Thread: rear delts?

A recommendation...

Unless you are an advanced bodybuilder, or at least very seasoned.... dont focus so much on the rear delts...

Keep your shoulder movements to the massbuilders... focus on strength with compound movements, and when you are much more advanced, you can worry about the indricate areas of the body.

rear delts get hit with rowing movements.

ok so seated and BO row hit them, what about narrow grip pull downs or chins?

My rear delts are underdeveloped and my front delts are overdeveloped. I've heard many bodybuilders have this problem. Kind of odd because I do a lot of work that hits the rear delts: dumbell press, (military press) and all kind of rows (upright rows to the rescue!).

My favorite posterior delt movement is BO shoulder extensions. Rows enhance them, are you in the condition necessary to need focus on such an area?

Originally Posted by Witchblade

My rear delts are underdeveloped and my front delts are overdeveloped. I've heard many bodybuilders have this problem. Kind of odd because I do a lot of work that hits the rear delts: dumbell press, (military press) and all kind of rows (upright rows to the rescue!).

srry to tell you but overhead presses don't work the rear delts (they work the front and lateral delts), you could try bent over DB lateral raises, but all rows/pull-ups/downs hit them, so in your routine I would just make sure you have more pulling exercises than pushing. Im pretty sure upright rows dont work the rear delts either...

t-bar rows?

Rear cable delt flys. Also a good idea to to rotator exercises once a week

Originally Posted by camarosuper6

A recommendation...
Unless you are an advanced bodybuilder, or at least very seasoned.... dont focus so much on the rear delts...
Keep your shoulder movements to the massbuilders... focus on strength with compound movements, and when you are much more advanced, you can worry about the indricate areas of the body.

Hmmm. Bent over flyes, rows, they don't seem like isolation movements to me.....

Originally Posted by jcote

Hmmm. Bent over flyes, rows, they don't seem like isolation movements to me.....

The posterior delts are part of the shoulder complex. There's no way you can active it without activating the other delts. The exercises that he listed will hit them well though.

Originally Posted by jcote

Hmmm. Bent over flyes, rows, they don't seem like isolation movements to me.....

that's because isolation movements are some dookie.

Originally Posted by squanto

that's because isolation movements are some dookie.

Dookie?...

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

Rear cable delt flys. Also a good idea to to rotator exercises once a week

I might even say more then once a week. And not just rotator work but scapular stabilizer work.

Originally Posted by P-funk

rear delts get hit with rowing movements.

Would you say the rear delts get worked enough from just rows?

Say a person does 2 row exercises for 3-4 sets each, once a week, would there ever be a need to do an additional exercise like reverse cable flies for example or are the rows enough?

Thinking balance here and have always wondered this...

Compound pulling movements are best, however I do tend to include some isolation work for the scapular stabilizers and external rotators (Your rear delts are an external rotator) because most people need the additional isolation work back there to help maintain the health of their shoulders and good posture. It also helps to balance out all the internal rotation that we do during resistance training. Rear delt isolation stuff involves external rotation.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Compound pulling movements are best, however I do tend to include some isolation work for the scapular stabilizers and external rotators (Your rear delts are an external rotator) because most people need the additional isolation work back there to help maintain the health of their shoulders and good posture. It also helps to balance out all the internal rotation that we do during resistance training. Rear delt isolation stuff involves external rotation.

But, it really should not.

The rear delts have a tendecy to overpower the external rotators. When you are doing specific things like external rotation, it would be best to stabilize the humerus by placing your hand on it (or your clients humerus) as you perform the external rotation so that the rear delts don't take over and you can effectively hit the t. minor and infraspinatus. if you don't do that, you probably aren't really fixing the problem, in fact, you could be enhacing it!

In Diagnosis and Treatment of Movement Impairment Syndromes, Sharmman advocates, placing the humerus into about 10 degree of abduction, by using a towel under the arm and bracing the humerus during external rotation, to effectively to the rear delts out of the movement. For those with weak external rotators you will see their ROM shorten up, pretty dreastically, compared to if your hand is not bracing the humerus....showing that they have an imbalance in the external rotators and the rear delts are overcompensating for weak or underative t. minor and infraspinatus. And then overcompensation leads to blah blah blah.....

Originally Posted by P-funk

But, it really should not.

The rear delts have a tendecy to overpower the external rotators. When you are doing specific things like external rotation, it would be best to stabilize the humerus by placing your hand on it (or your clients humerus) as you perform the external rotation so that the rear delts don't take over and you can effectively hit the t. minor and infraspinatus. if you don't do that, you probably aren't really fixing the problem, in fact, you could be enhacing it!

In Diagnosis and Treatment of Movement Impairment Syndromes, Sharmman advocates, placing the humerus into about 10 degree of abduction, by using a towel under the arm and bracing the humerus during external rotation, to effectively to the rear delts out of the movement. For those with weak external rotators you will see their ROM shorten up, pretty dreastically, compared to if your hand is not bracing the humerus....showing that they have an imbalance in the external rotators and the rear delts are overcompensating for weak or underative t. minor and infraspinatus. And then overcompensation leads to blah blah blah.....

I've heard that about using a towel. What do you think about doing abducted external rotation movements, like using the shoulder horn for example?

Also, I generally just try to keep my arm tucked at my side when doing external rotations. Is there a specific reason moving into a slight amount of abduction is useful, or is just that you want to minimize humeral movement besides external rotation?

