Isolation at beginning or end of workout?

snoogans · 05-09-2007, 12:12 PM

I was talking to a well respected powerlifting coach and he suggested doing any isolation movements before compound lifts. For example, lying lateral raises, rear delts, and so forth before military presses or overhead presses. I was asking because I'd like to concentrate on the medial and rear delt areas a little more.

How do you guys generally place these movements?

Witchblade · 05-09-2007, 12:21 PM

You could focus on a bodypart and do it first, but generally you should do compounds first. The more demanding, the sooner you want to do it.

NordicNacho · 05-09-2007, 12:21 PM

end, a smart man once said at least 80% of the exercises you do should be compound. leave the curls to the skinny kids in the wife beaters

snoogans · 05-09-2007, 12:30 PM

I do mainly all compound lifts, but as a result, the front of my shoulders are a lot bigger than the rest. I thought throwing in some isolation for the medial and posterior heads would help. All the compound lifts involving shoulders are overpowered by another muscle group anyway be it chest, triceps, or upper back.

Witchblade · 05-09-2007, 12:33 PM

Fixing imbalances takes priority. I'd do some activation warmup for the external rotators and then start the workout with rows.

snoogans · 05-09-2007, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NordicNacho

end, a smart man once said at least 80% of the exercises you do should be compound. leave the curls to the skinny kids in the wife beaters

Yeah, some kid was in the gym today and he honestly spent 45 min. doing four variations of arm curls. And he talked about how many protien shakes he had a day.

snoogans · 05-09-2007, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

Fixing imbalances takes priority. I'd do some activation warmup for the external rotators and then start the workout with rows.

If I'm doing rows to target more upper back, should I be bringing the bar more towards my chest as opposed to the navel? Also, elbows tucked in or flared a little? I usually try to concentrate on contracting my lats with these.

Leatherface · 05-09-2007, 12:44 PM

Maybe he was referring to pre-exhausting the muscle? This is a legitimate and very effective technique that, IMO, used sparingly, can help bring up a stubborn bodypart.

Examples:

-Flyes followed immediately by bench.

-Lateral raises followed immediately by Military.

-Leg Ext. followed immediately by squats.

Witchblade · 05-09-2007, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snoogans

If I'm doing rows to target more upper back, should I be bringing the bar more towards my chest as opposed to the navel? Also, elbows tucked in or flared a little? I usually try to concentrate on contracting my lats with these.

To target the posterior delt, you want to move the elbows. The bar should go to your (upper) chest, this makes the exercise way harder than regular rows. I like to keep my grip the same as my bench grip (hands just outside shoulders width). No need to focus on the lats, just focus on getting the bar up without using momentum. That last part of the movement is killer (scapular retraction). Experiment a little and see what you find comfortable.

Double D · 05-09-2007, 01:09 PM

Just depends on your routine. Really there isnt a right or wrong way to do it. Depending on what your goals are. Some routines are setup for prexhausting methods. Others superset isolation movements with compounds. Just set it up to meet your goals.

**Gazhole** · 05-09-2007, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

You could focus on a bodypart and do it first, but generally you should do compounds first. The more demanding, the sooner you want to do it.

Thats the way i see it.

AKIRA · 05-09-2007, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leatherface

Maybe he was referring to pre-exhausting the muscle? This is a legitimate and very effective technique that, IMO, used sparingly, can help bring up a stubborn bodypart.

Examples:

-Flyes followed immediately by bench.

-Lateral raises followed immediately by Military.

-Leg Ext. followed immediately by squats.

Thats the only reasoning I can see.

Ive done pre-exhaust before during P/RR/S's Shock workouts and theyre pretty good.

05-09-2007, 12:12 PM	#1
snoogans Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 60	Isolation at beginning or end of workout? I was talking to a well respected powerlifting coach and he suggested doing any isolation movements before compound lifts. For example, lying lateral raises, rear delts, and so forth before military presses or overhead presses. I was asking because I'd like to concentrate on the medial and rear delt areas a little more. How do you guys generally place these movements?

05-09-2007, 12:21 PM	#2
Witchblade Succinct Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Holland Posts: 4,285 Photos: 2	You could focus on a bodypart and do it first, but generally you should do compounds first. The more demanding, the sooner you want to do it.
	My Linkdump [LSFW] IM Official FAQ [WORK IN PROGRESS]

05-09-2007, 12:21 PM	#3
NordicNacho Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,415 Photos: 18	end, a smart man once said at least 80% of the exercises you do should be compound. leave the curls to the skinny kids in the wife beaters
	http://www.roqofthe80s.com/#

05-09-2007, 12:33 PM	#5
Witchblade Succinct Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Holland Posts: 4,285 Photos: 2	Fixing imbalances takes priority. I'd do some activation warmup for the external rotators and then start the workout with rows.
	My Linkdump [LSFW] IM Official FAQ [WORK IN PROGRESS]

05-09-2007, 12:44 PM	#8
Leatherface Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 109	Maybe he was referring to pre-exhausting the muscle? This is a legitimate and very effective technique that, IMO, used sparingly, can help bring up a stubborn bodypart. Examples: -Flyes followed immediately by bench. -Lateral raises followed immediately by Military. -Leg Ext. followed immediately by squats.
	"Look what your brother did to the door!"

05-09-2007, 12:30 PM	#4
snoogans Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 60	I do mainly all compound lifts, but as a result, the front of my shoulders are a lot bigger than the rest. I thought throwing in some isolation for the medial and posterior heads would help. All the compound lifts involving shoulders are overpowered by another muscle group anyway be it chest, triceps, or upper back.

05-09-2007, 01:09 PM	#10
Double D Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 9,930	Just depends on your routine. Really there isnt a right or wrong way to do it. Depending on what your goals are. Some routines are setup for prexhausting methods. Others superset isolation movements with compounds. Just set it up to meet your goals.
	www.crossfit.com

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