Carb-ups!!!!

[w8lifter]

It's perfect, that's what it's supposed to do, bump you up for a day....I can never get the veggies in either...and by the time I get to a carb up...I don't really wanna eat veggies anyway

BTW....soon you will look forward to it and enjoy it!

 

[nikegurl]

really? i'm so calorie phobic. my regular days are about 1700 calories. before this i was eating about 1300 which i know is too low. but since i did that anyway (knowing i shouldn't have) i wonder if 1700 or so daily and 2100 twice a week will make me fat.

must keep the faith.....

 

[nikegurl]

one more thing - are you suppossed to really feel something happen when you carb up? i just felt full and my stomach felt sorta bloated. that went away though. i think that earlier in the day before i carbed up i was a little flatter - less veins. they were back this morning. that cracks me up - veins in my arms and shoulders and flab on my lower body still. yuck

i'm still at about 17% bodyfat (don't really know) so that may be why i couldn't really see anything much. or maybe it's too soon into the new eating plan.

just curious.

 

[w8lifter]

Feel anything? .....full?!

 

[w8lifter]

Bump for danilee

 

[JUN LEE]

Hi, new guy with some questions.

What is carb depletion for? I read in the very first post that carbohydrates are needed for anaerobic training and if they go too low, training will suffer. How low can you go with carbs when depleting? Is there a number (for total carbs) that you should never go below?

JL

 

[cytrix]

I was just curious, was do you think about carbing up for a whole day or two once every week, as in the "Anabolic Diet" or "Metabolic Diet" by DiPasquale? I would like that better, as it would give more freedom one day a week, like on Saturday or Sunday, to go out to eat with friends? I don't know if he suggests only changing the percentages of the macronutrients fat, protein and carbs, or if the total calories are supposed to be increased on carb-up days, to keep thyroid levels up - I would think so.

 

[w8lifter]

Originally posted by JUN LEE
Hi, new guy with some questions.

What is carb depletion for? I read in the very first post that carbohydrates are needed for anaerobic training and if they go too low, training will suffer. How low can you go with carbs when depleting? Is there a number (for total carbs) that you should never go below?

JL

Generally when you carb deplete you want to go as low as possible, under 30 active grams a day...and those should come only from protein/fat sources such as nuts. Depleting will increase your insulin sensitivity and once you carb up, glycogen synthesis increases. Training and fat loss will both suffer if you go to long w/o carbs, that is why we have bi-weekly carb-ups, to prevent thyroid down-regulation.

 

[w8lifter]

Originally posted by cytrix
I was just curious, was do you think about carbing up for a whole day or two once every week, as in the "Anabolic Diet" or "Metabolic Diet" by DiPasquale? I would like that better, as it would give more freedom one day a week, like on Saturday or Sunday, to go out to eat with friends? I don't know if he suggests only changing the percentages of the macronutrients fat, protein and carbs, or if the total calories are supposed to be increased on carb-up days, to keep thyroid levels up - I would think so.

Well that would work, in terms of restoring glycogen levels, but carbing up for the entire day would delay fat burning considerably. And yes, you'd want a calorie increase on your carb up days.

 

[cytrix]

Thanx w8. Do you think the carb-up approach of taking one whole day per week might be better in terms of increasing muscle size, even while cutting (at the expense of loosing fat a little slower as you already mentioned)? I know DiPasquale also uses this way of eating (low carb for 5-6- days, carb-up on the weekend)as a muscle building phase.

 

[w8lifter]

If the main goal is still cutting, I think the original carbup in meal 6 twice a week would be best, it is still possible to gain muscle that way, however, if the main goal is maintenance, I think it would be alright. If the main goal is bulking I'd incorporate slow-burning carbs daily and skip depletion/carbups.

 

[Robboe]

Originally posted by w8lifter
More Pain!

The carb-up would be based on body weight, take the last meal only and use approx 1/4 measured before cooking of oatmeal for every 35 pounds of BW, 2 oz of yam per 35 pounds, and 1 oz of banana per 35, also one cup of veggies with 1 TBL butter (all BW's)!
It's a lot of food, but works great!! Dr. Pain

Hey, quick couple O'questions:

Firstly, how did you arrive at these measurements - i 2 oz per 35lbs of BW etc...?

Secondly, this supposed to be all one meal right before bed, correct?

Gracias.

 

[Dr. Pain]

I can answer....It was a conversion from a 175-200 pounds man's recomendation of 10 oz SP, 1 and 1/2 cups oats and a 6 oz Banana...veggies and fat were held constant! We needed somethig workable for "other" BW's!


Doesn't have to be before bed....but empirically as the last meal....when activity levels are lower....and glycogen has been somewhat previously depleted.....this works the best!


DP

 

[Robboe]

Ah cool, thanks for the quick response.

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

Is is alright to have fruit in your oatmeal?

And is it a 1/4 cup per 35 lbs. of bodyweight for all oatmeals? Because the steel cut oats I used to buy had a LOT more calories in one cup than the Quaker old fashioned oats I have now.

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

By fruit, I mean strawberries and/or blueberries, which as I understand it are very slow-burning?

