Al Gore Wins the Nobel Peace Prize!

[bio-chem]

I would hardly call this war a religious one.

really? every time a terrorist attacks a statement is issued claiming the rightousness of the jihad (a religious holy war). Christianity has been declared war upon by a faction of the Islamic religion. people here need to remember that. this is very much a religious war. one that has been going off and on for hundreds of years. this is just the present chapter of it. here in America we dont consider it a religious war because we dont think about it in those terms, but they do. our reasons are convoluted at best for this war, theirs are pretty strait forward.

 

[Decker]

ineffectual? yea i can see an arguement for that. weak-willed? is just ridiculous in reference to bush. despite growing resistence to any decision he has made, he has held to his course of action unflinchingly. its hard to say this president is weak-willed. he is many other negative characteristics, but that doesnt seem to be the problem. the changing winds have done little to this presidents decision making compass.

has terrorist activity bloomed here in the US? here on our soil? in one day on US soil we lost how many thousand US civilian citizens? and in the 6 years since that time we have invaded 2 countries, toppled 2 evil regimes, and have lost not a single civilian on US soil due to foreign terrorism. they are killing more of their own people now than they are of US soldiers.

i dont like, or agree with the Iraq war, but instead of bitching about it maybe the brilliant minds of our generation should figure out how to help Christians and Muslims live together? instead of just bitching that what other people are doing is wrong.

on a side note, what the hell does global warming have to do with peace? are wars being fought over global warming that im not aware about?

I don't equate unengaged, head-in-the-sand ignorant behavior with the exercise of true will. But that's small potatoes.

If some terrorists wanted to infiltrate or attack the US, they could. Or is that 700 mile fence for a 2100 mile border keeping the terrorists at bay? The idea that Al Qaeda is a well oiled juggernaut headed for the US is one more piece of frightware the Bush Adm uses on the public.

The war in Iraq was never about Al Qaeda. The US and Coalition of Willing have been butchering Iraqis since they got there.

Let's get this straight:

The US attacks Iraq to force WMD inspections in 2003 even though Iraq was in compliance

The iraqis fight back

The US continues to kill them calling them Insurgents and Al Qaeda.

Now we are supposed "come together"?

Maybe. But Iran is on the table for attack.

 

[bio-chem]

Do you work for the Bush Administration?

so your just kind of glossing over my posts then is that it? ive admitted bush is largely ineffective, and that i have problems with the war in iraq. yet i must work with the bush administration because i havent swung so far in the other direction that hillary clinton and al gore look like the next coming of ghandi?

come back and enter this discussion when you have something worthwhile to write about

 

[DOMS]

Gee whilikers DOMS, do you know what you're talking about? The "INDEPENDENT" committee was headed by Paul Volcker.

I haven't read Volcker's report. But I will. I'm sure it's 100% independent.

]Six Men Sue Boy Scouts, Mormon Church for Homosexual Crimes

Thanks for making my point.

1. Deploying more than 35 peace-keeping missions. There are presently 16 active peace-keeping forces in operation.

2. Credited with negotiating 172 peaceful settlements that have ended regional conflicts

3. The UN has enabled people in over 45 countries to participate in free and fair elections

4. Development - The system's annual disbursements, including loans and grants, amount to more than $10 billion.

5. UNICEF spends more than $800 million a year, primarily on immunization, health care, nutrition and basic education in 138 countries.

6. UN Human Rights Commission has focused world attention on cases of torture, disappearance, and arbitrary detention and has generated international pressure.

7. UN Conference eon Environment and Development held in Rio de Janeiro in 1992, resulted in treaties on bio-diversity and climate change.

8. Has helped minimize the threat of a nuclear war by inspecting nuclear reactors in 90.

9. Over 300 international treaties, on topics as varied as human rights conventions to agreements on the use of outer space and seabed.

10. The International Court of Justice has helped settle international disputes involving territorial issues, diplomatic relations, hostage-taking, and economic rights.
United Nations Accomplishments & Achievements

What a funny list. How much of this was done by a member country and simply claimed by the U.N.

