Stop Worrying About Arms

Malley · 12-26-2006, 06:34 PM

I would have to say after a day of heavy chins, rows, and more rows, 2-3 sets of curls may help, but they are not a must. If i got anything left in the tank I throw em in there, otherwise its just time to eat, sleep, and grow.

Good post Cam.

juggernaut · 12-26-2006, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strongwarrior

Other professional bodybuilders, like Flex Wheeler and Lee priest had huge arms, but a relatively underdeveloped torso...Someone with good proportions, in my opinion, would be Arnold Scharzzenegger, huge arms but also huge chest and great back

But arnold had terrible legs. Although he was symmetrical, he still didnt have better legs (and overall better package) than lou ferrigno, a bber who didnt get half the credit he deserved. Dont get me wrong, Arnold was great, but there were better physiques out there.

**Prince** · 12-26-2006, 08:54 PM

by today's standards Arnold's legs were weak, however back in the 70's they were fine.

Malley · 12-26-2006, 08:59 PM

^^ True ^^

camarosuper6 · 12-26-2006, 10:05 PM

I know very very few people who need more than one or two sets of direct work for biceps or triceps per workout.

Malley · 12-26-2006, 10:06 PM

I can agree with that^^^

Strongwarrior · 12-27-2006, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by juggernaut

But arnold had terrible legs. Although he was symmetrical, he still didnt have better legs (and overall better package) than lou ferrigno, a bber who didnt get half the credit he deserved. Dont get me wrong, Arnold was great, but there were better physiques out there.

Do you really believe Ferrigno was better than Arnold? I'm Italian, and still, I feel Arnold was better, although Ferrigno was great too

Strongwarrior · 12-27-2006, 02:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

by today's standards Arnold's legs were weak, however back in the 70's they were fine.

This is very true...How big were his legs? I know his arms were 22''
He had great calves though, but I feel he could've added a couple of inches to his legs

KarlW · 12-27-2006, 03:30 AM

Arnold v Ferrigno. An old debate, and although both were great my personal opinion is that Arnold had a more pleasing physique. His wide lats tapered into a tiny waistline without bulging abs, and his pecs covered such a large area like slabs.

Lou was more blocky. Although in some shots he didn't do too bad either.

Strongwarrior · 12-27-2006, 05:13 AM

^^
They were both great, that's for sure!

plewser2006 · 12-27-2006, 10:42 PM

lou=massive, powerfull, gigantic... 310 pounds

arnald= symetrical, perfect physique... 250pounds?

but im a fan of arnald

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLdU4Lc-g2M

**Prince** · 12-27-2006, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strongwarrior

This is very true...How big were his legs? I know his arms were 22''

his legs were probably about 22" as well!

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 08:46 PM

Sorry, this may a little bit off the arnold vs Lou topic, but i didnt want to start another post

it is funny that in my gym, most people think that DL, squating, power clean, are more advanced exercises that beginners should keep off of.

i think this is true becasue you need to be lifting or playing enough sport to develop sufficient neuro-coordination and strength to perform a lot of these compound exercises. for example, when i started lifting, i couldnt do a full rep of deadlift until i developed enough strength on the lower back and the hammies by doing back hyperextension and leg-curl. and i can still remmeber when i started doing bench press with an empty bar, it was all shaky and i couldnt lower tha bar to my chest because my triceps were too weak.

what i am try to say is not everyone in the gym is strong enough or coordinated enough to do compound exercises and it is probably safer for them to wait until they develops enough strength/coordination through isolation exercises.

Malley · 12-28-2006, 08:51 PM

I totally disagree. Start by doing compound exercises. Your muscles will strengthen faster this way than they would doing 3 sets of tricep kickbacks and 3 sets of preacher curls supersetted with 3 sets of cable crossovers and a abductor machine.

jasone · 12-28-2006, 09:05 PM

I agree with this post. My last trainer dedicated one day a week to training arms. During the year with the trainer everything improved except arms. It's been six months on my own and my arms have grown 1/2 inch while I've been leaning out. I do two sets of triceps on sholder day and two sets of biceps on back day. My elbow feels a lot better during raquetball now.
Normal guys like me don't need as much work as a druged up professional bodybuilder.

