Oh, take care, The Great Satan.
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Heterosexuality, BiSexuality and Homosexuality
- Thread starter John H.
- Start date
Thanks for taking the time to explain, Firestorm....uh...what I meant by that last statement is that, in my own thinking, when someone talks about how they feel about certain intimate activity, I'm assuming they are referring to themselves participating in it - not regulating that behavior in other consenting adults.
I understand what you are saying about graphic displays on television programs - I've seen two episodes of that show and had to remind myself that it is an exaggeration of real life, just like any other media presentation. Still, I think about what they've seen heterosexuals doing in programs and whether or not they've felt the same way...and how they've adjusted to that reality in their face all of the time.
I understand your concern about same-sex marriage, but I also think that people who choose a life partner should be entitled to be primarily consulted in matter concerning hospital visits, medication, funeral arrangements, inheritance rights, etc. There are some real horror stories out there about how some of those people have been mistreated by not having any legalrecognition or protection. I wrote about one experience like that in another thread that taught me a lot.
For example, I read what you wrote about your neighbors in another thread - I have seen cases in which one of those partners dies, and the other is evicted from their home, a will contested and claimed invalid (legally unrelated "roommates"), a partner denied access to funeral arrangements, acknowledgement in an obituary, and even blocked from attending a funeral. If marriage isn't the answer, then something should be done to ensure protection of their lives and the investment they make in each other.
It just seems to me that many religions would have a far better chance of influencing people if they would encourage honesty and show concern and caring for these people instead of helping create a hell on earth for them or force them to pretend they are something else in order to pursue life in peace.
By the way, I know you aren't a bad guy.....hell, I'm lucky you are friendly enough to even exchange posts with me. Hope you had a good holiday....my break continues to be a working one. Instead of writing about gays (though hell, that seems to be all I'm doing on this forum lately) I'm working on the narratives of people who have reported alien "experiences." Suddenly the thought of two men together doesn't seem so strange when I'm reading about beings with bug features trying to fertilize a human woman.
I understand what you are saying about graphic displays on television programs - I've seen two episodes of that show and had to remind myself that it is an exaggeration of real life, just like any other media presentation. Still, I think about what they've seen heterosexuals doing in programs and whether or not they've felt the same way...and how they've adjusted to that reality in their face all of the time.
I understand your concern about same-sex marriage, but I also think that people who choose a life partner should be entitled to be primarily consulted in matter concerning hospital visits, medication, funeral arrangements, inheritance rights, etc. There are some real horror stories out there about how some of those people have been mistreated by not having any legalrecognition or protection. I wrote about one experience like that in another thread that taught me a lot.
For example, I read what you wrote about your neighbors in another thread - I have seen cases in which one of those partners dies, and the other is evicted from their home, a will contested and claimed invalid (legally unrelated "roommates"), a partner denied access to funeral arrangements, acknowledgement in an obituary, and even blocked from attending a funeral. If marriage isn't the answer, then something should be done to ensure protection of their lives and the investment they make in each other.
It just seems to me that many religions would have a far better chance of influencing people if they would encourage honesty and show concern and caring for these people instead of helping create a hell on earth for them or force them to pretend they are something else in order to pursue life in peace.
By the way, I know you aren't a bad guy.....hell, I'm lucky you are friendly enough to even exchange posts with me. Hope you had a good holiday....my break continues to be a working one. Instead of writing about gays (though hell, that seems to be all I'm doing on this forum lately) I'm working on the narratives of people who have reported alien "experiences." Suddenly the thought of two men together doesn't seem so strange when I'm reading about beings with bug features trying to fertilize a human woman.
Ahh...now my bad here - it does makes sense about what you meant when you said ban...except states have tried it and it just drives it to the gutter. It's late for me, so I shoulda put the reading glasses back on when I look at the screen!
I agree completely about your personal life - that's WHY it's personal. I'm much the same way - I don't discuss my relationships in a revealing way online at all. But as far as those parades go, I think they should reach a point where it isn't necessary to display numbers in "pride" parades to convince the rest of the population that they exist. Marching for civil rights, on the other hand, is appropriate if it means protecting their right to life and association.
Ya know, I need to go up and re-read the original post by JohnH...I..didn't get the initial impression that it was advocating one orientation. I might just have to be eating some words here, which should make TGS get a good laugh at me....
Naw..his thread choice didn't bother me at all, though I'm not sure why he felt the need to start one on the subject - I do agree that sexual expression between consenting adults is a personal, private thing and my own personal belief is that it shouldn't be socially ranked simply to make someone else feel more secure. I also think that people shouldn't automatically or deliberately assault the senses of those who feel differently about the subject.
Dammit - I should have started a thread with a poll asking who has a fantasy to sleep with an alien?
------ yikes...we might be afraid to find that one out.
Dammit - I should have started a thread with a poll asking who has a fantasy to sleep with an alien?
------ yikes...we might be afraid to find that one out.
firestorm
Banned Member
yea well it is late my friend and I'm kinda even confused myself a bit too. As for gay paraded again they don't bother me either but the point of even brining it up is similar to another post I just made regarding "thegreatsatan" and his religous beliefs. When you stand up and paint a bullseye on your chest regardless if its a banner your carrying, a medal you wear around your neck or some freaky hair style you best expect that someone, somewhere is going to take aim at that target you proudly wear and pull the trigger. Personnally, I don't like being behind the bullseye so I don't paint them. But when you start a thread and your being so boisterous regarding a sensitive subject prepare for debate and disagreement. That is all I'm really trying to say. I get tired of the grand standing. I say sit the hell down and be one of the human race and keep the bullshit at home behind a closed door.
firestorm
Banned Member
Originally posted by kbm8795
Thanks for taking the time to explain, Firestorm....uh...what I meant by that last statement is that, in my own thinking, when someone talks about how they feel about certain intimate activity, I'm assuming they are referring to themselves participating in it - not regulating that behavior in other consenting adults.
