why does tren give me gyno?

[pasamoto]

i used tren for thr first time last cycle. was 175 prop/350 tren/ 500 mast p. i ran this for about 8wks then switched to long esters and dropped the mast. i quickly developed some gyno which letro and prami did nothing for. as soon as i droped the tren it quickly went away. this was real gyno, hard painfull lumps. not just some puffy nips. im using 350 prop/350 trenA/350 mast p for the last 3 1/2 weeks. im using 25mg exemestane and worked all the way upto 3mg caber. the lumps i have now are very small but slightly sensitve. seem to be under control tho. why does this happen?

 

[s2h]

pulling the mast from the cycle with test prop at a low dose allowed the tren to more freely bind to the progesterone receptor...progestins increase the effect of estrogens on the breast tissue...an AI will counter this sometimes and sometimes it wont..keep a DHT derived compound in your cycles when you use tren in the future and it should be fine..

 

[pasamoto]

pulling the mast from the cycle with test prop at a low dose allowed the tren to more freely bind to the progesterone receptor...progestins increase the effect of estrogens on the breast tissue...an AI will counter this sometimes and sometimes it wont..keep a DHT derived compound in your cycles when you use tren in the future and it should be fine..

i see your point. def got bad when i dropped the mast. this cycle im on 350 mast p a week. still having issue.

 

[Mike Arnold]

pulling the mast from the cycle with test prop at a low dose allowed the tren to more freely bind to the progesterone receptor...progestins increase the effect of estrogens on the breast tissue...an AI will counter this sometimes and sometimes it wont..keep a DHT derived compound in your cycles when you use tren in the future and it should be fine..

Perfect answer.

 

[pasamoto]

Perfect answer.

So how much masteron to use? At 350mg I'm still having the issue

 

[Mike Arnold]

So how much masteron to use? At 350mg I'm still having the issue

Since it is already an issue, use Nolvadex until the gyno subsides. Gyno can manifest either in the form of swollen, itchy nipples...or one can begin to form hard, painful lumps without any significant swelling...or both can occur at the same time. Swelling is the easiest form to deal with because in many cases, no actual tissue has formed yet, so a quick course of Nolva clears it right up. However, hard lumps are indicatuive of gland formation...which is much more difficult to get rid of....and in some cass, it can never be fully gotten rid of. In most cases, by the time someone has formed multiple, hard lumps the size of raisins, the growth will never completely go away, although it can often be severely reduced to where it is barely noticable. If large amounts of glandular tissue have formed (the point where your gyno looks like minature tits), you're screwed...surgey is the only option.

 

[hypo_glycemic]

So how much masteron to use? At 350mg I'm still having the issue

Caber for prolactin. And Formeron or stane for E2..

Should be fine w/ 350 if you're using correct AI and if you're running a 19 nor, i'd use .5 of caber EOD, or find the dose that combats.

 

[BlueJayMuscle]

Since it is already an issue, use Nolvadex until the gyno subsides. Gyno can manifest either in the form of swollen, itchy nipples...or one can begin to form hard, painful lumps without any significant swelling...or both can occur at the same time. Swelling is the easiest form to deal with because in many cases, no actual tissue has formed yet, so a quick course of Nolva clears it right up. However, hard lumps are indicatuive of gland formation...which is much more difficult to get rid of....and in some cass, it can never be fully gotten rid of. In most cases, by the time someone has formed multiple, hard lumps the size of raisins, the growth will never completely go away, although it can often be severely reduced to where it is barely noticable. If large amounts of glandular tissue have formed (the point where your gyno looks like minature tits), you're screwed...surgey is the only option.

Just for clarification, once glandular tissue has formed and is larger than raisin size, no amount of nolva +AI will reduce its size to barely/not noticeable?


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[hypo_glycemic]

I'd go to maybe a good dose of Letro if the tissue has formed.. Blue Jay is right though, nolvadex won't cut it..

 

[pasamoto]

Caber for prolactin. And Formeron or stane for E2..

Should be fine w/ 350 if you're using correct AI and if you're running a 19 nor, i'd use .5 of caber EOD, or find the dose that combats.

using .5mg caber EOD and 25mg exemestane. its keeping from getting worse, but not any better.

 

[pasamoto]

I'd go to maybe a good dose of Letro if the tissue has formed.. Blue Jay is right though, nolvadex won't cut it..

last cycle i was using 2.5mg letro ED. did nothing for the lumps. as soon as i pulled the tren they were alomost gone in aweek

 

[s2h]

last cycle i was using 2.5mg letro ED. did nothing for the lumps. as soon as i pulled the tren they were alomost gone in aweek

you would need either a SERM and/or a DHT derived compound in the cycle to prevent progesterone related gyno in the future..something as mild as anavar or proviron will normally do the trick..

 

[s2h]

Just for clarification, once glandular tissue has formed and is larger than raisin size, no amount of nolva +AI will reduce its size to barely/not noticeable?


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IMO thats not the case 100% of the time...but prob 98% of the time..once the glandular tissue has formed its not going away easy...

 

[hypo_glycemic]

you would need either a SERM and/or a DHT derived compound in the cycle to prevent progesterone related gyno in the future..something as mild as anavar or proviron will normally do the trick..

Sometimes it's surgery. A lot of my NPC/IFBB friends have had to get it cut out..

 

[s2h]

Sometimes it's surgery. A lot of my NPC/IFBB friends have had to get it cut out..

yeah it happens...i find most guys that get gyno get it early on in there AAS journey..a little education could/would prevent most gyno issues from getting to surgery...

gyno is like that old shitty luggage your grandparents all had for 40 yrs..it just keeps coming back in some...

 

[hypo_glycemic]

^ lol. Good analogy

 

[BlueJayMuscle]

yeah it happens...i find most guys that get gyno get it early on in there AAS journey..a little education could/would prevent most gyno issues from getting to surgery...

gyno is like that old shitty luggage your grandparents all had for 40 yrs..it just keeps coming back in some...

Definitely agree. Without a DHT derivative or SERM, and if I have test in there at all at any decent dosage, I'm guaranteed to get gyno.

Didn't do as much research into prevention as I had originally thought back in the day haha

 

[pasamoto]

I have some nolva. What should dosage be? I'm raising masteron to 500mg. I assume there's no need for the AI once the nolva has started.