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DHEA Hormone Facts
- Thread starter Arnold
- Start date
very interesting, i agree with it 100%, also why im interested in all the noise about primordial performance's andro line......i dont care what im told, dhea is dhea, so unless the 'delivery' really is ground breaking, itll be an epic fail, but they seem very confident
I think there is some big confusion here.... the AndroSeries isn't plain DHEA and while what he is saying about standard DHEA is not untrue, the missing link here is that the METABOLITES are what we are looking at. Take 7-keto-DHEA for instance.... great effects on lowering cortisol and shifting the body away from storing fat and towards burning muscle.
What wasn't made clear here is that DHEA has a number of metabolites, some of which are useful to bodybuilding purposes, some of which are not. Its a matter of using metabolites of interest to guide the conversion down the path to achieve the desired product and results.
As far as delivery goes, there is no doubt that there is substantial power behind the type of delivery PP is going for. The interaction of even just grapefruit juice with various prescription drugs is dramatic to the point that a number of medications have severe warnings to avoid the combination of the two due to the drastic increase in potency of the medication.
From a chemical standpoint, the enathate ester which PP is utilizing in this line should have the same effects as far as increased bioavailibilty though the inhibitory (competitive that is) of the delivery complex with liver enzymes. Of course, we all want to see real world results, so lets get those going, but in the mean time lets not pretend that they are selling "just dhea"
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
BigBlackGuy
Board Rep
Very good post. Very interesting about DHEA as well... I love these videos, always informative
eastwoodmuscle
Registered
I think there is some big confusion here.... the AndroSeries isn't plain DHEA and while what he is saying about standard DHEA is not untrue, the missing link here is that the METABOLITES are what we are looking at. Take 7-keto-DHEA for instance.... great effects on lowering cortisol and shifting the body away from storing fat and towards burning muscle.
What wasn't made clear here is that DHEA has a number of metabolites, some of which are useful to bodybuilding purposes, some of which are not. Its a matter of using metabolites of interest to guide the conversion down the path to achieve the desired product and results.
As far as delivery goes, there is no doubt that there is substantial power behind the type of delivery PP is going for. The interaction of even just grapefruit juice with various prescription drugs is dramatic to the point that a number of medications have severe warnings to avoid the combination of the two due to the drastic increase in potency of the medication.
From a chemical standpoint, the enathate ester which PP is utilizing in this line should have the same effects as far as increased bioavailibilty though the inhibitory (competitive that is) of the delivery complex with liver enzymes. Of course, we all want to see real world results, so lets get those going, but in the mean time lets not pretend that they are selling "just dhea"
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
even if you have 100% absorbtion, you still have to get the conversion to the target hormone.
and despite the numbers being put up, conversion in vitro studies and in actual humans is completely different.
conversion isn't one way, it can bounce around like a pin ball. and if it converts into an inactive metabolite before it hits the receptor, you get zero sides, and zero gains.
not to mention, the body doesn't just use enzymes for converting your dhea isomers into steroids.
got enzyme competition?
in the end, some will see good results, others will not. it's a toss up.
if I dropped over a hundred $$$ for a bottle of andromass, i better get phenominal results, and not need any pct either, cause there'll be no more money for it.
It's not a toss up, conversion rates differ yes, however there is more to it. Target hormone as opposed to parent hormone? As 4AD and 1AD both have intrinsic activity. Eric has a formal write-up coming out that will back all of these claims without doubt. Besides when the logs hit then we will have the feedback as well.
eastwoodmuscle
Registered
yea, but they have to make it to the androgen receptor and bind to it in order to have this intrinsic activity.
if it is converted into an inactive metabolite before this happens, nothing happens.
there are more enzymes in the body besides 3hsb & 17hsb.
it's all good, im just speculating, my guess on these is as good as erics, we'll just have to wait for logs.
you know, muscle tech has graphs, studies, and data to support their claims about their products too. just saying....
if it is converted into an inactive metabolite before this happens, nothing happens.
there are more enzymes in the body besides 3hsb & 17hsb.
it's all good, im just speculating, my guess on these is as good as erics, we'll just have to wait for logs.
you know, muscle tech has graphs, studies, and data to support their claims about their products too. just saying....
I think there is some big confusion here.... the AndroSeries isn't plain DHEA and while what he is saying about standard DHEA is not untrue, the missing link here is that the METABOLITES are what we are looking at. Take 7-keto-DHEA for instance.... great effects on lowering cortisol and shifting the body away from storing fat and towards burning muscle.
What wasn't made clear here is that DHEA has a number of metabolites, some of which are useful to bodybuilding purposes, some of which are not. Its a matter of using metabolites of interest to guide the conversion down the path to achieve the desired product and results.
As far as delivery goes, there is no doubt that there is substantial power behind the type of delivery PP is going for. The interaction of even just grapefruit juice with various prescription drugs is dramatic to the point that a number of medications have severe warnings to avoid the combination of the two due to the drastic increase in potency of the medication.
From a chemical standpoint, the enathate ester which PP is utilizing in this line should have the same effects as far as increased bioavailibilty though the inhibitory (competitive that is) of the delivery complex with liver enzymes. Of course, we all want to see real world results, so lets get those going, but in the mean time lets not pretend that they are selling "just dhea"
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
nice post, thanks for making it clearer bud
An example of a useful dhea metabolite is 7-keto-dhea (I beleive its used in androlean IIRC too) which is in DS's Lean Xtreme and has worked well for many to lower cortisol and help out with losing fat w/o a stimulant based fat burner
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
Primordial
Registered
I talk about the limitations with DHEA here - https://www.primordialperformance.com/blog/articles/birth-of-the-androseries.html
... and discuss the main differences with 4-DHEA -- being much more anabolicly capable.
-Eric
... and discuss the main differences with 4-DHEA -- being much more anabolicly capable.
-Eric
An example of a useful dhea metabolite is 7-keto-dhea (I beleive its used in androlean IIRC too) which is in DS's Lean Xtreme and has worked well for many to lower cortisol and help out with losing fat w/o a stimulant based fat burner
|Z|
Orbit Nutrition Rep
This one is of most interest as 7-keto is so poor with absorption, hence why people use in transdermals to up bioavailability. If PP figured out how to make this work as it is supposed to and all the literature states, this could be a perfect addition to any cutting or recomp stack. We shall see about the others. If it is equivalent to 480 mgs of test e a week, it will have strong muscle building tendency like test does but just like test, I see it having to be ran for at least 8 weeks which is a crap load of money at its current cost.
Muscle Tech seriously? I think our past and other products speak for who we are
ohh man .....MT is nuts, do they even have 1 fkn product that works....even on bb site, everything is rated 7 and under, yet their sales are top notch....do people fkn readYes I think comparing PP to MT is downright rude and uncalled for.
pp has had a much better track record, minus all the ads and star bodybuilders to market their stuff.......theyv doen well by word of mouth for the most part, which says alot
i hope they do well with this dhea stuff, if anything other than small companies that try to put out novel and effective stuff, can be profitable compared to the marketing giants like MT and gaspari
eastwoodmuscle
Registered
thats because you dont know much about the company or steroids.Yes I think comparing PP to MT is downright rude and uncalled for.
jagbender
Registered
Interseting video. seems the website is under construction at this time
