Gyno flare up on Test P and Tren Ace Cycle - Help Please

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Hey,

Since nobody is responding to my other thread anymore, I figured I would start a new one.

So I am taking the following doses, and I am just finishing week 3 today.

Test P @ 80mg ED
Tren A @ 40mg ED

HCG @ 500iu weekly

Arimidex @ 1mg ED (yes EVERY DAY)

And in the last 4-5 days, a small lump is starting to grow under my right nipple despite using Arimidex. Everywhere I had read that prolactin needs estrogen in order to convert to prolactin, and I figure I have that under control but the gyno issue is still getting worse, a little bit every day.

I don't have any Cabergoline, but I think I can possibly get some. Do you guys think could be a prolactin problem ?

I figured using such a high dose of Adex would help me out.... I know my Adex is legit....

I have also read that HCG can create estrogen directly through other means than aromatization. So it could be the HCG as well....

Thoughts please !!!

 

[Shadowcam]

You need letro and caber when running tren!

 

[BillHicksFan]

I ran tren/test for 8 weeks with no signs of gyno, proviron seemed to have worked for me to prevent gyno however I dosed vitamin B6 at 200mg per day as that reduces prolactin and I made sure that I had caber and letro on hand incase I ran into trouble.

My advise would be to get some letro and caber asap and start taking 200-400mg of vit B6 immediately but I'm no expert, I've just researched this particular cycle.

When you get your gyno sorted you may want to change to aromasin.

 

[pyes]

You may want to pull out the letro and aromasin. Too bad you cannot try nolva as you are on a 19nor

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Does anybody have any caber on hand that they can sell to me?

Also, how will Aromasin help with prolactin ?

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

What kind of dosing should I use on the caber ?

 

[SUPERFLY1234]

i had the same problems when i ran test p and tren a, it started happening toward the end of the cycle. letro help it out a lot.

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

i had the same problems when i ran test p and tren a, it started happening toward the end of the cycle. letro help it out a lot.

How did you dose it?

 

[slimshady95]

Does anybody have any caber on hand that they can sell to me?

Also, how will Aromasin help with prolactin ?

Good luck with that silly ass question IMO.......

 

[pimprn]

ok listen up i researched this ok:
NUMBER 1 WTF ARE YOU THINKING TREN WITH JUST ADEX!!!!! its a 19nor get some fkn prami or cabar ok. Look at the CEM sponsor and order a bottle of prami EASY! Then Up your dose of adex once you suffice the gyno everyone is different and i do not know the compound well enough to help you out on dosing. Im saying to use ur adex cause u have some letro is very potent and will get rid of atleast 98% of your estrogen. So your prami and adex ok bro!

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

ok listen up i researched this ok:
NUMBER 1 WTF ARE YOU THINKING TREN WITH JUST ADEX!!!!! its a 19nor get some fkn prami or cabar ok. Look at the CEM sponsor and order a bottle of prami EASY! Then Up your dose of adex once you suffice the gyno everyone is different and i do not know the compound well enough to help you out on dosing. Im saying to use ur adex cause u have some letro is very potent and will get rid of atleast 98% of your estrogen. So your prami and adex ok bro!

Yeah unfortunately I am waiting for my caber in the mail..... because my supplier dropped the ball and "ran out" of caber. I now have a second lump starting as well on the same side. This is the worst case of gyno I have ever had.

 

[heavyiron]

Up the Arimidex to 1mg every 12 hours. AI's reduce E2 and Progesterone.

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Up the Arimidex to 1mg every 12 hours. AI's reduce E2 and Progesterone.

Wow thanks for the recommendation. I have never heard of this before. Hopefully this will help until my Caber arrives.\

The thing is I don't understand is the below statement.

According to (Clin Biochem 2001 Nov;38(Pt 6):596-607), prolactin only has a stimulatory effect on gynecomastia in the prescence of high circulating estrogen levels. Testosterone which aromotizes to estrogen caused a cause of increased prolactin according to (Acta Endocrinol (Copenh) 1984 Feb;105(2):167-72). In the same study, Clomid (clomiphene) and Nolva (tamoxifen) showed a reduction in the man’s high levels of prolactin. There is no research evidence that I have found, that points to true breast development developing with just prolactin or progesterone alone or caused by non-aromotizing steroids, without any high circulating estrogen levels. Estrogen must be at high enough levels to work synergistically with high levels of prolactin or progesterone, to cause breast development and lactation.

Why am I still having issues if I am dosing such a heavy amount of Adex already lol.....

