 6' 3", 235 pounds does close-grip bench. Relative to their body structure, their hands are placed in exactly the same location on the bar. How would the biomechanics differ?

Originally Posted by Pedigree

I'm curious about the CG bench comment Cowpimp. Could you explain further why it's not a tri move?

I think CG Benches and dips iare one of the best tricep builders there is.

Originally Posted by Pedigree

I totally agree with movements as opposed to body parts. BP splits suck. Besides, that was never in question.
Are you actually saying that triceps aren't the primary mover in dips? WOW! I'm amazed that a guy who has many people convinced that he knows what he's talking about could be so wrong about something so simple...and obvious. Do you have knowledge? Sure...you've made some great points in many of the threads I've read. Are you right about everything all of the time? Obviously not, especially in this case. It's just a shame that you won't man up and admit it. It doesn't make you less knowledgable or less credible, so just be honest with yourself and all of the people who believe every word you say with regard to training.

I never said that the triceps weren't a prime mover in dips; don't put words in my mouth. All I said was classifying them as a tricep movement is stupid. If you want to isolate your arms then do it, but don't add in more pressing when you already probably have too much because some BB magazine told you the CG bench press and dips are tricep exercises.

There are multiple primer movers in dips, and which one is doing the most work largely depends on what the joint angles are during the lift and individual biomechanics. At the very beginning of the lift they aren't doing too much, there is more shoulder flexion taking place then elbow extension. As you near lockout the triceps begin to take over more. This doesn't necessarily make them "the" prime mover.

The triceps are the primary movers in close-grip bench. The triceps are also the primary movers in dips, with the pecs, anterior delts, even lats and rhomboids being involved as well.

Exactly my point. They are all primary movers. Why are you designating it as a tricep exercise though? Just because your triceps are required to do more work in a CG bench press relative to a regular bench press doesn't necessarily mean they are doing the most work overall. Maybe they are, but I still feel classifying them as a body part exercise makes no sense for this reason.

Now for the biomechanics part. A guy who is 5'8", 165 pounds does close-grip bench, and a guy 6' 3", 235 pounds does close-grip bench. Relative to their body structure, their hands are placed in exactly the same location on the bar. How would the biomechanics differ?

Height and weight don't really say anything. A fatass is going to use more tricep than if he were a skinny guy with the same bone structure and muscle attachments simply because his ROM will be restricted, but that's about all I can tell you in that regard. Insertion and origins of muscles and joint structure have more to do with it than height and weight. As well, inherent fibers types within each major muscle group has a lot to do with it. Whichever muscle can produce more force at a certain joint angle, whether it be a result of it creating a more efficient lever or because it can simply produce more force due to it's faster twitch makeup, your body will use as much as it can; the body likes to be efficient.

Originally Posted by Tough Old Man

I think CG Benches and dips iare one of the best tricep builders there is.

I'm not suggesting that those movements don't help you develop your triceps. I'm simply saying that categorizing them as a tricep exercise doesn't make sense. They are pressing movements. I also think overhead pressing makes for a great tricep builder, but I still wouldn't call it a tricep exercise.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

... I also think overhead pressing makes for a great tricep builder, but I still wouldn't call it a tricep exercise.

True. Not many people talk about this. I also think handstand pushups are great for building triceps.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I never said that the triceps weren't a prime mover in dips; don't put words in my mouth. All I said was classifying them as a tricep movement is stupid. If you want to isolate your arms then do it, but don't add in more pressing when you already probably have too much because some BB magazine told you the CG bench press and dips are tricep exercises.

There are multiple primer movers in dips, and which one is doing the most work largely depends on what the joint angles are during the lift and individual biomechanics. At the very beginning of the lift they aren't doing too much, there is more shoulder flexion taking place then elbow extension. As you near lockout the triceps begin to take over more. This doesn't necessarily make them "the" prime mover.




