First Cycle - Comments welcome

[aja44]

So after having done 2 PH cycles in the past year, I feel I am ready to "move on up" and play with the big boys. I have read the stickys and posted questions prior with some great feedback. I have also had PMs with SD, Heavy and RoadKing and want to thank them very much for answering ALL of my questions.

Weeks 1 - 10 - 500mg Cyp/300mg EQ (2 shots per week Mon and Thurs)
Weeks 1 - 10 - 500iu's HCG twice per week (2 shot per week on Tues and Fri)
Weeks 1 - 10 = Aromasin 12.5mg ED

PCT
HCG -1000iu's EOD for 16 days starting the Friday after last Cyp/EQ shot
Amomasin - start 14 days after last Cyp/EQ shot - w1-3@25mg, w4@12.5mg
Nolva - 20mg ED for 5-7 days if needed for Gyno

My goal on this cycle is size without water weight and stay vascular. I plan on starting this cycle in September and my goal is to be around 13%BF at 230lbs when I start.

I will begin checking prices through the board sponsors for both gear, pins and vials for the HCG. Would definitely be interested in opinions on experiences with the vendors and quality.

Thoughts? Opinions?

 

[Arnold]

My goal on this cycle is size without water weight and stay vascular.

using 500mg of Cyp is going to cause water retention.

 

[aja44]

using 500mg of Cyp is going to cause water retention.

I expect some to come with using Cyp, but as a first cycle I really felt I was limited and for good reason. But based on some other conversations, I felt the EQ would keep it down a bit and keep me vascular.

Prince - do you recommend a different cycle?

 

[Tyler3295]

Prop has less water retention, but be prepared to pin EOD/ED.

 

[aja44]

Prop has less water retention, but be prepared to pin EOD/ED.

So if I was going to pin EOD, would you recommend 150mg Prop/100mg EQ? That would give me 450mg Prop and 300mg EQ weekly? Good cycle for mass and little water?

 

[Tyler3295]

So if I was going to pin EOD, would you recommend 150mg Prop/100mg EQ? That would give me 450mg Prop and 300mg EQ weekly? Good cycle for mass and little water?

I have seen people have good results with 100-125mg/EOD prop since you get a little more ACTUAL test from the prop ester.

Personally however, I don't run it any less than 150mg/EOD. The EQ can still be pinned 2x/wk, but cutting it with the prop will help with pain.

Only thing though. I would run EQ @ 400-600mg/wk. Most would agree that 400mg/wk seems almost like a tease so I can only imagine what even less would feel like. That's a lot of pinning though man..

 

[aja44]

I have seen people have good results with 100-125mg/EOD prop since you get a little more ACTUAL test from the prop ester.

Personally however, I don't run it any less than 150mg/EOD. The EQ can still be pinned 2x/wk, but cutting it with the prop will help with pain.

Only thing though. I would run EQ @ 400-600mg/wk. Most would agree that 400mg/wk seems almost like a tease so I can only imagine what even less would feel like. That's a lot of pinning though man..

I would pin both EOD. Just want to make sure I get the right doses.

200mg Prop/150mg EQ every other day = 600mg Prop/450mg EQ weekly for 10 weeks.

Good cycle for 1st timer? I know its a bit more pinning, but really its only 1 more shot per week. I was going to have to shoot 2 shots with the Cyp/EQ and then 2 times with the HCG weekly. Now its 3 shots of Test and still the same 2 shots of HCG.

 

[Roaddkingg]

Things look pretty good and well thought out. EQ will be good for slow steady strength gains and will help with vascularity but you know it wont start kicking till week 4-5. Most run EQ for longer than 10 weeks mainly for that very reason. But I suppose 10 weeks will be fine. One thing you may want to re-evaluate is your HCG usage. It may be better to do it during your cycle at say 250iu's 2x per week throughout starting your 2nd week and run right up until day before PCT starts. I see you believe aromasin is better than say throwing in clomid for PCT? Some do think thats best. Me personally I use adex throughout at .5mgs EOD and clomid and nolvadex for PCT. Although aromasin is easier on your lipids. Looks pretty straight my friend and I commend you on your research just a tad bit of tweaking and you got it. As was mentioned you will get water but the ai you choose will help some with that.

 

[Tyler3295]

I would pin both EOD. Just want to make sure I get the right doses.

