Thread: Fasting and training

I dont know much about this fasting stuff, but working out with any sort of intensity on an empty stomach (ie - not eating beforehand) is generally not advised. I would eat, train, eat, then fast.

You don't need to fast from morning to evening, with a 24 hour fasting method you could not eat from 4pm to 4pm for example, leaving plenty of time for pre and post workout meals.

12:00pm - Eat

2:00pm - Train

3:30pm - Eat

4:00pm - Fast for 24 hours

4:00pm the next day - Eat.

Ahh, i see. So, when planning for a fast eat your last meal rather early the prior day and start training the next day after getting some food.

This makes much more sense. I never really saw a point in training with no food at all. I know you could, but i don't see how gains would be optimal.

I've just heard great things about intermittent fasting. Although, i think it's just good for fat loss. People have claimed to actually gain muscle, but i don't see how this is possible at all, since you must in a calorie surplus...

You can still be in a calorie surplus while fasting. All fasting does is stop you eating for X amount of time. To gain weight you'll still need to be in a surplus and to lose weight youll still need to be in a deficit.

Just because you don't eat for 24 hours or whatever the protocol you're using says you should do, doesnt mean you cant eat the same amount. The meals will just be closer together and/or have more in them.

The one im most familiar with is the 24 hour fast twice a week, which is what im applying this to atm, lol. The logic behind fasting is that intellectually we've evolved more than our bodies have. The premise is that we're not really meant to eat as frequently as we do, so eating 8 meals a day is somewhat anti-intuitive for our bodies.

Eating lots of food, then not eat for a fairly extended period of time is supposed to be more in tune with how our bodies work. Alternatively i could just be talking out of my arse.

Originally Posted by C6zo6

Quick question, because intermittent fasting has really got my attention.

If you fast, is it ok to workout on an empty stomach, and continue your fast until desired 24 hour rate? Or, would be optimal to fast, lift on an empty stomach, then have a post workout meal?

The author of eatstopeat says its ok to do workout on your fasting days without having to worry about your post-workout nutrition.....I normally
finish the fast with a whey shake if i i workout and then have dinner after an hr or whenever i feel hungry.

Eat stop eat, thats what its called. Thankyou.

i know i lifted on an empty stomach yesterday, just becaus ei was busy and work and didnt eat all day. i was WEAK, everything felt heavy and i couldn't train as long as normal. then i had the shakes and felt liek crap until i ate. i would not recommend doing it, it sucked!!!

Originally Posted by Gazhole

Eat stop eat, thats what its called. Thankyou.

u r welcome Gaz!!

Originally Posted by CORUM

i know i lifted on an empty stomach yesterday, just becaus ei was busy and work and didnt eat all day. i was WEAK, everything felt heavy and i couldn't train as long as normal. then i had the shakes and felt liek crap until i ate. i would not recommend doing it, it sucked!!!

I have felt the same way before, but these days don't see much difference...also i don't make it a rule to workout on fasting days, but if the day just happen to be a fast and a workout day...i just do my workout and finish the fast. I normally fast dinner to dinner (18-24 hr period).

I usually plan my fasting around my lifting, so I lift on days when I eat. However, on days when I fast sometimes I do cardio or interval work. I have not had any problems.

There is research on athletes who would fast 24hours prior to competition without decreases in performance.

patrick

Very interesting.

So, basically it's a comfort thing. It's not going to hurt you, but on lifting days it's better to get a little food, although not the end of the world if you don't...

I just like to have food in me when I train and I like to have my post workout shake. I typically will start my fast after my post workout shake and go 24-hours from there.

patrick

Perfect.

Does it matter to try intermittent fasting even if your not not trying to lose weight?

Do people use it for bulking as well? Or, is it really just a weight loss plan?

Just curious.

Originally Posted by C6zo6

Perfect.

Does it matter to try intermittent fasting even if your not not trying to lose weight?

Do people use it for bulking as well? Or, is it really just a weight loss plan?

Just curious.

