overburdened
Board Rep
Ok... I was a little concerned... 3 a day, even 4 is good dosing protocol.. though I think 3 is sufficient... half life is 6 hours...
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overburdened
Board Rep
pm me on ij when you post after the comps.. I dont get on here much any more...I'm def interested!!! also, check out the new log... got a guy doing a comp on this(bb/fitness)
cottonmouth
Registered
So to get an idea of this compound, could we make like a little profile for it?
Here is what im getting from all the posts.
It non-estrogenic, with no progesterone activity or very little, lowers shbg more than just about anything else, burns fat greater than just about anything else, increases nitrogen retention, increases hunger, packs on lbm, binds very strong to your ar, is no where near as harsh on you liver as methly tren, and all at around 4mg/day.
Did I miss anything? or get anything wrong? Im just trying to get a good idea of what this compound is/does.
Here is what im getting from all the posts.
It non-estrogenic, with no progesterone activity or very little, lowers shbg more than just about anything else, burns fat greater than just about anything else, increases nitrogen retention, increases hunger, packs on lbm, binds very strong to your ar, is no where near as harsh on you liver as methly tren, and all at around 4mg/day.
Did I miss anything? or get anything wrong? Im just trying to get a good idea of what this compound is/does.
overburdened
Board Rep
you got most of it.. looking at my labs(and I haven't seen this log in a bit, if vibrant has some labs, I would like to see if the same is true there...)I believe the nitrogen retention with this is EXTREMELY HIGH!!!! my 'waste' chems in my blood dropped dramatically from this..(creatinine being the main one... there is a lot behind the creatinine levels in the blood, and a certain measurement doesn't necessarily mean a certain thing is going on... you have to take into account what is happening with your body physically, along with those levels.. and MANY other factors...)
you missed energy(this is a MAJOR good side!!!)
euphoria(most people like this, me included.... it makes everything seem easier when you have a nice euphoric(almost a buzz) feeling, and you stay in a good mood all day!
drive!!!! this stuff gives you a drive that is not like most aas that cross the blood/brain barrier.. and that give you a 'drive' ... this drive is totally different, and works when others have failed(to help keep youu motivated, and keep you in the gym working out...)
anyone else wanna add to this, that has taken it?
also, I believe that, even though it doesn't exhibit much progestin effects or sides... by itself... It GREATLY exacerbates any progestogenic activity of other aas!!! this has been my experience(and it is severely limited.. it could have just caused a little 'puffiness' around the nipple... and nothing else...(I took one dose of npp.... let it clear, took one dose of tren...the tren was 'less severe' progestin sides than npp...but that also could have just been due to the fact that npp causes more swelling and edema than tren...
sorry for lack of updates.
I finished my comp on monday and got back home yesterday.
Comp went pretty good. I felt my physical level was very good for the comp. It was very hot+humid but my body held up really well, some other guys had a few problems with the heat like cramping/dehydration/heat exhaustion but I was good. it was very tough mentally as well because I had to deal with a lot of rain delays, going back and forth from my hotel to the comp site.
So comp went well until the end where I got unlucky. I was competing against some hometown favorites and the officiating was atrocious. I wanted to punch out some referees
but whatever, I felt good and Im getting ready for another comp starting this weekend.
so after I came back yesterday, I hit the gym for a chest/shoulders/tri's workout. workout was great, had no loss of strength even though I usually do after a comp especially when its so hot.
today I worked out legs and got a great workout in again.
Diet was a bit all over the place during my comp, I'd probably say high protein like always but med-pretty high carbs.
The ptren kept me very lean, to be honest I think I lost some BF% during my comp without losing much size and with no strength loss.
unfortunately, I got a cold closer to the end of my comp. I pretty much only get colds at hotels now because of the A/Cs there.
Due to my cold, I didn't take the ptren yesterday or today because I have a comp soon and I need to get rid of this cold. I have to take some cold meds and I never take any orals mild or not while I take cold/flu meds.
