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Do you know what you are injecting when using an under ground lab? (Graphic Video)

trapzilla said:
If I was to use those GMP companies shiiit i'd never be able to cycle. I can't afford those prices.
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one precision about GMP standard a pharmaceutical producer doesn't need the GMP certificate to produce very good quality and sterile medicine. Most of the EU pharmaceutical producers weren't GMP certified 15 years ago and patients have been using their products without a problem for maybe over 25-30 years. One thing is WHO GMP manufacturing or respecting the national Pharmacopoeia. Most country Pharmacopoeias are really good elaborated (most of them are copied from the mature world economies pharmacopoeias) and the standards they impose for the drug manufacturers are high and provide a good safety for the patient/drug user. GMP certified companies are lets say a step forward in manufacturing quality but this is almost irrelevant for the patient/user. A simple example, GMP states that tablet press machinery cover needs to be of stainless steel (maybe SS306). A factory that has a epoxy painted press is not GMP. Oh shit, what a big difference it makes for the tablet user, right?
 
heavyiron said:
I made this point earlier in the thread. Some UGL's use GMP standards but many do not. Usually the extremelty cheap products are an indicator that sub standard equipment/practices are being used.
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imo almost all UGL not just that are not GMP (none of them are for sure, because they fail from start at API GMP), but almost all UGL don't respect ANY pharmaceutical manufacturing standard. Having a autoclave, dry oven and maybe a flux doesn't make the lab according to any standards. The "good" UGL are made in R&D conditions, at best!!!. Most of them are done in unacceptable conditions even for veterinary medicine.
 
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paolo584 said:
They are some excellent UGL's u just have to dig deep to find them.
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... Since the aseptic processes to produce pharmaceuticals are failed by ALL UGL (maybe 1% of all UGL work respecting the aseptic principles while the rest do basic errors like washing vials with Ethanol or have no aseptic facilities at all), what methan says is 100% true.

It doesn't matter if some UGL "chemists" have some knowledge of "brewing" and try to respect some quality standards or other UGL "chemist" has no idea on "brewing", differences are not important. Both will produce not sterile vials. If a UGL produces in ISO 9 and washes vials or other UGL doesn't wash the vials at all, practically doesn't make a big difference. Both are highly non sterile.

In Pharmacy there is no "decent" product or "good" product. There is only Sterile or Not Sterile (not minding API in this discussion).
 
GymRat707 said:
I

I won't get into detail, but from several high ranking people on this forum (including moderators) have told me that some of the sponsors who say they're gear is FDA approved, are actually not. That doesn't take away from it being high quality by any means, but I won't go into anymore detail then that.
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lol



Who ?
 
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Grozny said:
... Since the aseptic processes to produce pharmaceuticals are failed by ALL UGL (maybe 1% of all UGL work respecting the aseptic principles while the rest do basic errors like washing vials with Ethanol or have no aseptic facilities at all), what methan says is 100% true.

It doesn't matter if some UGL "chemists" have some knowledge of "brewing" and try to respect some quality standards or other UGL "chemist" has no idea on "brewing", differences are not important. Both will produce not sterile vials. If a UGL produces in ISO 9 and washes vials or other UGL doesn't wash the vials at all, practically doesn't make a big difference. Both are highly non sterile.

In Pharmacy there is no "decent" product or "good" product. There is only Sterile or Not Sterile (not minding API in this discussion).
Click to expand...

ANYTIME this subject comes up you thow in all of these cut and paste BS samples. You have an agenda period, and I'm beyond sick of it.
 
Grozny said:
imo almost all UGL not just that are not GMP (none of them are for sure, because they fail from start at API GMP), but almost all UGL don't respect ANY pharmaceutical manufacturing standard. Having a autoclave, dry oven and maybe a flux doesn't make the lab according to any standards. The "good" UGL are made in R&D conditions, at best!!!. Most of them are done in unacceptable conditions even for veterinary medicine.
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This is actually a good point. Thank you for bringing it up.

The home brewer or UGL needs to have the highest quality materials to begin with. Anyone can follow GMP standards if they have the facility and are willing to be inspected but does the homebrewer know for sure their raw materials (API's) like powders are pure?

Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient: Any substance or mixture of substances intended to be used in the manufacture of a drug (medicinal) product and that when used in the production of a drug becomes an active ingredient of the drug product. Such substances are intended to furnish pharmacological activity or other direct effect in the diagnosis, cure, mitigation,treatment or prevention of disease or to effect the structure and function of the body.​


Additionally your point has even more force because I don't know of very many UGL's that are willing to provide Cleaning Validation reports to reglatory inspectors.​

Cleaning Validation in the context of Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient manufacture may be defined as:

The process of providing documented evidence that the cleaning methods employed within a facility consistently controls potential carryover of product (including intermediates and impurities), cleaning agents and extraneous material into subsequent product to a level which is below predetermined levels.​


It is necessary to Validate Cleaning procedures for the following reasons:​

a. It is a customer requirement - it ensures the safety and purity of the product.​

b. It is a regulatory requirement in Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient product manufacture.​

c. It also assures from an internal control and compliance point of view the quality of the process.​


Potential residues​

The Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient Industry involves (in general) the manufacture of Active Pharmaceutical Ingredients by both chemical and physical means through a series of multiple step processes. Plants or individual pieces of equipment, including ancillary equipment, may be used in multi-product manufacture or dedicated to individual products.​

The result of inadequate cleaning procedures is that any of a number of contaminants may be present in the next batch manufactured on the equipment such as:​

1. Precursors to the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient​

2. By-products and/or degradation products of the Active Pharmaceutical
Ingredient​

3. The previous product​

4. Solvents and other materials employed during the manufacturing process.​

5. Micro-organisms​

This is particularly the case where microbial growth may be sustained by the product.​

6. Cleaning agents themselves and lubricants


Source

http://apic.cefic.org/pub/4CleaningVal9909.pdf
 
Wow that shit is insane! makes you think twice on what really is in a vile. Thanks Heavy for sharing.
 
TGB1987 said:
I trust Heavyiron's judgement and opinion. He is a veteran of AAS. He is trying to help others realize the chance they are taking when using UGLs. No not all UGLs are bad but do you think most labs are going to go out of their way to follow proper protocol when they have no one regulating them. NO. Why??? because it costs money and we all know that is what it is all about. Most UGLs are not safe substitutes for pharm quality gear. Of course there are exceptions but they are few and far between. Everyone here thinks that this will not happen to them. Well many of you have probably already used products that could have had heavy metal contamination and there is no telling what that could mean years down the road. It is a scary thought. Would you want to take medicine that was made in a small UGL with no regulations or restrictions. Many of the UGLs don't know that their products are contaminated because they are unable to check the quality of their powders. Using cheap powders is what allows UGLs to sell products at prices that are too good to be true. How else can they sell at these prices and make a profit. They are making a profit trust me they aren't doing it for free. Heavy is just trying to open the eyes of members for their own good. Many look for the best price with things in life. In many cases this is what americans are accustomed to doing but this is not like buying food at a grocery store. You don't always get the best deal when you pay less for AAS. Think about the costs of proper production, quality powders, supplies (vials, stoppers, labels so on), and now incorporate some type of profit. What do you get? If your price doesn't make sense you should think about what you are doing. We are not saying you should always buy the most expensive gear available because that is not always the best buy but at least think about the price and do the math. If something doesn't make sense then you should have your answer. No one wants to pay more than they have to for anything but realize there has to be a difference. Try to go off of reviews and common sense. If there is a product that has zero bad reviews and costs more then most what does that tell you? If you don't want to pay top dollar or can't afford it at least try to look for something that makes sense in the middle that has good reviews. You don't want to end up having infections or Heavy metal toxicity because you wanted to save a few bucks on gear. If you can't afford to buy safe gear then you would be better not using any at all in the long run. It is not worth your health to gain a few pounds of muscle. Using AAS is supposed to be about taking care of your body and taking it further then possible without AAS. When you go buy a car do you go with the cheapest one you can find or one that is known for quality and costs more. Doesn't have to be the most expensive out there but you don't want the cheapest if you want it to last for any length of time. Please consider your options more carefully. If you find a great UGL that you think truly follows quality standards and the prices match stick with them. If you want to feel safe go with one that may cost more but has the reviews to back it up. It is your choice in the end and I think Heavy made this thread to help members realize that bad things do happen and when something sounds too good to be true it probably is. Be safe and at least think twice before making a mistake that could cause health issues down the road. Trust your source and make sure it sounds like a price that at least makes sense. Stay Safe.
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I argree with most of what you said. Price of product does not always consitute quality. Just because you pay 150 bucks for Nike air max trainer from Footlocker, don't mean they are better quality than the same shoe from Total Runner for $100.00. But that's a US thin I imagine. lol The Bulk rate purchases and the connect you use all play a part in price. As I stated earlier, ALL the machines used to produce FDA approved products can be found on ebay. I should state that I feel as Heavy does and to a lesser extent as TGB does as well about UGL's. Only I don't trust Public UGL's at all. In my mind anyone that sell's illegal drugs ( steroids ) on the internet to anyone with the cash with no script is basically a UGL. REAL TALK . So in REALITY 2 chioces come to mind. Find a solid Private lab or like Heavy said if you are really that worried get a script from a M.D. like Heavy has and ONLY then will you be sure.Other than that deal with the fact that THEY ARE ALL UGL's. Some nicer than others some nicer labels, more ad's ,good quality even, but illegal UGL non the less. That may sound ugly as hell or taste bitter, but swallow cause thats real shit. And I'ma stand by that because of that one magic word which makes them all under the same banner.......ILLEGAL. and you can't have it both ways.