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double D

Start by doing compound exercises. Your muscles will strengthen faster this way than they would doing 3 sets of tricep kickbacks and 3 sets of preacher curls supersetted with 3 sets of cable crossovers and a abductor machine.

Yes, i agree, if you are a highschool jock.

say if you are training a 5'9 100bl guy who cant curl 30lb of weight and says"i dont get big no matter how much i eat". what coumpound exercise do you expect him to do other than push-ups?

and dont forget newbies can grow with doing anything.

Malley · 12-28-2006, 09:12 PM

So you are suggesting isolation exercises only?

**CowPimp** · 12-28-2006, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zl214

Sorry, this may a little bit off the arnold vs Lou topic, but i didnt want to start another post

it is funny that in my gym, most people think that DL, squating, power clean, are more advanced exercises that beginners should keep off of.

i think this is true becasue you need to be lifting or playing enough sport to develop sufficient neuro-coordination and strength to perform a lot of these compound exercises. for example, when i started lifting, i couldnt do a full rep of deadlift until i developed enough strength on the lower back and the hammies by doing back hyperextension and leg-curl. and i can still remmeber when i started doing bench press with an empty bar, it was all shaky and i couldnt lower tha bar to my chest because my triceps were too weak.

what i am try to say is not everyone in the gym is strong enough or coordinated enough to do compound exercises and it is probably safer for them to wait until they develops enough strength/coordination through isolation exercises.

It depends on the individual. To an extent you have the right idea. However, the way I would get someone performing a solid rep on the bench would not be with kickbacks, machine flys, and lateral raises. That isn't going to do much for intermuscular coordination. It might strengthen the individual muscles in a very general way, but that isn't going to make for a pretty bench press the first time out.

I start people off with pushup variations and progress from there. Usually that gives them a good prerequisite level of strength and stabilizer control to allow them to bench press without being too shaky. Still, the first time you bench isn't going to be poetry in motion; you have to get used to the movement specifically, and open chain exercises like that in general, before it will be entirely smooth.

Malley · 12-28-2006, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

It depends on the individual. To an extent you have the right idea. However, the way I would get someone performing a solid rep on the bench would not be with kickbacks, machine flys, and lateral raises. That isn't going to do much for intermuscular coordination. It might strengthen the individual muscles in a very general way, but that isn't going to make for a pretty bench press the first time out.

I start people off with pushup variations and progress from there. Usually that gives them a good prerequisite level of strength and stabilizer control to allow them to bench press without being too shaky. Still, the first time you bench isn't going to be poetry in motion; you have to get used to the movement specifically, and open chain exercises like that in general, before it will be entirely smooth.

What I said but a much longer version. Mine was in a nut shell.

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zl214

what i am try to say is not everyone in the gym is strong enough or coordinated enough to do compound exercises and it is probably safer for them to wait until they develops enough strength/coordination through isolation exercises.

and sorry for the caricature in the previous post if that offened anyone.

Malley · 12-28-2006, 09:23 PM

And what CP said will suit me just fine. I dont disagree that someone should start off with something like pushups, however isolation exercises really arent going to do much for someone trying to increase overall strength.

I remember years ago whenever I first got onto a bench press. I didnt do anything to lead up to it, I simply just did it. Given I was an athelete, however I had guys lifting with me who was not. And the ones who couldnt do the bar were the ones who used very light Db's. Or resorted to pushups until they could go to the bar.

Oh and no offense.