So I've been on the ptren exactly 17 days before I paused it yesterday. Im really impressed with it. I havent decided yet if I'll restart my ptren run as soon my cold is gone but regardless if I restart it or not, I got a great feel for it and I have quite a bit of the ptren, so I'll be definitely experimenting with it a lot in the coming months.
I will post in a few days, some of my thoughts on the ptren and some recommendations on cycles with it.
I finished my comp on monday and got back home yesterday.
Comp went pretty good. I felt my physical level was very good for the comp. It was very hot+humid but my body held up really well, some other guys had a few problems with the heat like cramping/dehydration/heat exhaustion but I was good. it was very tough mentally as well because I had to deal with a lot of rain delays, going back and forth from my hotel to the comp site.
So comp went well until the end where I got unlucky. I was competing against some hometown favorites and the officiating was atrocious. I wanted to punch out some referees
but whatever, I felt good and Im getting ready for another comp starting this weekend.so after I came back yesterday, I hit the gym for a chest/shoulders/tri's workout. workout was great, had no loss of strength even though I usually do after a comp especially when its so hot.
today I worked out legs and got a great workout in again.
Diet was a bit all over the place during my comp, I'd probably say high protein like always but med-pretty high carbs.
The ptren kept me very lean, to be honest I think I lost some BF% during my comp without losing much size and with no strength loss.
unfortunately, I got a cold closer to the end of my comp. I pretty much only get colds at hotels now because of the A/Cs there.
Due to my cold, I didn't take the ptren yesterday or today because I have a comp soon and I need to get rid of this cold. I have to take some cold meds and I never take any orals mild or not while I take cold/flu meds.
So I've been on the ptren exactly 17 days before I paused it yesterday. Im really impressed with it. I havent decided yet if I'll restart my ptren run as soon my cold is gone but regardless if I restart it or not, I got a great feel for it and I have quite a bit of the ptren, so I'll be definitely experimenting with it a lot in the coming months.
I will post in a few days, some of my thoughts on the ptren and some recommendations on cycles with it.
non-estrogenic: yes, I'd say thats the case. I didn't have to increase my ai doses at all since I added the ptren into my test/mast cycle.
progesterone activity or very little: I'd say very little or none because the first week, I didn't take anything like caber and I don't really think its needed. I did add blr's prolactrone but I was using 1-2 caps a day. usually one and again I didn't think its needed but just to play it safe, have something on hand. but as overB said below it can increase progestrogenic activity of other aas, so be care in what you take with it.
lowers shbg: not sure but could be tested with some BW.
burns fat: yes, definitely burns fat
Increases hunger: yes, it does this very well. I have no problem eating pretty much any amount on it.
LBM gain: yes for sure
Not harsh: I haven't done BW on it but Im planning to sometime in the future. By my feel, its not harsh at all. I feel bad on harsh methylated compounds and I had none of this on it.
Euphoric feeling: like overB said below, you get a euphoric feeling when taking it. I think everybody that has taken ptren has reported the same thing
Increased metabolism: after taking it, I felt a slight rise in overall body temp. I think the increased metabolism on it directly ties into its fat burning and hunger increase.
Great sleep: I can honestly say that as soon as I started taking it, that my sleep improved. I feel asleep faster, sleep was deeper, vivid dreams sometimes, woke up feeling more refreshed even when I had less total sleep time than usual.
overburdened
Board Rep
Vibrant, I would have to say that you are one of the best people, at doing logs, that I've ever seen!!!! I'm helping a guy get ready for a comp, using this stuff... and, of course, It's going extraordinarily well!!!!!
