Do you think theres a need?

[Double D]

I have made my own version of westside on a few occasions and did a ton of it this winter. Of course as most of you know I am an athlete. So my question is does max strength training really help to increase athletic performance? Or would more tension and power work be more beneficial? I am aware that I should dip into all sorts of training variables, but what do you think is most beneficial?

 

[Witchblade]

Speed.

Testosterone Nation - 50 Tips for Serious Athletes

 

[Double D]

I realize all of that, however my main question is there a need for max strength....

Of course I do power training and SAQ drills constantly, but like my question states is there a need for max strength compared to lets say functional strength?

 

[Double D]

Appreciate the link though.

 

[AKIRA]

SAQ! Hah! Not to steal any thunder from that, but Ive never used it. Not on myself or any clients.

Then again, the clients Ive had need rehabilitaion more than your average gym rat.

As far as max strength goes, Id say it has little benefits for someone that isnt powerlifting or setting records, but someone else might have a better look at this than I do. Ill keep this thread linked.

 

[Double D]

Thats what I have been thinking as well. I just dont see a point.

Since I am an athlete I do the SAQ drills, plus they are alot of fun and I use them for cardio as well.

 

[fUnc17]

I realize all of that, however my main question is there a need for max strength....

Of course I do power training and SAQ drills constantly, but like my question states is there a need for max strength compared to lets say functional strength?

If you dont have the strength to begin with, how are you going to develop the power that you can use in whatever sport you participate in?

It's a no brainer, more strength is always better. As long as that strength is turned into power it'll be used on the field or whatever your doing

 

[AKIRA]

He wants to know about max strength. If you can squat 450, but cant run 3 feet while pulling 2 plates without getting tired, that max wont mean shit.

 

[fUnc17]

He wants to know about max strength. If you can squat 450, but cant run 3 feet while pulling 2 plates without getting tired, that max wont mean shit.

Exactly.

He needs the max strength to do anything, but with that he also needs to develop the power after he has the strength if he intends on using it as an athlete. Power = strength x time

 

[CowPimp]

Westside incorporates RFD/power training. That's what the dynamic effort days are...

 

[Double D]

But my main question is is it more beneficial to work for max strength or more torwards lower rep ranges of 3-5? Max strength is great, but really do you think that 1rm's really help with much if your not a powerlifter?

Of course I realize what benefits there are from power work and from people who have read my joural I do my share of it.

 

[Stewart14]

Why don't you just do that workout you posted in your journal a few weeks ago that I stole from you? hehe

Set up 2 strength exercises and then do rep work. Incorporate power or plyo training in there as well, and you would be good to go.

I set it up using 3x3 for the strength and 3x6-8 for the rep work. I think for example, 9 total reps at 315 is better than one rep at 365 if you are not training to set any records.

in a side note, can anyone give me some examples of weight based "power" work? I thought of speed bench, box squats, and speed deads, but can anyone give me any other examples, of upper body and lower body weight based power work??

 

[Double D]

Cleans, Snatches, etc....

I am going to continue what I am doing, this is just for future reference and for the clients I will have in the future.

 

[CowPimp]

But my main question is is it more beneficial to work for max strength or more torwards lower rep ranges of 3-5? Max strength is great, but really do you think that 1rm's really help with much if your not a powerlifter?

Of course I realize what benefits there are from power work and from people who have read my joural I do my share of it.

It certainly does. If you are capable of generating more force, then you are better able to withstand the extreme stresses of sports. Furthermore, whether or not you can develop force quickly doesn't matter if even your maximum is insufficient to get the job done.

If I'm stronger, and can generate a decent portion of that force quickly, then I can change directions faster, run faster, accelerate faster, etc. You think those guys running 4.5s in the 40 yard dash are squatting 225? Hell no.

 

[P-funk]

I don't go for 1RMs with people. We may do several singles, but usually not true 1RMs.

For athletes, the 3-5 rep range is great for limit strength. I might use the 1RM at some point for testing so that I can set up some percentages. Or, I might have the 1RM in training as part of a testing day, but this is typically in the offseason. Never in the in season. If you are trying to hit 1RMs in the in season I think that you are playing with fire.