 

[Leslie]

No fruit in the oatmeal....I already tried that route

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

Why is it that you can't add in a little extra fruit to the oatmeal, if you are already having a huge carb meal?

 

[w8lifter]

A couple of strawberries in your carb up meal won't kill you LrdViperScrpion....and the calories are secondary to the carbs for this meal...we're more concerned w/ the type of carbs and how much of it, than we are w/ the actual calorie count.

 

[Leslie]

I can't answer that one for you, I think it has something to do with the insulin spike....W8? DP?

I am eatting my carb up now and LOVING it

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

Thanks for the responses, w8 and leslie, although I still don't understand what the problem is with the carbs in fruit, but thanks for the quick responses, and for helping me out.

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

Oh, and no fair Leslie, I have to wait till Sunday for my carb-up. I can't WAIT!

 

[Dr. Pain]

Originally posted by LrdViperScrpion
Thanks for the responses, w8 and leslie, although I still don't understand what the problem is with the carbs in fruit, but thanks for the quick responses, and for helping me out.

In reference to the "carb-up" meal...as w8 said, a minute amount of fruit is not going to make much difference. We are looking at your liver and muscles kind of like refueling a 2-3 stage rocket. The different types of carbs in mixture, hit at slightly different rates, making refueling a smooth operation with no SPILLING! (or fat storage...... lipogenesis)


Butt certain fruit, and fructose in general has a negative impact on a cut. You can get away with a grapefruit, berries, or an apple, BUTT AS THE ONLY PLANNED CARB SOURCE FOR THAT MEAL....never alone (always with protein and fat)... and not with oatmeal, that is OVERKILL!

We always try to limit our regular carb servings (when planned) to under 30 total grams of C, and preferrably, under 25 active (minus fiber)

As BB, we have made 'Observations" concerning fruit and metabolism, smoothness, etc. Consider this information "Tried and True"

Mama's Boy, if you're reading this...you made the same observations and wanted more info....the only person I have seen describe this is John Parrillo...he compared 300 grams of rice to 300 grams of fruit in his "paper-thin skinned athletes" and concluded that FRIUT WAS BAD....he then expounded on fructose and disacharrides or something...there may be info on his site?
(It was an article in his early newsletters years ago)


DP

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

Alright, thanks for the info, DP, and I'll definitely cut the fruit from the oatmeal, and the carb up was the only meal I was eating with any fruit at all.

 

[mama's boy]

Mama's Boy, if you're reading this...you made the same observations and wanted more info....the only person I have seen describe this is John Parrillo...he compared 300 grams of rice to 300 grams of fruit in his "paper-thin skinned athletes" and concluded that FRIUT WAS BAD....he then expounded on fructose and disacharrides or something...there may be info on his site?
(It was an article in his early newsletters years ago)

Right. Not just fruit but all forms of fructose are no good for muscle glycogen recomposition. In must be processed by the liver... this means it is several times more likely than other carbs to a) be burned metabolically and never reach muscle cells or b) be stored as fat once your liver stores are full.

The spillage or "bad stage look" is actually a combination of things. The rice makes you "look better" because it causes a slight insulin spike, and when stored in the muscles pulls in water with it (unlike the fruit) causing a desirable tight and pumped look. The fruit, which is going straight to your liver... does none of this. Also, at 300 grams ANYONE will spill and some lipogenesis will occur.

This is why fruit is bad for a "carb up" (aka. muscle glycogen recomposition, albeit smaller scale). Stick with whole food carbs sources that are void of fructose and sucrose and you'll be fine. Rice, potatoes, whole grains, etc. This rule alone is much more important than glycemic values, IMO.

And don't get me wrong... I'm not saying fruit is inherently bad for you, just in large amounts. Obviously there are plenty of vitamins and minerals, phytonutrients, etc.

BUT.... It's just the nature of the human metabolism. As BB or dieters we have to play tricks on this fickle beast. One super effective trick I've come up with is avoiding fruit and fructose as much as possible.

 

[Dr. Pain]

Very very well said! Kudos...the bar!

BTW...that was a w8 of 300 grams not 300 C


Just want to let you know.....that Mr. Grapefruit is pissed off at you! LOL


DP

 

[mama's boy]

Just want to let you know.....that Mr. Grapefruit is pissed off at you! LOL

Bring it! I'll "section" his ass!

 

[LrdViperScrpion]

I was also wondering, if you are doing the every 3rd, then 4th day carb-up, what would be the two best days for those carb-ups to fall on? Right now I am doing a Mon, Wed, Fri, HST workout. Also, if possible, the two best days to carb-up, excluding Friday, since I can at least go out and enjoy myself Friday night. Thanks.

 

[w8lifter]

Some people prefer to carb up the night before their heaviest w/o's...for added energy. And some people prefer to carb up the night of their heaviest w/o's...to aid in recovery.

 

[Robboe]

Originally posted by w8lifter
Some people prefer to carb up the night before their heaviest w/o's...for added energy. And some people prefer to carb up the night of their heaviest w/o's...to aid in recovery.

Wow, good answer.

But also, i know lads who arrange carb ups around training/nights out and others who arrange nights out/training around carb ups, which is kinda good cause it offers flexibility.

Do what you want, man.