Could it be the HCG ? I have heard that HCG can cause estrogen directly without aromatization. If that is indeed the issue, what is the suggestion then?

Also below

The only anti-estrogen I wouldn’t recommend for combatting this gyno is Nolva (tamoxifen) because in (J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 2003 Sep;86(3-5):461-7) they found progesterone receptor expression increased, while it decreased with other anti-aromatase inhibitors

So basically, what I am thinking... is that somehow there is enough estrogen floating around from the HCG that it is able to convert to prolactin or progesterone because at such a high dose of Adex, it just doesn't seem possible. Some people cringe at the thought of using 1mg of Adex ED.

 

[unclem]

u wanted prami on the buy or sell i pm u did u get it? but i think u got good advice on here i think u have to make your decision brother. its your tits not anyone elses. dont put so much science behind everything , it complicates things more. like when they study new drugs they do a placebo and a drug study. and they no the science behind , but, how is it going to work on us, humans is wat there after. so make your final decision and stick with it. good luck.

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

u wanted prami on the buy or sell i pm u did u get it? but i think u got good advice on here i think u have to make your decision brother. its your tits not anyone elses. dont put so much science behind everything , it complicates things more. like when they study new drugs they do a placebo and a drug study. and they no the science behind , but, how is it going to work on us, humans is wat there after. so make your final decision and stick with it. good luck.

Yeah I emailed that guy that you told me to. He doesnt seem to have either Caber or Prami. But I think he is looking for me, thanks for the efforts.

 

[pimprn]

CEM bro i hope your tits go away.

 

[heavyiron]

Wow thanks for the recommendation. I have never heard of this before. Hopefully this will help until my Caber arrives.\

Its funny you say this since you quote exactly that in your post.

"The only anti-estrogen I wouldn???t recommend for combatting this gyno is Nolva (tamoxifen) because in (J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 2003 Sep;86(3-5):461-7) they found progesterone receptor expression increased, while it decreased with other anti-aromatase inhibitors"

The thing is I don't understand is the below statement.



Why am I still having issues if I am dosing such a heavy amount of Adex already lol.....

Could it be the HCG ? I have heard that HCG can cause estrogen directly without aromatization. If that is indeed the issue, what is the suggestion then?

Also below



So basically, what I am thinking... is that somehow there is enough estrogen floating around from the HCG that it is able to convert to prolactin or progesterone because at such a high dose of Adex, it just doesn't seem possible. Some people cringe at the thought of using 1mg of Adex ED.

Your Adex dose is not high for a male injecting aromatizing compounds. Only thread parrots that don't understand the science think the dose is high. 1mg Adex daily reduces E2 on average about 50% in males. The half life of adex also shortens in males. If you dose Adex every 12 hours you will likely get maximal E2 supression in about 7-10 days. Only labs can dial in your AI dose though.

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Its funny you say this since you quote exactly that in your post.

"The only anti-estrogen I wouldn’t recommend for combatting this gyno is Nolva (tamoxifen) because in (J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 2003 Sep;86(3-5):461-7) they found progesterone receptor expression increased, while it decreased with other anti-aromatase inhibitors"


Your Adex dose is not high for a male injecting aromatizing compounds. Only thread parrots that don't understand the science think the dose is high. 1mg Adex daily reduces E2 on average about 50% in males. The half life of adex also shortens in males. If you dose Adex every 12 hours you will likely get maximal E2 supression in about 7-10 days. Only labs can dial in your AI dose though.

Marry me ?

Also wanted to add, I am on the 2nd day of my 4th week. I have kept my diet VERY clean and I just took my blood pressure.

123/73

YAY !!!!!!! I am very happy with this cycle other than the gyno. I feel so healthy, my cardio is actually UP, I have no other noticeable sides. And the HCG is keeping my boys producing. I will try upping the dose to 1mg every 12 hours. Thanks again dude!

Also, being that this is the first time I have run Tren, I have nothing to compare it to but... it doesn't seem as if the Adex is messing with my strength yet....

I wish I could give you more REP

 

[SUPERFLY1234]

How did you dose it?

i used .5mgs twice a day once every 12 hours. once gyno started getting better i dropped the dosage to .25mgs twice day. only sides i got from it was no sex drive

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

i used .5mgs twice a day once every 12 hours. once gyno started getting better i dropped the dosage to .25mgs twice day. only sides i got from it was no sex drive

Unfortunately my guy only have Letro in capsules rated at 2.5mg each haha..... so for now I think I will stick to Adex.

Ok so I just ordered some Prami from https://www.ir**-drag**.com
And I paid for 1-3 business days shipping. So hopefully it will get here quickly. I have never even heard of Prami, any suggestions dosing until my Caber gets here?