Off the top of my head:

1. Got job in Rwanda.
4. This money is provided by member countries and how much is spent each year to staff the U.N.?
7. And what? What exactly have they done?
8. God, what a joke. Great job in Iraq. They mean shit. They aren't the people that find violators. They simply show up and say "Yep, they're doing it." If that! They're a token organization.

I'm not saying that they don't do any good, I'm saying that don't do that much good. Even better, go read up on the League of Nations, their dissolution, the goal of the U.N. and how it relates to the fall of the LoN (there are set points), and then tell me how they're doing.

 

[bio-chem]

I don't equate unengaged, head-in-the-sand ignorant behavior with the exercise of true will. But that's small potatoes.

If some terrorists wanted to infiltrate or attack the US, they could. Or is that 700 mile fence for a 2100 mile border keeping the terrorists at bay? The idea that Al Qaeda is a well oiled juggernaut headed for the US is one more piece of frightware the Bush Adm uses on the public.

The war in Iraq was never about Al Qaeda. The US and Coalition of Willing have been butchering Iraqis since they got there.

Let's get this straight:

The US attacks Iraq to force WMD inspections in 2003 even though Iraq was in compliance

The iraqis fight back

The US continues to kill them calling them Insurgents and Al Qaeda.

Now we are supposed "come together"?

Maybe. But Iran is on the table for attack.

oh yea, saddam was totally in compliance with inspections. it seemed almost weekly he was shooting at our pilots enforcing the no fly zone. and not allowing then allowing inspections at his whim is not in compliance with WMD inspections. Iraqis fight back? Iraq has hardly been a cohesive unit to fight back. we easily beat the last regime who did little really of fighting back. and now the iraqi people are fighting each other as much as they are fighting us. i agree that our reasons for being in iraq are convoluted at best. i have strong reservations about this war, where it is going and its final outcome will be. but at this point is pulling out and leaving these factions to themselves going to leave americans safer? i really dont think so. yea iran is on the table for war, only because taking it off the table weakens our position. i really dont see a congress or president going into iran unless they force our hand and directly attack.

 

[Decker]

oh yea, saddam was totally in compliance with inspections. it seemed almost weekly he was shooting at our pilots enforcing the no fly zone. and not allowing then allowing inspections at his whim is not in compliance with WMD inspections. Iraqis fight back? Iraq has hardly been a cohesive unit to fight back. we easily beat the last regime who did little really of fighting back. and now the iraqi people are fighting each other as much as they are fighting us. i agree that our reasons for being in iraq are convoluted at best. i have strong reservations about this war, where it is going and its final outcome will be. but at this point is pulling out and leaving these factions to themselves going to leave americans safer? i really dont think so. yea iran is on the table for war, only because taking it off the table weakens our position. i really dont see a congress or president going into iran unless they force our hand and directly attack.

The No-fly zones were created by the US out of thin air--nothing to do with the terms of surrender from the first Gulf War therefore they had nothing to do with UN Resolution 1441.

Hussein let inspectors into Iraq in 2002. Blix said that the Iraqis were forthcoming with information.
Iraq cooperating but needs to do more on substance - Blix

Iraq cooperating but needs to do more on substance - Blix

Blix Says Iraq Seems to Be Making Effort
Blix Says Iraq Seems to Be Making Effort - UN Security Council - Global Policy Forum

I'm not asserting that Iraq is attacking US troops as an army. We invaded their country. We killed them, destroyed their businesses, and humiliated them. What do they do? They attack us guerilla style.

And you are very correct that there is in-fighting or a civil war going on--the Sunni Shia split at war. Even subfactions of those 2 groups are going at it ie, Sunni on Sunni.

It is very confusing.

I don't think Iran will ever attack the US. They are nuts but not stupid.

 

[brogers]

Gore is lying, deceptive scum. The Nobel Appease prize is a joke, chalk Al Gore right up there with Yasser Arafat and Jimmy Carter.