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

It depends on the individual. To an extent you have the right idea. However, the way I would get someone performing a solid rep on the bench would not be with kickbacks, machine flys, and lateral raises. That isn't going to do much for intermuscular coordination. It might strengthen the individual muscles in a very general way, but that isn't going to make for a pretty bench press the first time out.

I start people off with pushup variations and progress from there. Usually that gives them a good prerequisite level of strength and stabilizer control to allow them to bench press without being too shaky. Still, the first time you bench isn't going to be poetry in motion; you have to get used to the movement specifically, and open chain exercises like that in general, before it will be entirely smooth.

also, it is different to start with a trainer compared to start all on your own. it is much safer with someone who knows what to do. if you start by yourself, the net is basically the only place that a newbie can turn into (talking to the big guys can be very intimidating for some), which can be very confusing becasue you dont necessarily get all the information in the right order. I think this board is definitely one of the better place to start with and i dont want beginners on this site get put off by not being able to do coumpound exercises and feel inadequate or anything.

or is it me being condescending?

Malley · 12-28-2006, 09:38 PM

I think your heart is in the right place. From what I posted a few minutes ago, I said I believe (as well as you do to) people have to work up to a bench press, if they can already do it. However the place for that imo is not in isolation exercises. Its in exercises like pushups. And maybe assisted dips and things of that nature. So I say you are headed in the right direction, but are missing it by a little.

Stewart20 · 12-28-2006, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowPimp

It depends on the individual. To an extent you have the right idea. However, the way I would get someone performing a solid rep on the bench would not be with kickbacks, machine flys, and lateral raises. That isn't going to do much for intermuscular coordination. It might strengthen the individual muscles in a very general way, but that isn't going to make for a pretty bench press the first time out.

I start people off with pushup variations and progress from there. Usually that gives them a good prerequisite level of strength and stabilizer control to allow them to bench press without being too shaky. Still, the first time you bench isn't going to be poetry in motion; you have to get used to the movement specifically, and open chain exercises like that in general, before it will be entirely smooth.

when I began lifting way back when, I started doing a bunch of pushups every night before bed. then I progressed to pushups using pushup bars, and assorted curls. Then I progressed to the bench press, plus other movements you can perform with just a barbell like shoulder presses and tricep extensions.

So it's funny you mention that, cause I began the same way

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 09:44 PM

god.... i am such a mum.

how do you delete a post?

Malley · 12-28-2006, 09:49 PM

Why would you want to delete a post?

zl214 · 12-28-2006, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

when I began lifting way back when, I started doing a bunch of pushups every night before bed. then I progressed to pushups using pushup bars, and assorted curls. Then I progressed to the bench press, plus other movements you can perform with just a barbell like shoulder presses and tricep extensions.

So it's funny you mention that, cause I began the same way

you how far you have come! congrat.

you must have hated those freaks started bench at 200LB, too.

12-26-2006, 06:34 PM	#31
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	I would have to say after a day of heavy chins, rows, and more rows, 2-3 sets of curls may help, but they are not a must. If i got anything left in the tank I throw em in there, otherwise its just time to eat, sleep, and grow. Good post Cam.
	www.crossfit.com

12-26-2006, 08:54 PM	#33
Prince the one & only Administrator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Colorado Posts: 34,003 Blog Entries: 25 Photos: 320	by today's standards Arnold's legs were weak, however back in the 70's they were fine.
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12-26-2006, 08:59 PM	#34
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	^^ True ^^
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12-26-2006, 10:05 PM	#35
camarosuper6 Back Home In SOCAL Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: California Posts: 3,354	I know very very few people who need more than one or two sets of direct work for biceps or triceps per workout.
	"TOLERANCE is the virtue of a man without convictions" G.K.Chesterton Boot Shine and Polish $15. New Uniforms: $250 New gun and holster: $450 Looking like a stud in uniform: Priceless Girl: Me and this new guy are getting kinda chummy. Me: Good chummy? Like friends forever? Girl: Ya Me: Or Chummy like, spank my ass chummy?