200mg Prop/150mg EQ every other day = 600mg Prop/450mg EQ weekly for 10 weeks.

Good cycle for 1st timer? I know its a bit more pinning, but really its only 1 more shot per week. I was going to have to shoot 2 shots with the Cyp/EQ and then 2 times with the HCG weekly. Now its 3 shots of Test and still the same 2 shots of HCG.

Run less prop man. 600mg prop/wk is way more than you need for a first cycle. If this IS your first cycle, 100-125mg/EOD will suffice.

Things look pretty good and well thought out. EQ will be good for slow steady strength gains and will help with vascularity but you know it wont start kicking till week 4-5. Most run EQ for longer than 10 weeks mainly for that very reason. But I suppose 10 weeks will be fine. ...

EQ takes longer than 4 weeks to kick in man. Usually like 7-9 weeks. So yeah, 10 weeks on EQ is kind of short..

 

[aja44]

Run less prop man. 600mg prop/wk is way more than you need for a first cycle. If this IS your first cycle, 100-125mg/EOD will suffice.

Thanks, I will decrease this to 125mg/EOD as you suggest.

EQ takes longer than 4 weeks to kick in man. Usually like 7-9 weeks. So yeah, 10 weeks on EQ is kind of short..

So if I'm going to be pinning Prop EOD/ I will will also be shooting the EQ at the same time. How much EQ do you think EOD? Are you recommending 12 weeks or longer?

Also, I originally was going to start my PCT 14 days after my last Cyp shot since the half life of Cyp was 12 days or so. I believe the half life of EQ is about 14 days if memory servers me. With the half life of Prop being about 5 days, I should move my PCT to start about 7 days after my last shot of Prop or still wait 14 days after my last shot of EQ?

Also, do most agree with RoadKing that dropping my weekly HCG down to 500iu for the full cycle is best? I would now be running this through the EQ which would be a few weeks after stopping the Prop. Then 2 days after my last EQ shot I would up the HCG to 1000iu's/EOD for 16 days?

One thing that no one has replied to yet is about buying from board sponsors. Where do you get your gear from and why? If its simply price, thats cool but if you know from experience that one gear is better than the other, please pass that knowledge along.

Thanks again for all your help on this.

 

[Tyler3295]

So if I'm going to be pinning Prop EOD/ I will will also be shooting the EQ at the same time. How much EQ do you think EOD? Are you recommending 12 weeks or longer? ...

Yes I am recommending 12 weeks or longer for an EQ cycle. Honestly though, you can drop the EQ this run.

... With the half life of Prop being about 5 days, I should move my PCT to start about 7 days after my last shot of Prop or still wait 14 days after my last shot of EQ? ...

The half-life of prop is shorter than 5 days, thus why the longest interval between pinning should be EOD. Start PCT 21 days after your last EQ pin. I would recommend to keep running prop whilst the EQ esters are clearing though. Time your PCT to start 21 days after last EQ pin and 3 days after last prop pin.

... Also, do most agree with RoadKing that dropping my weekly HCG down to 500iu for the full cycle is best? I would now be running this through the EQ which would be a few weeks after stopping the Prop. Then 2 days after my last EQ shot I would up the HCG to 1000iu's/EOD for 16 days? ...

Just run HCG @ 250iu 2x/wk throughout the cycle. If you do this you should not have to raise the HCG dosage at the end.

... One thing that no one has replied to yet is about buying from board sponsors. Where do you get your gear from and why? If its simply price, thats cool but if you know from experience that one gear is better than the other, please pass that knowledge along.

Thanks again for all your help on this.

You can't openly ask where I get my gear from. I can say though that it isn't from any of the sponsors. Naps is pretty good. WP's gear works, but it'll burn a hole in your pocket. Plus, their (WP) desperate attempts at acquiring new clients turns me off from them.

 

[Roaddkingg]

Good Tyler you caught that about the HCG. He had misunderstood a bit. Run the 250iu's 2x wkly throughout with the same dosage going right up until the day before PCT begins. No need to increase it. Prop's half life is 4.5 days I believe. But is recommended 3x per wk to keep plasma even from having spikes.

 

[Tyler3295]

Good Tyler you caught that about the HCG. He had misunderstood a bit. Run the 250iu's 2x wkly throughout with the same dosage going right up until the day before PCT begins. No need to increase it. Prop's half life is 4.5 days I believe. But is recommended 3x per wk to keep plasma even from having spikes.