He's geniune, he really believes that climate change is a serious problem, that's why his home is very energy efficient, and he is co-founder of an investment fund focusing on 'sustainable' (carbon credit, BS) firms. He is a true believer indeed, that's why he never uses fuel guzzling private jets.

 

[Decker]

Gore is lying, deceptive scum. The Nobel Appease prize is a joke, chalk Al Gore right up there with Yasser Arafat and Jimmy Carter.

He's geniune, he really believes that climate change is a serious problem, that's why his home is very energy efficient, and he is co-founder of an investment fund focusing on 'sustainable' (carbon credit, BS) firms. He is a true believer indeed, that's why he never uses fuel guzzling private jets.

So you're saying do not address the problem of global warming b/c the face of the movement to combat GW, Al Gore, is operating w/in the current system of pollution control (advocated by the Bush Adm) and that he flies in jet planes?

So Al Gore is a big ol' hypocrite?

What's he supposed to do? Walk to all his nationwide appearances? Heat his home with flatulence?

I believe Christ died over 2000 years ago so finding a perfect human being to run the global warming campaign is not reasonable.

Your objections are noted. But they are just not good enough to discredit the man.

 

[P-funk]

I am not an Al Gore fan, but I did think that was a great movie and I applaud his efforts in trying to clean up the environment. Congrats to him.

 

[bio-chem]

It is very confusing.

I don't think Iran will ever attack the US. They are nuts but not stupid.

agreed very confusing. so whats the answer? i personally dont believe it is to pull out now and let them fight it out on their own. i could be wrong, someone can feel free to convince me otherwise. otherwise bitching about going in there in the first place doesnt seem to help anything.

and i agree a war with iran personally doesnt seem to be benificial to either side at the moment. i dont see it happening. that doesnt mean each side isnt going to posture so that they can get the best for themselves at any one time. it seems like a scare tactic to say this person wants to go to war with iran. thats not the case, to my knowlege none of the canditates on either side wants a war with iran. i just find it unhealthy to publicly say war with iran is not an option. it gives them a lot of wiggle room to interfere with things. leaving the option there isnt taking the option.

 

[bio-chem]

someone please tell me what global warming has to do with peace?

 

[brogers]

So you're saying do not address the problem of global warming b/c the face of the movement to combat GW, Al Gore, is operating w/in the current system of pollution control (advocated by the Bush Adm) and that he flies in jet planes?

So Al Gore is a big ol' hypocrite?

What's he supposed to do? Walk to all his nationwide appearances? Heat his home with flatulence?

I believe Christ died over 2000 years ago so finding a perfect human being to run the global warming campaign is not reasonable.

Your objections are noted. But they are just not good enough to discredit the man.

What I said had ZERO relevance to the global warming scam. Al Gore is the worst kind of hypocrite. You change your lifestyle, you travel less, you reduce consumption, while he increases his consumption, increases his travel, etc. Oh yeah, but he invests in "carbon credits" aka his own investment firm, you should too, you can save the world.

"Heat his home with flatulence?"

His home consumes 20 times more power than the average American home.

"What's he supposed to do? Walk to all his nationwide appearances?"

He flies private jets which consume FAR FAR more fuel per passenger than a commercial airliner.

Are you really that stupid to make such comments when it's crystal clear what my meaning was? Wow.

The guy is a complete scam artist.

 

[DOMS]

Gore is lying, deceptive scum.

I like to think that, in the case of global warming, he's just self-deluded but means well.

The Nobel Appease prize is a joke, chalk Al Gore right up there with Yasser Arafat and Jimmy Carter.

Sorry, man, they're nothing alike. Not even close. You need to reign this shit in.

He's geniune, he really believes that climate change is a serious problem, that's why his home is very energy efficient, and he is co-founder of an investment fund focusing on 'sustainable' (carbon credit, BS) firms. He is a true believer indeed, that's why he never uses fuel guzzling private jets.

Yeah, he's only committed the way that most activists are committed. They'll talk a mean fight, force others to live differently, but will never make the true sacrifice that they're talking about.