I think, with what you added to that list.. and your verifications of what you felt was similar to what I had stated... this has to be one of the most 'reliable' aas(what I mean by this... most aas have from slightly, to drastically differing results in different people.... this stuff does nearly the EXACT SAME thing to EVERY PERSON that has tried it!!!!)
these seem to be 'commons' among every single person that has tried it(and when I say 'intend', I mean... make a plan for that goal, and stick with it... it's an aas.. not a lifestyle.. you must make the lifestyle yourself... )
If you intend to bulk,(and it is easy to do so, since it increases hunger to the degree that it does), eat enough food... and train to bulk... you will gain A LOT of LBM!!!
if you intend to lose bf%(an I wasn't even intending to do that.. just bulk... but I did lose bf too... and quite a bit of it at that!!!!!) you WILL LOSE BF%!!!!
If you intend to 'get into shape'(cardiovascular/pulmonary), it is EXCELLENT for this!!!
If you intend to excell at sports(whatever level you may be at....) you will excel.. and heal!!!
this is one that I JUST noticed myself.... this was not postulated beforehand(other than that I figured it may help a small amt, due to massive drop in shbg and albumin(I do have bloodwork showing this btw, Vibrant.... It brought both to nearly ZERO,... they are between .1 and .3)I would have to look again for exact numbers... but this is not the ONLY way it is doing this... I am not totally sure, myself, how this is having the effect it is having... I will be paying close attn though.. and report back what my thoughts on this are....
This stuff, after taking it(and I did NO PCT(long story.. but I didn't want to skew lab tests on parathyroid.. etc)) I held onto all but 3lbs(for a while... don't know when I quit taking it.. a few days after I tried the inj form... I think I ran inj for 4-5 days(didn't seem nearly as effective.. but I wanted to try it..lol) so, this was 2+ weeks ago...I had not worked out til SAT july 21(since a few days prior to stopping the ptren (oral), about 4 days prior to stopping the oral...i had only worked out 2, maybe 3 times, TOPS.....until july 21!).. the main reason was I felt like shit from this parathyroid issue.. and, on top of that, was working VERY long hours!(the ptren seemed to help lessen the symptoms DRAMATICALLY!! but I needed some labs done, so the issue can be delt with permanently(parathyroid removed), so I ceased EVERYTHING.. including peps(which I had run for the last part of the ptren).. after first labs for parathyroid were done.. a question regarding inj form of ptren was brought up .. I tried it(24mg 'frontload').. so hungry, and that dose had opposite effect on energy(made me tired).. but, so hungry I couldn't even work out(after I ate nearly every morsel of food before I went to the gym!!!! I, then, ran the inj for about 4 days.. at 6-8mg ed... was decent(nothing compared to oral form though!!!!! labs came back skewed due to vitamins I was still taking(that I didn't realize would skew them), so I had to wait for vit D clearance, then have redraw... so, I had gone with NOTHING for about 2 1/2 weeks... redraw...
this is the crazy part... on july 21, I was only down 3lbs(no pct) from when I ceased oral ptren!!!(after gaining over 24lbs lean mass!!!)... I made an effort to keep on track at the gym...monday, I worked out again... then on wed morning(by wed morning, I had filled most of the way back out... I had basically retained all the mass and leannes from the ptren, but lost some of the 'fullness'.... I was 3lbs light jul 21, on monday(july 23) I was 1/2-1lb light.... basically all of the fullness back....
so, monday... I had to try a couple aas out(long story).. so, since all labs are drawn, I decided to go ahead and run a couple things(at far lower doses than I 'normally' would)... after all, I was just 'trying a couple before a guy used them for a show(I react VERY quickly to short esters, and can tell, from years upon years of use, if that is what is in them(what is supposed to be in them)......
so, monday, I took 150mg tren a(it had been sitting around a while.. and I think it was about 30% degraded.. so there was probably `100mg in it, not 150....)