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I've heard that about using a towel. What do you think about doing abducted external rotation movements, like using the shoulder horn for example?

well, I have done exercise that use abducted shoulder movements like cuban presses. I don't think it is bad. I have never done it with clients though, usually because, a) they probably don't need to be putting their arms overhead if they are dealing with a shoulder issue and b) it is kind of a complex exercise that requires flexibility and coordinated movement, which most of them don't have. So, i work the stabilizers with things that are easier to manuever for them to get the best out of it.


I have never used the shoulder horn, or ever seen one, save for a magazine ad. What does it feel like to use it?

Also, I generally just try to keep my arm tucked at my side when doing external rotations. Is there a specific reason moving into a slight amount of abduction is useful, or is just that you want to minimize humeral movement besides external rotation?

yes, there is. It has to do with scapular positioning when performing external rotation. If your arm is tucked at your side, your scapula will adduct, decreasing the ability of the infraspinatus and the teres minor to perform exeternal rotation and increasing activation of the rear delt. If you abduct it slightly, it allows you place the muscles at a better length tension relationship and take the rear delts out of it, this will usually decrease the ROM of the exercise because the infraspinatus and t.minor are underactive and weak.

Originally Posted by P-funk

well, I have done exercise that use abducted shoulder movements like cuban presses. I don't think it is bad. I have never done it with clients though, usually because, a) they probably don't need to be putting their arms overhead if they are dealing with a shoulder issue and b) it is kind of a complex exercise that requires flexibility and coordinated movement, which most of them don't have. So, i work the stabilizers with things that are easier to manuever for them to get the best out of it.


I have never used the shoulder horn, or ever seen one, save for a magazine ad. What does it feel like to use it?

Well, your arms don't quite go overhead. In fact, the shoulder horn has them sitting just below parallel to the floor to allow for a fuller ROM without having to protract your shoulder girdle excessively to compensate.

I feel like it works pretty well; I can actually feel those muscles go into action. It's kind of weird feeling them work, but you usually don't. I also lay on the floor and do external rotations in an abducted position.

yes, there is. It has to do with scapular positioning when performing external rotation. If your arm is tucked at your side, your scapula will adduct, decreasing the ability of the infraspinatus and the teres minor to perform exeternal rotation and increasing activation of the rear delt. If you abduct it slightly, it allows you place the muscles at a better length tension relationship and take the rear delts out of it, this will usually decrease the ROM of the exercise because the infraspinatus and t.minor are underactive and weak.

Ah, I gotcha. That Sharman is a smart cookie!

You ever do PNF rotator cuff exercises? I use one where you do kind of a reverse chop motion (Abducting and transverse extension) with just your arm while keeping your body stiff. Seems like a good idea once you have some activity going in the external rotators, same idea with the whole activation/integration scene.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Well, your arms don't quite go overhead. In fact, the shoulder horn has them sitting just below parallel to the floor to allow for a fuller ROM without having to protract your shoulder girdle excessively to compensate.

I feel like it works pretty well; I can actually feel those muscles go into action. It's kind of weird feeling them work, but you usually don't. I also lay on the floor and do external rotations in an abducted position.




Ah, I gotcha. That Sharman is a smart cookie!

You ever do PNF rotator cuff exercises? I use one where you do kind of a reverse chop motion (Abducting and transverse extension) with just your arm while keeping your body stiff. Seems like a good idea once you have some activity going in the external rotators, same idea with the whole activation/integration scene.

Yes she is....year of physical therapy and research!


I do cable (or DB, but usually cable) PNF work all the time. Cross body, diagonal fashion. I start people doing it kneeling on both legs, then single leg kneeling, stading, single leg standing. I also like the two arms, cross body PNF patters that Verstegan and Boyle do with the rope attachment. I use them a lot, same progression as above.

Originally Posted by P-funk

Yes she is....year of physical therapy and research!


I do cable (or DB, but usually cable) PNF work all the time. Cross body, diagonal fashion. I start people doing it kneeling on both legs, then single leg kneeling, stading, single leg standing. I also like the two arms, cross body PNF patters that Verstegan and Boyle do with the rope attachment. I use them a lot, same progression as above.

Yeah, I've used some of Boyle's moves. I've also used a couple that I picked up from Gray Cook's book Athletic Body in Balance. I need to read that book from Sharman. Man, I'm reading so much shit right now. I'm studying out of two textbooks for class right now, reading a novel, and reading McGill's book on LB disorders. So much to read! I still need to read through the NASM PES stuff you sent me too. I finished the CES stuff, that was a good read.

What textbooks are you reading?

Originally Posted by P-funk

What textbooks are you reading?

Human Anatomy & Physiology Sixth Edition by Elaine N. Marieb and Nutrition for Health, Fitness, & Sport by Melvin H. Williams. I hope we get into some semi-deep stuff in nutrition class. If not, I will probably just continue reading the textbook on my own when class is done.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

Human Anatomy & Physiology Sixth Edition by Elaine N. Marieb and Nutrition for Health, Fitness, & Sport by Melvin H. Williams. I hope we get into some semi-deep stuff in nutrition class. If not, I will probably just continue reading the textbook on my own when class is done.

what does your anatomy book say on DOMS? Is it a good lay out, or boring?