Peace and Love
 
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Grozny said:
... Since the aseptic processes to produce pharmaceuticals are failed by ALL UGL (maybe 1% of all UGL work respecting the aseptic principles while the rest do basic errors like washing vials with Ethanol or have no aseptic facilities at all), what methan says is 100% true.

It doesn't matter if some UGL "chemists" have some knowledge of "brewing" and try to respect some quality standards or other UGL "chemist" has no idea on "brewing", differences are not important. Both will produce not sterile vials. If a UGL produces in ISO 9 and washes vials or other UGL doesn't wash the vials at all, practically doesn't make a big difference. Both are highly non sterile.

In Pharmacy there is no "decent" product or "good" product. There is only Sterile or Not Sterile (not minding API in this discussion).
Click to expand...

WTF? ok
 
"swallow cause that real shit" lol. i like that rude boy
 
it goes without saying that anything you inject in your body absolutely positively needs to be sterile.

How to confirm that the vials you get from your UGL are sterile? I dont know. I guess you would have to look for the sources with the best reviews.....preferably one with no bad reviews.
 
damage said:
it goes without saying that anything you inject in your body absolutely positively needs to be sterile.

How to confirm that the vials you get from your UGL are sterile? I dont know. I guess you would have to look for the sources with the best reviews.....preferably one with no bad reviews.
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Big big true!
 
CT said:
ANYTIME this subject comes up you thow in all of these cut and paste BS samples. You have an agenda period, and I'm beyond sick of it.
Click to expand...

its almost all the time a same questions this maybe be my slogan

In Pharmacy there is no "decent" product or "good" product. There is only Sterile or Not Sterile
 
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damage said:
How to confirm that the vials you get from your UGL are sterile? I dont know. I guess you would have to look for the sources with the best reviews.....preferably one with no bad reviews.
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actually in each city there are at least few labs that can do a microbiological and pyrogen testing for less than 60$. it takes few days and you`ll know if you are safe or not. most ugl especially water based are not sterile and filled with pyrogen.
 
Supermans Daddy said:
In my mind anyone that sell's illegal drugs ( steroids ) on the internet to anyone with the cash with no script is basically a UGL. REAL TALK . So in REALITY 2 chioces come to mind. Find a solid Private lab or like Heavy said if you are really that worried get a script from a M.D. like Heavy has and ONLY then will you be sure.Other than that deal with the fact that THEY ARE ALL UGL's. Some nicer than others some

Peace and Love
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Very well said, and I agree 100%. :winkfinger:
 
Grozny said:
its almost all the time a same questions this maybe be my slogan

In Pharmacy there is no "decent" product or "good" product. There is only Sterile or Not Sterile
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Than answer this, a "pharmacy" vial of test which is under filled, underdosed and sterile is better than a UGL which is dosed correct, filled correctly and sterile?