100mg tne/ 60mg prop
20mg nolva
.25mg caber
12.5mg winny(oral)
as well, I started back on peps:
200mcg ghrp2/100mcg cjc-1295(no DAC) (twice daily)
200mcg ipam/100cjc-1295(no DAC) at bedtime
I continued the tren a at 75mg ed(so actually probably 50)
tne/prop at 100/60 ed
same on everything else daily(except caber is at .25 eod)
I am now 2lbs heavier than when I stopped the ptren oral.... and retained all the leanness(I am posting two pics... one is first shoulder workout since surgery(first 'real ' workout...) this was sat july 21.. the second was taken thursday morning(no pump.. just woken up)
http://foto.pk/images/postptzkz.jpg
http://foto.pk/images/july262012.jpg
I think, with what you added to that list.. and your verifications of what you felt was similar to what I had stated... this has to be one of the most 'reliable' aas(what I mean by this... most aas have from slightly, to drastically differing results in different people.... this stuff does nearly the EXACT SAME thing to EVERY PERSON that has tried it!!!!)
these seem to be 'commons' among every single person that has tried it(and when I say 'intend', I mean... make a plan for that goal, and stick with it... it's an aas.. not a lifestyle.. you must make the lifestyle yourself... )
If you intend to bulk,(and it is easy to do so, since it increases hunger to the degree that it does), eat enough food... and train to bulk... you will gain A LOT of LBM!!!
if you intend to lose bf%(an I wasn't even intending to do that.. just bulk... but I did lose bf too... and quite a bit of it at that!!!!!) you WILL LOSE BF%!!!!
If you intend to 'get into shape'(cardiovascular/pulmonary), it is EXCELLENT for this!!!
If you intend to excell at sports(whatever level you may be at....) you will excel.. and heal!!!
this is one that I JUST noticed myself.... this was not postulated beforehand(other than that I figured it may help a small amt, due to massive drop in shbg and albumin(I do have bloodwork showing this btw, Vibrant.... It brought both to nearly ZERO,... they are between .1 and .3)I would have to look again for exact numbers... but this is not the ONLY way it is doing this... I am not totally sure, myself, how this is having the effect it is having... I will be paying close attn though.. and report back what my thoughts on this are....
This stuff, after taking it(and I did NO PCT(long story.. but I didn't want to skew lab tests on parathyroid.. etc)) I held onto all but 3lbs(for a while... don't know when I quit taking it.. a few days after I tried the inj form... I think I ran inj for 4-5 days(didn't seem nearly as effective.. but I wanted to try it..lol) so, this was 2+ weeks ago...I had not worked out til SAT july 21(since a few days prior to stopping the ptren (oral), about 4 days prior to stopping the oral...i had only worked out 2, maybe 3 times, TOPS.....until july 21!).. the main reason was I felt like shit from this parathyroid issue.. and, on top of that, was working VERY long hours!(the ptren seemed to help lessen the symptoms DRAMATICALLY!! but I needed some labs done, so the issue can be delt with permanently(parathyroid removed), so I ceased EVERYTHING.. including peps(which I had run for the last part of the ptren).. after first labs for parathyroid were done.. a question regarding inj form of ptren was brought up .. I tried it(24mg 'frontload').. so hungry, and that dose had opposite effect on energy(made me tired).. but, so hungry I couldn't even work out(after I ate nearly every morsel of food before I went to the gym!!!! I, then, ran the inj for about 4 days.. at 6-8mg ed... was decent(nothing compared to oral form though!!!!! labs came back skewed due to vitamins I was still taking(that I didn't realize would skew them), so I had to wait for vit D clearance, then have redraw... so, I had gone with NOTHING for about 2 1/2 weeks... redraw...
this is the crazy part... on july 21, I was only down 3lbs(no pct) from when I ceased oral ptren!!!(after gaining over 24lbs lean mass!!!)... I made an effort to keep on track at the gym...monday, I worked out again... then on wed morning(by wed morning, I had filled most of the way back out... I had basically retained all the mass and leannes from the ptren, but lost some of the 'fullness'.... I was 3lbs light jul 21, on monday(july 23) I was 1/2-1lb light.... basically all of the fullness back....
so, monday... I had to try a couple aas out(long story).. so, since all labs are drawn, I decided to go ahead and run a couple things(at far lower doses than I 'normally' would)... after all, I was just 'trying a couple before a guy used them for a show(I react VERY quickly to short esters, and can tell, from years upon years of use, if that is what is in them(what is supposed to be in them)......
so, monday, I took 150mg tren a(it had been sitting around a while.. and I think it was about 30% degraded.. so there was probably `100mg in it, not 150....)