There are other things in the book that he talks about. I am not really trying to lose weight at the moment, so I just eat more on my eating days. He also talks about fasting as a way to decrease markers of inflammation (C-reactive protein, tumor necrosis factor, etc) and it breaks your reliance/addiction on insulin (from what he says). For example, I used to get headaches and very cranky between meals, or if I was slightly late on eating. Now, it doesn't bother me at all. On the fasting days, I have no problems. I don't feel tired or hazy or agitated when I don't have food.

patrick

One thing I'm good at is my appetite. I have complete control of my it. Honestly, i could not eat for over 30 hours and i don't think it would bother me. I never really get cravings. I just eat because i know I'm supposed to.

Very rarely I'm actually hungry for something to eat. Generally, I'll only feel hungry if i have a coke, or maybe a candy bar. (Not sure why) But, i don't eat those things anymore, so i never feel this way...

Good for me i guess....

Originally Posted by P-funk

There are other things in the book that he talks about. I am not really trying to lose weight at the moment, so I just eat more on my eating days. He also talks about fasting as a way to decrease markers of inflammation (C-reactive protein, tumor necrosis factor, etc) and it breaks your reliance/addiction on insulin (from what he says). For example, I used to get headaches and very cranky between meals, or if I was slightly late on eating. Now, it doesn't bother me at all. On the fasting days, I have no problems. I don't feel tired or hazy or agitated when I don't have food.

patrick

Isn't that part interesting? I don't LIKE feeling hungry, but it's not that PANICKY feeling anymore. I can bear it. Now, if I'm hungry and eat something that's just carbs, or worse, carbs and fat - I'm MISERABLE. It's seriously easier to just be hungry.

Originally Posted by C6zo6

One thing I'm good at is my appetite. I have complete control of my it. Honestly, i could not eat for over 30 hours and i don't think it would bother me. I never really get cravings. I just eat because i know I'm supposed to.

Very rarely I'm actually hungry for something to eat. Generally, I'll only feel hungry if i have a coke, or maybe a candy bar. (Not sure why)

Fructose doesn't stimulate the insulin response like glucose does, and fructose also interferes with postprandial (after-meal) satiety, largely through this mechanism. Both of those foods are high in fructose (HGCS 55 for the pop, sucrose for the candy bar). Also, carb and fat stimulates a LOT of insulin. While insulin can induce satiety, too much insulin can trigger hunger, at least for some of us. I'm one of 'em.

So odd. I wish i understood this stuff more than I do.

When I have to train on a fasting day, I usually cut the volume by half and slightly increase the intensity.

I.e: 2 sets of squats instead of 4 but raising the weight about 4 - 5lbs.

That day I don´t have any pre or postworkout meals

Originally Posted by Built

Isn't that part interesting? I don't LIKE feeling hungry, but it's not that PANICKY feeling anymore. I can bear it. Now, if I'm hungry and eat something that's just carbs, or worse, carbs and fat - I'm MISERABLE. It's seriously easier to just be hungry.



Fructose doesn't stimulate the insulin response like glucose does, and fructose also interferes with postprandial (after-meal) satiety, largely through this mechanism. Both of those foods are high in fructose (HGCS 55 for the pop, sucrose for the candy bar). Also, carb and fat stimulates a LOT of insulin. While insulin can induce satiety, too much insulin can trigger hunger, at least for some of us. I'm one of 'em.

So odd. I wish i understood this stuff more than I do.

I wish i understood it like you do, lol.

What about french fries? When i eat a burger and fries I'm stuffed for very long periods of time too...

You're insulin sensitive - you probably find all carbs sating. Fat and carb, when consumed together, stimulate a greater insulin response than just carb. Fat stimulates CCK, which adds to it. For me, it doesn't compensate enough for the hunger I experience due to my overproduction of insulin.

What is the problem with eating fat and carbs together? I heard that's a big no no for weight gain. Is this true? I don't see why it would be...Although, foods with high fat and carbs tend to be the bad ones...

To be honest, i get full on the total amount of food i eat. It doesn't matter what it is...But, if i do eat a lot of carbs, i start feeling bloated...For instance, since i don't eat bread anymore, when i attempted to eat a sandwich about a month ago, i couldn't even finish the bread, because mid meal i was feeling full. I had to just eat the turkey...(weird)

Although, it just seems like bread...Because, i could eat large fries at McDonald's no problem...I do sometimes have a hard time putting down rice also. (Maybe it's in my head)

Carbohydrate consumed with fat stimulates a LOT of insulin. Insulin's a storage hormone. If you have a lot of insulin all at once, and your muscles won't uptake the load, fat cells will. At least, at first. Then you feel hungry, and consequently overeat.