12-26-2006, 10:06 PM	#36
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	I can agree with that^^^
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12-27-2006, 03:30 AM	#39
KarlW My Little Man Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Oz Posts: 1,030	Arnold v Ferrigno. An old debate, and although both were great my personal opinion is that Arnold had a more pleasing physique. His wide lats tapered into a tiny waistline without bulging abs, and his pecs covered such a large area like slabs. Lou was more blocky. Although in some shots he didn't do too bad either.
	What this means is that when we drop a ball and it falls to the ground, it wasn't the ball that moved (down to the ground), but the ground that moved (up to the ball)

12-27-2006, 05:13 AM	#40
Strongwarrior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 151	^^ They were both great, that's for sure!
Strongwarrior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 151

12-27-2006, 10:42 PM	#41
plewser2006 Young & Dumb User Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 90 Photos: 2	lou=massive, powerfull, gigantic... 310 pounds arnald= symetrical, perfect physique... 250pounds? but im a fan of arnald http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLdU4Lc-g2M

12-28-2006, 08:46 PM	#43
zl214 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 144	Sorry, this may a little bit off the arnold vs Lou topic, but i didnt want to start another post it is funny that in my gym, most people think that DL, squating, power clean, are more advanced exercises that beginners should keep off of. i think this is true becasue you need to be lifting or playing enough sport to develop sufficient neuro-coordination and strength to perform a lot of these compound exercises. for example, when i started lifting, i couldnt do a full rep of deadlift until i developed enough strength on the lower back and the hammies by doing back hyperextension and leg-curl. and i can still remmeber when i started doing bench press with an empty bar, it was all shaky and i couldnt lower tha bar to my chest because my triceps were too weak. what i am try to say is not everyone in the gym is strong enough or coordinated enough to do compound exercises and it is probably safer for them to wait until they develops enough strength/coordination through isolation exercises.
zl214 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 144

12-28-2006, 08:51 PM	#44
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	I totally disagree. Start by doing compound exercises. Your muscles will strengthen faster this way than they would doing 3 sets of tricep kickbacks and 3 sets of preacher curls supersetted with 3 sets of cable crossovers and a abductor machine.
	www.crossfit.com

12-28-2006, 09:05 PM	#45
jasone Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 314 Photos: 6	I agree with this post. My last trainer dedicated one day a week to training arms. During the year with the trainer everything improved except arms. It's been six months on my own and my arms have grown 1/2 inch while I've been leaning out. I do two sets of triceps on sholder day and two sets of biceps on back day. My elbow feels a lot better during raquetball now. Normal guys like me don't need as much work as a druged up professional bodybuilder.

12-28-2006, 09:12 PM	#47
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	So you are suggesting isolation exercises only?
	www.crossfit.com

12-28-2006, 09:23 PM	#51
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	And what CP said will suit me just fine. I dont disagree that someone should start off with something like pushups, however isolation exercises really arent going to do much for someone trying to increase overall strength. I remember years ago whenever I first got onto a bench press. I didnt do anything to lead up to it, I simply just did it. Given I was an athelete, however I had guys lifting with me who was not. And the ones who couldnt do the bar were the ones who used very light Db's. Or resorted to pushups until they could go to the bar. Oh and no offense.
	www.crossfit.com

12-28-2006, 09:38 PM	#53
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	I think your heart is in the right place. From what I posted a few minutes ago, I said I believe (as well as you do to) people have to work up to a bench press, if they can already do it. However the place for that imo is not in isolation exercises. Its in exercises like pushups. And maybe assisted dips and things of that nature. So I say you are headed in the right direction, but are missing it by a little.
	www.crossfit.com

12-28-2006, 09:44 PM	#55
zl214 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 144	god.... i am such a mum. how do you delete a post?
zl214 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 144

12-28-2006, 09:49 PM	#56
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,021	Why would you want to delete a post?
	www.crossfit.com