100mg tne/ 60mg prop
20mg nolva
.25mg caber
12.5mg winny(oral)
as well, I started back on peps:
200mcg ghrp2/100mcg cjc-1295(no DAC) (twice daily)
200mcg ipam/100cjc-1295(no DAC) at bedtime
I continued the tren a at 75mg ed(so actually probably 50)
tne/prop at 100/60 ed
same on everything else daily(except caber is at .25 eod)
I am now 2lbs heavier than when I stopped the ptren oral.... and retained all the leanness(I am posting two pics... one is first shoulder workout since surgery(first 'real ' workout...) this was sat july 21.. the second was taken thursday morning(no pump.. just woken up)
http://foto.pk/images/postptzkz.jpg
http://foto.pk/images/july262012.jpg
AugustWest
Registered
Damn great log this stuff looks insane.
Few questions.
Vibrant this is an oral correct? I noticed you posted a solution. Did you just get the powder and inject it then or did you just take it orally?
Overburdened- You were injecting this correct? Does this compound need to be IM or can you go subq with a slin pin?
Few questions.
Vibrant this is an oral correct? I noticed you posted a solution. Did you just get the powder and inject it then or did you just take it orally?
Overburdened- You were injecting this correct? Does this compound need to be IM or can you go subq with a slin pin?
I took it orally and will continue to do so.
I believe overb did make into an injectable but if I'm not mistaken he said the oral way of taking it was better. Im sure he will chime in and he will answer your question.
**for yesterday**
I restarted the run of ptren at 6mg.
morning: sports workout with my trainer. med intensity
afternoon: jogging in a park
I had some time before my evening gym workout, so I took a nap. WOW, my nap was great. I slept for about 1:15. didn't even feel myself fall asleep and had vivid dreams.
evening: gym chest/shoulders/tri's. I had a training partner, so I could go heavy. I started off with flat bench, and went pretty heavy and finished with a couple burnout sets. the pump I got in my chest was insane. later in the workout, I couldn't go heavy anymore because my chest/shoulders/tri's were just too pumped, had to lower the weights. my training partner even asked me "are you getting fatigued?", it was exactly the opposite. I felt like I wasn't tiring at all.
I even still felt my upper body being pumped a few hours later.
diet was good. appetite instantly went up from starting the ptren up again.
Didn't get enough time to sleep but I still woke up pretty refreshed.
I restarted the run of ptren at 6mg.
morning: sports workout with my trainer. med intensity
afternoon: jogging in a park
I had some time before my evening gym workout, so I took a nap. WOW, my nap was great. I slept for about 1:15. didn't even feel myself fall asleep and had vivid dreams.
evening: gym chest/shoulders/tri's. I had a training partner, so I could go heavy. I started off with flat bench, and went pretty heavy and finished with a couple burnout sets. the pump I got in my chest was insane. later in the workout, I couldn't go heavy anymore because my chest/shoulders/tri's were just too pumped, had to lower the weights. my training partner even asked me "are you getting fatigued?", it was exactly the opposite. I felt like I wasn't tiring at all.
I even still felt my upper body being pumped a few hours later.
diet was good. appetite instantly went up from starting the ptren up again.
Didn't get enough time to sleep but I still woke up pretty refreshed.
overburdened
Board Rep
I used it both IM and Orally... the oral administration was FAR more effective!!! but the IM was more convenient... not enough so to make up for the difference in effectiveness whatsoever though
cottonmouth
Registered
Vibrant, are you planning on bw during this cycle?
This sounds awesome, I cant wait to run it. I'm thinking in about 4 weeks,
This sounds awesome, I cant wait to run it. I'm thinking in about 4 weeks,
AugustWest
Registered
So is this only being offered by pm'ing AS2? Im gearing up for a fall run and would love to try it out.