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Ok so... I think the Adex has stopped the GROWTH of the lump. Up to 2mg ED of Adex and so far no noticeable drop in strength. But I hope the Caber makes the size go down once it arrives, HURRY THE !@#$ UP !!!!

I have however upped my dose of Tren to 50mg ED and Var to 50mg ED. My Test P is now 100mg ED. So I think that is counteracting the low estrogen, because I am still feeling amazing.

My cardio is still not suffering at all. I have had ONE nightmare so far. No night sweats, no sleeping issues (thanks to a fat joint before bed). No bloating.

And now that I have just begun week 5, it seems like everything is peaking and my gains are through the roof every work out. I couldn't be happier with my cycle.
Slight loss of sex drive, but hopefully once my caber arrives that will help me out.
HCG is keeping my boys going. Up to 207lbs now with no noticeable fat gain, in fact it seems like I am leaning out even more.

If TREN was a women, I would marry her. I LOVE YOU TREN <3 <3 <3



Just a follow up question.

Since I am doing Test Prop, Anavar and Tren Ace. How long after my last injection should I begin my PCT?

 

[heavyiron]

3-4 days

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

3-4 days

So which is it ? 3 or 4?

 

[heatherallen]

hey man do you know of any sites how to make deca and supples

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

My first bout with night sweats last night. It was SOOOO FUNNY.
I slept like a baby, but I kept waking up because I was too hot, then I would remove my blanket and start freezing then put it back on and start sweating.

I think the reason it happened was because I had to switch to EOD for a few days while I traveled and it caused a bit of unstable blood levels but I am hoping by switching back to ED injections things should stabilize a bit.

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

I'd like to say.

I think the Adex @ 2mg has finally kicked in, because my strength went down and the size of the lump has decreased a bit and it is no longer sensitive. Now, I'm just unsure of how to adjust my training to the loss of strength.... any suggestions?

Does loss of strength mean loss of muscle?

 

[fredlabrute]

You may want to pull out the letro and aromasin. Too bad you cannot try nolva as you are on a 19nor

Nolva simply doesn't aromatize into progesterone,i had gyno issues on a cycle of 750mg test E,600mg Eq and 500mg tren A,guess what, i took nolva at 40mg for 4 days and the symptoms were gone!!!And the dose of tren is very low,are you sure that's the compound causing the gyno?If there's no improvement after 2-3 days of taking nolva then stop it,cause usually it works fast!!!When evrything will be in check, up your AI dose!!!

 

[OneWheyOrAnother]

Nolva simply doesn't aromatize into progesterone,i had gyno issues on a cycle of 750mg test E,600mg Eq and 500mg tren A,guess what, i took nolva at 40mg for 4 days and the symptoms were gone!!!And the dose of tren is very low,are you sure that's the compound causing the gyno?If there's no improvement after 2-3 days of taking nolva then stop it,cause usually it works fast!!!When evrything will be in check, up your AI dose!!!

That would simply depend on what is causing your gyno.....

I added in Anavar a few weeks into the cycle. But the problem started before I added in the Anavar.

I am running Test Prop and Tren Ace. I am taking Adex at 2mg ED now and the problem is starting to calm down. Before, when I was taking 1mg ED, it wasn't really helping. But now I feel my strength suffering, maybe I should up my dose of Anavar to help counteract that....

And I am pretty sure it's not an estrogen problem, because I have a lump on my left side (estrogen related) from a previous cycle, that is actually shrinking in size, while the one on the right, only until yesterday kept growing. So it has to be prolactin induced, otherwise it too would have been kept in check by the Adex.

The only other thing I can think of would be the HCG, but not one person on here has admitted that it could be the problem, so I have dismissed it. But my theory was, that HCG causes estrogen from aromatization and directly forms estrogen as well. So I figured there was JUST ENOUGH circulating estrogen from the HCG (dosed at 500iu EW) to fuel the progesterone, thus prolactin issue causing gyno.

One time I got gyno on my right side from taking M1T... and I was dosing Nolva at 80mg ED and it didn't help WHATSOEVER.
Another case of prolactin induced gyno.... although that lump eventually disappeared almost a year later....

My current doses are as follows....

Test Prop 100mg ED
Tren Ace 50mg ED
Anavar 60mg ED

 

[theCaptn']

looks to me like your shoulda stuck to pink magic and celltech

 

[Dark Geared God]

looks to me like your shoulda stuck to pink magic and celltech

beta-al inter-anally, with the magic shake diet