The half-life of prop is like 48-72 hours (2-3 days). If the half-life was 4-5 days you wouldn't need to pin it ED/EOD. On that note, prop is GENERALLY not recommended to be pinned only 3x/wk. (EOD = more than 3x/wk on average..)

 

[aja44]

The half-life of prop is like 48-72 hours (2-3 days). If the half-life was 4-5 days you wouldn't need to pin it ED/EOD. On that note, prop is GENERALLY not recommended to be pinned only 3x/wk. (EOD = more than 3x/wk on average..)

So what you and RK are saying is that if I run HCG for the entire length of my cycle I dont have to run it EOD leading into my PCT? I took that straight out from the Sticky. HCG EOD for 16 days from the last shot. It actually said to do 1500iu's EOD, but if you were doing it during the cycle you could lower the dosage.

 

[Tyler3295]

So what you and RK are saying is that if I run HCG for the entire length of my cycle I dont have to run it EOD leading into my PCT? I took that straight out from the Sticky. HCG EOD for 16 days from the last shot. It actually said to do 1500iu's EOD, but if you were doing it during the cycle you could lower the dosage.

I always run it throughout my cycle and never increase the dosage at the end. I still have easier PCTs. Plus, if you

I generally don't like running HCG at too high of a dosage to avoid the possible estrogen related problems.

 

[aja44]

The half-life of prop is shorter than 5 days, thus why the longest interval between pinning should be EOD. Start PCT 21 days after your last EQ pin. I would recommend to keep running prop whilst the EQ esters are clearing though. Time your PCT to start 21 days after last EQ pin and 3 days after last prop pin.

So I'm going to go with EQ for 12 weeks to start. In order to following your above recommendation, I would do something like the following:
Weeks 1-5 EQ 125mg/EOD
Weeks 6-12 Prop 150mg/EOD and EQ125mg/EOD
Weeks 13-15 Prop 150mg/EOD
Weeks 1-15 - HCG 250iu twice per week
Weeks 1-15 - Aromasin 12.5mg ED

PCT: starting 3 days after last Prop shot (beginning of week 16)
Amomasin - w1-3@25mg, w4@12.5mg
HCG - run this at 500iu's EOD for 16 days or not?????
Clomid - w1-3@100mg ED , w4@50mg ED
Nolva - 20mg ED for 5-7 days if needed for Gyno


Just run HCG @ 250iu 2x/wk throughout the cycle. If you do this you should not have to raise the HCG dosage at the end.

Dont have to raise it, but should still run it through the full cycle and through the first 16 days of PCT correct?



You can't openly ask where I get my gear from. I can say though that it isn't from any of the sponsors. Naps is pretty good. WP's gear works, but it'll burn a hole in your pocket. Plus, their (WP) desperate attempts at acquiring new clients turns me off from them.[/QUOTE]

 

[Tyler3295]

So I'm going to go with EQ for 12 weeks to start. In order to following your above recommendation, I would do something like the following:
Weeks 1-5 EQ 125mg/EOD
Weeks 6-12 Prop 150mg/EOD and EQ125mg/EOD
Weeks 13-15 Prop 150mg/EOD
Weeks 1-15 - HCG 250iu twice per week
Weeks 1-15 - Aromasin 12.5mg ED

PCT: starting 3 days after last Prop shot (beginning of week 16)
Amomasin - w1-3@25mg, w4@12.5mg
HCG - run this at 500iu's EOD for 16 days or not?????
Clomid - w1-3@100mg ED , w4@50mg ED
Nolva - 20mg ED for 5-7 days if needed for Gyno

Dont have to raise it, but should still run it through the full cycle and through the first 16 days of PCT correct?

I would personally run the prop weeks 1-15. However, I really recommend dropping the EQ this run though man. Just go with prop. That way you could keep it short, sweet, and to the point. 8-12 weeks, rather than 15.

I wouldn't run HCG during PCT. I also would not run Clomid @ 100/100/100/50. That's a high dosage for those first 3 weeks..

 

[Iron Dragon]

Your original cycle was fine, and recommended for your first. The aromasin will reduce water retention quite a bit. May not see much at all. I suggest 25gm ed.

Run the aromasin from the beginning to 2-4weeks past PCT. Also shoot the HCG the day before your other shots. Also stop the EQ at week 8. That will help with PCT. That's all I have to say.