I might get some bw this week but not sure. I have a comp so Im not sure if I'll be able to squeeze it in. If I do, I'll post up the results.
its up on his site under propionyltrenbolone.
[h=1][/h]
AugustWest
Registered
Sweet thx brother. So since this isnt liver damaging does that mean we can take it longer than the normal 4 week frontload?
I'd still stick to about 4-5 weeks but I'll be trying to get some BW soon, so that might give a better picture.
I had my comp start yesterday. so it will be some tough days this week. I'm still at 6mg per day. I have added my peps back in a few days ago.
Im literally eating so much off the ptren/peps that it's almost like Im eating for a bulk. last two nights I would have dinner and I would pin my peps before sleep like I normally do. I got so hungry that along with my usual casein shake, I would eat everything in sight. I decided to add up how much protein I got in the 2nd dinner(lol), I got 90grams of protein
and probably at least the same amount of carbs.
I have been eating A LOT but surprisingly, Im still not gaining any BF% thanks to the ptren.
Sleep has been great.
Im literally eating so much off the ptren/peps that it's almost like Im eating for a bulk. last two nights I would have dinner and I would pin my peps before sleep like I normally do. I got so hungry that along with my usual casein shake, I would eat everything in sight. I decided to add up how much protein I got in the 2nd dinner(lol), I got 90grams of protein
and probably at least the same amount of carbs. I have been eating A LOT but surprisingly, Im still not gaining any BF% thanks to the ptren.
Sleep has been great.
AugustWest
Registered
Man Im gettin excited ^^^
Yea man I def would be interested to see some labs on this. Post em up if you can when you get them done.
Yea man I def would be interested to see some labs on this. Post em up if you can when you get them done.
I will.
ok small update.
Im still in my comp so no gym training for now. competing well and eating a ton of food.
yesterday night before bed I noticed something that I've never had before. Right before bed I noticed that my ankles were swollen. This is due to the peps but whats weird is I have been running peps for a long time now and I've never had that happen. Im going to think on what the possible cause may be and why this hasn't happened to me before and I'll also talk to overB about this because he had something similar happen a few weeks ago while he was using peps.
Im still in my comp so no gym training for now. competing well and eating a ton of food.
yesterday night before bed I noticed something that I've never had before. Right before bed I noticed that my ankles were swollen. This is due to the peps but whats weird is I have been running peps for a long time now and I've never had that happen. Im going to think on what the possible cause may be and why this hasn't happened to me before and I'll also talk to overB about this because he had something similar happen a few weeks ago while he was using peps.
Cutting, maintenance or bulking?
AugustWest
Registered
Interesting. You think this may be, because Tren boosts IGF production in and of itself, therefore putting you at a much higher IGF level than you would be at with just the peps?
dirtbiker666
Registered
Good luck with your cycle VIB!!!
overburdened
Board Rep
I think the ptren exponentiates the effect of the peps(I have done higher doses of peps since, just to see if I could replicate that... even at 300mcg of ghrp2 with 300mcg of ipam, and 100cjc(all at once), it hasn't done that... I think the ptren made them release WAY MORE hgh!!!
overburdened
Board Rep
go to his site.. his banner is/was on here
overburdened
Board Rep
you can... but if you are eating enough... you wont need to at all!!! I pulled it at 3 weeks in so my body could get used to the MASSIVE lean mass gain(24+lbs)... I have my post labs back ... I can post them up.. but I can tell you that all three liver enzymes are within normal range! I'll post them in a bit, just so everyone can see.. and I can pull 'pre' labs over to this site too...
AugustWest
Registered
That is ridiculous
In addition to those 24lbs you also dropped what, 5-6% BF I think it was? Idk, I read your log on I/J as soon as Vibrant turned me onto it which was a few weeks ago. I can wait to get this shit man!!!
overburdened
Board Rep
I'm gonna call it 3%, just to be conservative.. it was close to 4.5%
