Estrogen suppression while on

[Mudge]

This is for you Korn

I've come across a couple others that also say there is no evidence to support needing E while on, so what is your theory and practice on this? The guy is Billy Bathgate, a chem dude, on another board.

 

[crackerjack414]

personaly iam gyno proof I feel that u should not run an anti e during a cycle unless gyno symptms occur. Basicaly my theory behind this is that u need a certain amount of estrogen in your body for gains to be the best. The only time I run anti es is during cut cycles.

 

[Mudge]

I know that side of the belief system, and many still claim that some E is needed, yet others insist there is no proof of that and I haven't seen any either.

So, I'd like to hear his side of things, I am trying to get info out of this chemist guy as well.

 

[crackerjack414]

keep me posted iam interested in what you find out. I gues if this comes into to big of a debate I could run a cycle with anti es and get my blood tested every 4 weeks like i normaly do. And then do the same without. Maybe if we can get enough guys to do this we can come to some time on consensus

 

[Mudge]

Cracker, your only 19?

 

[MJ23]

Originally posted by crackerjack414
personaly iam gyno proof I feel that u should not run an anti e during a cycle unless gyno symptms occur. Basicaly my theory behind this is that u need a certain amount of estrogen in your body for gains to be the best. The only time I run anti es is during cut cycles.

I have to agree with the fact that I dont run anti-estrogen during a cycle unless I start to get a little sensitive


Cracker is 19.. Did I miss somthing.. sounds quite knowledgable

 

[MJ23]

but then Again, I never run anything like 750 of sust a week, or 50mg a day of dbol

 

[Mudge]

Here are some of my quick thoughts. Im in admist writing some detailed work up on it, so Ill leave ya hangin for that....

1) Total or low enough estrogen is not going to happen unless your a jackass with your doses. Ex 30pg/dl E2 pre-cycle, then 1000mg Test...new level 200pg/dl. Say we take 25mg Aromasin ED, that will bring us to a theortical of oh say 50pg/dl...sufficeint.

2) Nolva. I take it, I dont care if it reduced my igf by 20% big deal. Im on a gram or two of AAS so oh well. It helps out the cholesterol levels and helps even more against gyno.


IMO 25mg Aromasin = 2mg ARi = 3.75mg Let

Aromasin is special. It can be taken up to E3D since the effects are permanent (suicidal inhibition).

I dont like Let at all. It increases aromatic protien enzymes, which means when you come off it you have more estrogen converting that when you started...not good, but maybe if you follow up with nolva.


My guidline

Test

<500mg/wk 25mg Aroma E3D + 10mg Nolva
<750mg/wk 25mg Aroma EOD + 10mg Nolva
<1000mg/wk 25mg ARoma ED + 10mg Nolva

Thats just my staple. I dont like being fat and bloated. I would rather be healthy than high BP, gyno, bloated etc.

Thats my info so far from Billy, plenty of others again say unless they have gyno issues then they dont care, but the BP comment was interesting, didn't think about that.

 

[MJ23]

rather informative

 

[cornfed]

I'f you want my view, I pm'd ya mudge and you can quote it. cutting E to zero is bad, but any elavated levels are as well IMO byt benefits vs. risk or cost.

 

[crackerjack414]

Iam 20 now mudge I was 19 when i started

 

[Mudge]

Originally posted by cornpipe
The only problem is that water retention is not necessary for growth. Saying that it is is basically saying you can't grow on prop, winny, primo, growth, or other non bloating drugs. While there are many that believe like you, there is/has not been any scientific proof that lends that view credibility. estrogen can = higher gross wt gain, but the net benefit (LBM) is not improved. So why would you want the extra E around? I say that you don't and that an anti E can help to keep you leaner while gaining (given that the diet is pretty clean) and therefore prevent the excess non LBM gain and it's subsequent need for removal.

To each their own.

 

[cornfed]

Why thank you sir

I didn't save a copy