 

[CowPimp]

I don't go for 1RMs with people. We may do several singles, but usually not true 1RMs.

For athletes, the 3-5 rep range is great for limit strength. I might use the 1RM at some point for testing so that I can set up some percentages. Or, I might have the 1RM in training as part of a testing day, but this is typically in the offseason. Never in the in season. If you are trying to hit 1RMs in the in season I think that you are playing with fire.

I see your point, but the real question was if maximal strength is important for an athlete. In my opinion, the answer is a resounding yes. The way you train in order to increase your strength is less important than actually reaching the level you need to (Assuming good technique, proper balance, etc.).

 

[zl214]

I am no coach, but I guess a general answer would be yes.

but it depends which sport you play, a marathon runner probly dont require as much as 1RM strength as a hammer thrower.

if the sport it self is about strength or speed, I guess 1RM should be quite important. But if the sport is about endurance or coordination, 1RM is unlikely to be as beneficial.

 

[Duncans Donuts]

I see your point, but the real question was if maximal strength is important for an athlete. In my opinion, the answer is a resounding yes. The way you train in order to increase your strength is less important than actually reaching the level you need to (Assuming good technique, proper balance, etc.).

One rep maxes demonstrate strength but certainly don't build it. Also, one rep maxes are dependant on form and nervous system efficieny more than anything else.

I think a one rep max is a complete and utter waste of time for athletes, takes away time that would be better spent doing field work or actual strength training and not strength demonstration.

Then again I think most of the stuff in this thread is nonsense.

 

[Double D]

Thanks fellas. My next question would be why does westside go for 1rm's constantly if they dont actually make you any stronger? I know they are preparing for meets, but why put it in a workout if overall it doesnt help with strength?

 

[AKIRA]

Ive got a pretty good take on why it is what it is, but I dont want Duncan to say what I said was "nonsense."

 

[P-funk]

Thanks fellas. My next question would be why does westside go for 1rm's constantly if they dont actually make you any stronger? I know they are preparing for meets, but why put it in a workout if overall it doesnt help with strength?

1) drugs

2) they don't.......read up on the cira-maximal phase of lifting in the westside program.

 

[P-funk]

Ive got a pretty good take on why it is what it is, but I dont want Duncan to say what I said was "nonsense."

huh?

 

[P-funk]

like i said earlier though....i too am not big on the 1RM for athletes. there are better things to do.

 

[Seanp156]

I realize all of that, however my main question is there a need for max strength....

Of course I do power training and SAQ drills constantly, but like my question states is there a need for max strength compared to lets say functional strength?

In most sports I'd say no because most of the effort is all sub-maximal spread out over a long(relatively) duration... With obvious exceptions being powerlifting and olympic lifting... I don't think I'd train in the 1-3 rep range much if I weren't a powerlifter.

 

[Double D]

In most sports I'd say no because most of the effort is all sub-maximal spread out over a long(relatively) duration... With obvious exceptions being powerlifting and olympic lifting... I don't think I'd train in the 1-3 rep range much if I weren't a powerlifter.

Yeah thats the way I was leaning prior to the question.

 

[CowPimp]

One rep maxes demonstrate strength but certainly don't build it. Also, one rep maxes are dependant on form and nervous system efficieny more than anything else.

I think a one rep max is a complete and utter waste of time for athletes, takes away time that would be better spent doing field work or actual strength training and not strength demonstration.

Then again I think most of the stuff in this thread is nonsense.

Again, I'm not suggesting hitting 1RMs for an athlete. I think the risk to benefit ratio is kind of jacked for someone who is doing such a high volume of overall work and doesn't need to demonstrate their ability to perform a 1RM in anything like a powerlifter or weightlifter does.

Now, I don't think singles are a bad idea. Doing something like 5 singles with 90% of your 1RM with ample rest wouldn't be a bad idea. However, that is an entirely different animal.

I don't know that I agree that 1RMs don't build strength. I can't see what you are basing that on. Care to share your thoughts here?