 

[brogers]

I am not an Al Gore fan, but I did think that was a great movie and I applaud his efforts in trying to clean up the environment. Congrats to him.

Yeah he's got some great ideas on how to destroy economies.

 

[brogers]

I like to think that, in the case of global warming, he's just self-deluded but means well.



Sorry, man, they're nothing alike. Not even close. You need to reign this shit in.



Yeah, he's only committed the way that most activists are committed. They'll talk a mean fight, force others to live differently, but will never make the true sacrifice that they're talking about.

Maybe I need to dumb it down.. They're all recepients of the Nobel Peace Prize. The mention of their names is just further illustration of what a joke it has become, not a comparison of Al Gore to them.

 

[DOMS]

Maybe I need to dumb it down.. They're all recepients of the Nobel Peace Prize. The mention of their names is just further illustration of what a joke it has become, not a comparison of Al Gore to them.

Ah, got it. There are certain names that you need to be very clear about when you do comparisons. Hitler and Yasser, are two.

 

[maniclion]

The oil for food scandal. What happened with that again? Oh yes, here:
From the Independent Inquiry Committee:
???There is no evidence that the selection of Cotecna in 1998 was subject to any affirmative or improper influence of the Secretary-General in the bidding or selection process. Based on the record and lack of evidence of impropriety, it is the finding of the Committee that Cotecna was awarded the contract in 1998 on the ground that it was the lowest bidder. The Committee also notes that, in keeping with the normal United Nations policy and practice, the Secretary-General is not involved in procurement decisions.???

The Human Rights Council has many members. I suppose the best way to try and change things in China is to ignore them and hope the problem takes care of itself.

What about the good things the UN does?

The UN is hardly to blame for all of that mess, greedy oil tycoons were the ones screwing the whole thing up...

CNN.com - Texas businessman indicted in U.N. oil-for-food probe - Apr 15, 2005

Texas oilman, two Swiss businessmen charged in U.N. scandal

 

[maniclion]

someone please tell me what global warming has to do with peace?

As the temperature rises so do peoples tempers, they don't have the terms hot-headed and cool-headed for non...

 

[bio-chem]

As the temperature rises so do peoples tempers, they don't have the terms hot-headed and cool-headed for non...

now i see. he totally dererves the prize. onward global soldiers. vote al gore for world prime minister. he will lead us to peace

 

[DOMS]

Proof of global warming:

 

[bio-chem]

Proof of global warming:

whats wrong with global warming again? i forgot

 

[Decker]

What I said had ZERO relevance to the global warming scam. Al Gore is the worst kind of hypocrite. You change your lifestyle, you travel less, you reduce consumption, while he increases his consumption, increases his travel, etc. Oh yeah, but he invests in "carbon credits" aka his own investment firm, you should too, you can save the world.

"Heat his home with flatulence?"

His home consumes 20 times more power than the average American home.

"What's he supposed to do? Walk to all his nationwide appearances?"

He flies private jets which consume FAR FAR more fuel per passenger than a commercial airliner.

Are you really that stupid to make such comments when it's crystal clear what my meaning was? Wow.

The guy is a complete scam artist.

I'll address your ham-handed analysis.

Do you know how presidents/vice-presidents--present and past--fly? No you don't but you sure shoot your mouth off like you do.

Gore's house uses 20 times the energy of a normal house? Are Gore's house and living arrangements normal? No. Where does his energy come from? Is it coal, oil or green sources? See, green enery costs more but it is better for the environment and that's what Mr. Gore uses.

Again, you don't know but you sure shoot your mouth off like you do.

Petty right wing ideologues like yourself care only about hurting your opponents. Fine. Attack the messenger.

Job well done.

 

[DOMS]

whats wrong with global warming again? i forgot

Not a damn thing. I'm going out to cut the muffler off my car.