Exactly my point. They are all primary movers. Why are you designating it as a tricep exercise though? Just because your triceps are required to do more work in a CG bench press relative to a regular bench press doesn't necessarily mean they are doing the most work overall. Maybe they are, but I still feel classifying them as a body part exercise makes no sense for this reason.




Height and weight don't really say anything. A fatass is going to use more tricep than if he were a skinny guy with the same bone structure and muscle attachments simply because his ROM will be restricted, but that's about all I can tell you in that regard. Insertion and origins of muscles and joint structure have more to do with it than height and weight. As well, inherent fibers types within each major muscle group has a lot to do with it. Whichever muscle can produce more force at a certain joint angle, whether it be a result of it creating a more efficient lever or because it can simply produce more force due to it's faster twitch makeup, your body will use as much as it can; the body likes to be efficient.

First of all, I do 3 total sets of biceps iso moves and 3 total sets of tricep iso moves per 7 days...that's it. I know thaty compound moves will build arms effectively.
Second of all, I don't read a single BBing mag...they're as gay and almost as annoying as a know-it-all. However, I do read journals and articles written by doctors and respected trainers and strength conditioning experts.
In my programs, I pull at least as much as I push. I'm 35 and have quite a bit of training knowledge myself. So, before you go assuming I'm some 15 year old know-nothing, you might want to know who you're talking to. For future reference, don't treat me like sh*t just because I challenged you and you're pi*sed off. The next time you're wrong, I'll do it again, so get used to it.
And last, I'll let you go on believing that dips and close grip bench are primarily chest moves, delt moves, or whatever it is that you believe.

pedigree- you are a dumbass, do you even understand what he is saying? He never said that CG Bench is primarily a chest or delt exercise, he is saying CG Bench uses alot more muscles than just triceps, so you cannot say it is a tricep exercise, thats exactly why bodypart training is stupid and every one is starting to train with movements, so shutup you 35 year old know nothing.

Originally Posted by mike456

pedigree- you are a dumbass, do you even understand what he is saying? He never said that CG Bench is primarily a chest or delt exercise, he is saying CG Bench uses alot more muscles than just triceps, so you cannot say it is a tricep exercise, thats exactly why bodypart training is stupid and every one is starting to train with movements, so shutup you 35 year old know nothing.

Name calling! Nice!

So since my workout apparentyly isn't that great, could someone build me a good 4 day workout keeping in mind I'm limited due to a herniated disc.

???

Originally Posted by Pedigree

First of all, I do 3 total sets of biceps iso moves and 3 total sets of tricep iso moves per 7 days...that's it. I know thaty compound moves will build arms effectively.
Second of all, I don't read a single BBing mag...they're as gay and almost as annoying as a know-it-all. However, I do read journals and articles written by doctors and respected trainers and strength conditioning experts.
In my programs, I pull at least as much as I push. I'm 35 and have quite a bit of training knowledge myself. So, before you go assuming I'm some 15 year old know-nothing, you might want to know who you're talking to. For future reference, don't treat me like sh*t just because I challenged you and you're pi*sed off. The next time you're wrong, I'll do it again, so get used to it.
And last, I'll let you go on believing that dips and close grip bench are primarily chest moves, delt moves, or whatever it is that you believe.

I wasn't referring to you. Calm down. I should have phrased what I said different, because I used the term "you" where I should have used the term "people." The term "you" was meant to address the general lifting populus (Hopefully if you go back and read that first paragraph again you could see how my internal dialogue might reflect this). I apologize for this misunderstand. I had no intention of personally attacking you.

With that said, I'm not wrong. I'll admit when I'm wrong, and I've changed my stance on various issues (Such as the upper/lower chest debate) when I see sufficient evidence to do so. I still don't consider CG benching and dips a "tricep" exercise. I have yet to see you indicate why they should be considered this way, when I have defended my opinion as to why they shouldn't be categorized as such.

Again, let me reiterate, that I definitely think the following is true about these movements: your triceps are recruited heavily, in the case of a CG bench press or dips where you tuck in your elbows you recruit your triceps more relative to the other forms of the movement, and both are exceptional as far as building large triceps go.