This is a total contradiction of what you said earlier, sterile or not sterile. Then if that's the case it wouldn't matter if it's UGL or a "pharmacy" grade test, ONLY if it's sterile?
 
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heavyiron said:
Sorry to hear this.

I used to get 300mg/ml Enanthate from a compounding pharmacy in the US. It was legal for me to purchase because I have a prescription. There was almost never any severe pain when I injected it even at the higher mg/ml concentration. Not sure what is causing your problem but my guess is the whole batch needs to be filtered and then baked but even that may not solve the problem.

I have had pharmacy meds expire that were in half used vials (I used half the meds then stored them) that gave me problems but I think the vial was contaminated after I used it and let it sit so long in my medicine cabinet. Using sterile injecting techniques is crititcal because a dirty stopper or injection site may cause problems.

Anyway, I hope you don't develop any further problems. Take your temperature and if it goes above normal I would see a doctor about anti biotics.

Good luck
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Thanks again. In the clear now. Definitely gonna start using Neosporin after injecting ugl from now on because when I first applied it the redness and swelling went away by morning and I thought I was in the clear so went to the gym and it came back and so I kept up the Neosporin twice a day after a hot shower so it went deep in the skin and worked like a charm. Triple antibiotic painreliever says it all. Keep in mind it was only palm sized and may not work on really big and bad infections.
 
Justinbro said:
Thanks again. In the clear now. Definitely gonna start using Neosporin after injecting ugl from now on because when I first applied it the redness and swelling went away by morning and I thought I was in the clear so went to the gym and it came back and so I kept up the Neosporin twice a day after a hot shower so it went deep in the skin and worked like a charm. Triple antibiotic painreliever says it all. Keep in mind it was only palm sized and may not work on really big and bad infections.
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Glad to hear your body is fighting it off.
 
Supermans Daddy said:
...ALL the machines used to produce FDA approved products can be found on ebay...Only I don't trust Public UGL's at all. In my mind anyone that sell's...on the internet to anyone with...no script is basically a UGL....So in REALITY 2 chioces come to mind. Find a solid Private lab or like Heavy said if you are really that worried get a script from a M.D....
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Ive noticed I dont see any threads of people flipping out and posting jacked up body images of themselves caused by ghetto made gear like in the video. Which btw nearly make me sick to my stomach watching.

Have there been postings with photos on this forum of stuff like this happening to them? Or where they deleted? I can see being called out would be bad for business.

No joke. I dont trust anyone now. Im even worried about IML. I saw pinning in the near future but now...pfft! shit with the possibilities of wide gaping holes caused by flesh eating bacteria going as far as exposing your internal muscles, strange white pus with blood oozing out of your arm or fatal heavy metals being used? I think I'll pass. Not feeling the love anymore.

Would you say this includes pills and caps too? I can see pressed pills being easier to conceal unwanted ingredients. Unlike SuperMansDad who could see through the pills ;), us humans can only see through glass.

Which I dont understand why they use such toxic metals. I mean, is it meant as a filler? if so, how much is it replacing and what are they replacing? And as far as proper said dosage sold the range of over to under is just too wide of a margin.

After sanitary production, proper dosing is #2.

Also is it possible to "boil" the bottle and sterilize the internal contains?

I wish I had the cash, or even insurance for that matter, to see a doctor.
 
I swear all this sounds like is adverstisement . I've used many UGL and never once had a problem and juice has always been legit and well dosed
 
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TJTJ said:
Would you say this includes pills and caps too? I can see pressed pills being easier to conceal unwanted ingredients. Unlike SuperMansDad who could see through the pills ;), us humans can only see through glass.
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I'm look'n at you now. It's a Kryptonian thang ! LOLOL


Peace and Love
 
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