 

[Decker]

agreed very confusing. so whats the answer? i personally dont believe it is to pull out now and let them fight it out on their own. i could be wrong, someone can feel free to convince me otherwise. otherwise bitching about going in there in the first place doesnt seem to help anything.

and i agree a war with iran personally doesnt seem to be benificial to either side at the moment. i dont see it happening. that doesnt mean each side isnt going to posture so that they can get the best for themselves at any one time. it seems like a scare tactic to say this person wants to go to war with iran. thats not the case, to my knowlege none of the canditates on either side wants a war with iran. i just find it unhealthy to publicly say war with iran is not an option. it gives them a lot of wiggle room to interfere with things. leaving the option there isnt taking the option.

The problem is is that the US overthrew Iraq without legitimacy in spite of Iraq's compliance with demands.

That's a dangerous precedent.

What is Iran to do? Does it matter?

The Bush Adm and Congress already designated an Iranian military outfit as a terrorist organization. Considering the flawed doctrine of Preemption and the Bush Directive of 'your with us or against us' re terrorism, I'd say Iran has every right to be scared that the US will flatten it too.

If the president decides to strike Iran with nuclear weapons, I think the US will suffer a great deal. The world will turn against us. Terrorism will really get out of hand and the utter destabilization of the Middle East will be complete.

Nothing good can come out of attacking Iran.

 

[Decker]

The UN is hardly to blame for all of that mess, greedy oil tycoons were the ones screwing the whole thing up...

CNN.com - Texas*businessman indicted in U.N. oil-for-food probe - Apr 15, 2005

Texas oilman, two Swiss businessmen charged in U.N. scandal

The issue is a right wing favorite and really much ado about nothing. Compared to the billions and billions of dollars (US tax dollars) lost in Iraq with no trace, it is nothing.

 

[DOMS]

The problem is is that the US overthrew Iraq without legitimacy and in spite of Iraq's compliance with demands.

I just need to say .

 

[Decker]

I just need to say .

Weapons inspectors meet with Iraq
CNN.com - Weapons inspectors meet with Iraq - September 17, 2002

See the date? 2002. When was the attack? May of 2003.

Iraq was complying with inspections and was forthright with information and President Bush ordered the attack.

Attacking a prone opponent is the height of cowardice.

Iraq agrees to weapons inspections
CNN.com - Iraq agrees to weapons inspections - September 17, 2002

 

[DOMS]

Weapons inspectors meet with Iraq
CNN.com - Weapons inspectors meet with Iraq - September 17, 2002

See the date? 2002. When was the attack? May of 2003.

Iraq was complying with inspections and was forthright with information and President Bush ordered the attack.

Attacking a prone opponent is the height of cowardice.

Iraq agrees to weapons inspections
CNN.com - Iraq agrees to weapons inspections - September 17, 2002

From the first paragraph (emphasis mine):

"Tuesday in what a Baghdad official called 'useful and fruitful' discussions on the return of weapons inspectors."

They were talking about going back. There's nothing there about total compliance. Besides, they had over 10 years to get it done and never did.

 

[tucker01]

Do we really need to go over the whole weapons inspector story for the 1 billionth time?

 

[Decker]

From the first paragraph (emphasis mine):

"Tuesday in what a Baghdad official called 'useful and fruitful' discussions on the return of weapons inspectors."

They were talking about going back. There's nothing there about total compliance. Besides, they had over 10 years to get it done and never did.

Yes, that was when the inspections started up. It took some time but the Iraqis were working in compliance.


I suggest you read the Blix UN reports.

Cooperation on process
It has regard to the procedures, mechanisms, infrastructure and practical arrangements to pursue inspections and seek verifiable disarmament. While inspection is not built on the premise of confidence but may lead to confidence if it is successful, there must nevertheless be a measure of mutual confidence from the very beginning in running the operation of inspection.
Iraq has on the whole cooperated rather well so far with UNMOVIC in this field. The most important point to make is that access has been provided to all sites we have wanted to inspect and with one exception it has been prompt. We have further had great help in building up the infrastructure of our office in Baghdad and the field office in Mosul. Arrangements and services for our plane and our helicopters have been good. The environment has been workable.

CAABU :: Resource Library :: UN Agency Reports on Iraq :: Hans Blix' Iraq Inspection Report January 2003