YOU apparently don't get this response, and for this you must die.

Nothing personal.

Get yourself tested for celiac, okay? Quick blood test. Could answer a lot of questions for you.

I've done intermittent fasting before. Actually really enjoyed it because I got to eat a lot of food at one time

Anyway.....I would fast all day until 8pm then eat and eat some more Then first thing in the morning I would lift. Great energy! Always had a great workout!

Eventually the intermittent fasting got me into juice fasting (as in real pressed fruit/veggie juice) and I still do that 3-4 times a year now. However, I only do light cardio during that week.

Originally Posted by Built

Carbohydrate consumed with fat stimulates a LOT of insulin. Insulin's a storage hormone. If you have a lot of insulin all at once, and your muscles won't uptake the load, fat cells will. At least, at first. Then you feel hungry, and consequently overeat.

YOU apparently don't get this response, and for this you must die.

Nothing personal.

Get yourself tested for celiac, okay? Quick blood test. Could answer a lot of questions for you.

lol, honestly i think it's control. If i eat something bad, I know in the back of my mind it was a lot of calories. So, i think that somehow changes my cravings, because i know i had a ton of calories a few hours ago...

Mind over matter i suppose.

i am a muslim, and so for religious belifes every year for 30 days non stop i have to fast during day light hours, no food and no water.

because the islamic calender is based around the moon and not the sun it means every year the fasts come about 10-11 days before the perious year. so winter fasts are from around 3am to 5pm, but summer fasts are around 5am to 9pm.

i hate doing them, and so dont know why anyone would chose to fast for such lenghts of time.

its really and test of physical and mental endurance, for 30 days in a row i have to get up really early eat and drink as much as i can, which is hard in the early hours of the morning when you are so tired, then go back to sleep, then get back up go about my day with no food (not even a bite) or water/drink (not even a mouthfull). then finally break the fast and eat and drink all i want, go back to sleep, and repeat the whole process for 29 days.

after that i cant imagine voluntary fasting.

Originally Posted by UFC rocks

i am a muslim, and so for religious belifes every year for 30 days non stop i have to fast during day light hours, no food and no water.

because the islamic calender is based around the moon and not the sun it means every year the fasts come about 10-11 days before the perious year. so winter fasts are from around 3am to 5pm, but summer fasts are around 5am to 9pm.

i hate doing them, and so dont know why anyone would chose to fast for such lenghts of time.

its really and test of physical and mental endurance, for 30 days in a row i have to get up really early eat and drink as much as i can, which is hard in the early hours of the morning when you are so tired, then go back to sleep, then get back up go about my day with no food (not even a bite) or water/drink (not even a mouthfull). then finally break the fast and eat and drink all i want, go back to sleep, and repeat the whole process for 29 days.

after that i cant imagine voluntary fasting.

Well, if you don't like it, don't do it. Since your Muslim, you should respect that you have to do this...I never understood the point believing in something, but not having proper acceptance or courtesy towards it. Fasting once a year shouldn't bother you at all.

I've fasted for 28 hours and it was not a problem.

Originally Posted by someguy1984

Well, if you don't like it, don't do it. Since your Muslim, you should respect that you have to do this...I never understood the point believing in something, but not having proper acceptance or courtesy towards it.

i do respect i have to do it, thats why i do it, im just saying i dont really enjoy it and if it was my chose i wouldnt do it, same as i would most likly enjoy drinking and having sex before marrage but cant, and so i dont.

man i gotta tell being a male teenage muslim in a westen country is hard.

Originally Posted by someguy1984

Fasting once a year shouldn't bother you at all

I've fasted for 28 hours and it was not a problem.

30 days in a row man, its not fun, im just saying after that fasting is the last thing on my mind.

Don't say that man. fasting is sometimes fun when u get the hang of it. if it helps don't call it fasting call it a (strong diet).

Originally Posted by UFC rocks

30 days in a row man, its not fun, im just saying after that fasting is the last thing on my mind.

What is the reason to do this? I don't understand. Just eat. Why would you be a part of something that makes you starve yourself and you don't enjoy doing it? (Who would)

It's a requirement for every observant Muslim. He could eat, but he'd be committing a sin.