OK well nope that isn't me. lol I'm not a regulator nor did I refer to myself participating.... I commented on a tv show was all. lol
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I understand what you are saying about graphic displays on television programs - I've seen two episodes of that show and had to remind myself that it is an exaggeration of real life, just like any other media presentation. Still, I think about what they've seen heterosexuals doing in programs and whether or not they've felt the same way...and how they've adjusted to that reality in their face all of the time.
But even said homosexuality is the minority and being a minority I'm certain growing up with Leave it to Beaver, 8 is enough, Bradey bunch they were pretty much media taught what is the "norm" so to speak from 1 years old so they grew up with heterosexual surrounding them including their own parents so I'm pretty sure there really wasn't any adjustment period. Now you take a poor bastard like myself,,, I grew up in the same environment I spoke of above and then ....one day switch a channel and see what I saw??? OK that is culture shock at its truest sense of the words. How does one adjust to something of that nature after seeing it for the very 1st time at 40 years old??
(I'm tired and I'm certain there was a easier way to say all that but I couldn't think of one) lol
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I understand your concern about same-sex marriage, but I also think that people who choose a life partner should be entitled to be primarily consulted in matter concerning hospital visits, medication, funeral arrangements, inheritance rights, etc. There are some real horror stories out there about how some of those people have been mistreated by not having any legalrecognition or protection. I wrote about one experience like that in another thread that taught me a lot.
Well you make some excellent points there and cannot argue them nor would I. They are valid.
************
For example, I read what you wrote about your neighbors in another thread - I have seen cases in which one of those partners dies, and the other is evicted from their home, a will contested and claimed invalid (legally unrelated "roommates"), a partner denied access to funeral arrangements, acknowledgement in an obituary, and even blocked from attending a funeral. If marriage isn't the answer, then something should be done to ensure protection of their lives and the investment they make in each other.
Well that is just downright unlawful if you ask me. And like I said above, your points are very valid and I'd certainly help my neighbors if ever a situation like that happened to either one of them. They are good people and I treat them as such. People. Plus the thing about them I like the most they do not flaunt their lifestyle or make it the topic of all the conversations. just as non of us heteros do either. My thing is just fit the hell in and leave the personal things personel. That is it in a nutshell.
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It just seems to me that many religions would have a far better chance of influencing people if they would encourage honesty and show concern and caring for these people instead of helping create a hell on earth for them or force them to pretend they are something else in order to pursue life in peace.
Well I'm not getting into the politics of religion because I think religion is not only about teaching the word of god or whomever you pray to but a business as well.
By the way, I know you aren't a bad guy.....hell, I'm lucky you are friendly enough to even exchange posts with me.
Lucky? Why would you think yourself lucky? I'm nobody my man, just a single anybody and your not lucky I talk to you. That makes you sound lucky to know me or something and I am nothing special believe that!!! Im no different they you. Equals so if luck must be placed in this equation then we are both lucky then.
And yea I'm friendly and yes I know I say stupid non thoughout things from time to time and just type whatever comes out of my damn head without proof reading to ensure what I write will not hurt someones feelings or be taken out of context but I always try to see the other persons point of view and never afraid to say I'm sorry for something I wrote. I take responsibility for what I say, right or wrong and yep I'll change my stance on things some times after getting more facts about a subject then what I came into a debate with. I never ever claimed to know everything or so eqosentric to think I'm always right. I'm not.
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Hope you had a good holiday....my break continues to be a working one. Instead of writing about gays (though hell, that seems to be all I'm doing on this forum lately) I'm working on the narratives of people who have reported alien "experiences." Suddenly the thought of two men together doesn't seem so strange when I'm reading about beings with bug features trying to fertilize a human woman.
Christmas was fantastic!! I can't wait till next year!!! hahahaha
Oh man that is funny stuff how the hell did you get mixed up with this story about aliens???? oh that is really funny.
Nope, I don't like it Pepper. I can show you many instances where references to "the blood" have been left out or change!
Re: Re: Heterosexuality, BiSexuality and Homosexuality
Hi Maddog1. I can see by your response you are using a "current" Bible - one that puts words into the Bible that originally never existed. You must remember that the Bible never existed before or even during the Time of Christ. It is the words of Men - over 40 and with over 40 different opinions. Written over a long period of time by many and with many reasons and not always good. It is a collection of literature - essays, poems, prose, etc. God and Christ speak FOR THEMSELVES and need no one else to do Their talking or speaking for Them. God created Men. Certainly HE KNOWS the strengths and weaknesses and dangers of MAN and would HIMSELF NEVER allow others to speak FOR Him. He KNOWS the dangers involved with Men. If He has something to say HE WILL SAY IT DIRECTLY and NOT THROUGH someone else. I know if I had things to say that were very important I - I WOULD say it and NEVER allow others to speak FOR me. I WOULD SAY MYSELF. The very same applies to God I am sure! You mention my "aggenda". My PERSONAL thoughts have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH what I said for what I said IS ABSOLUTELY TRUE. And VERY ACCURATE. Religion "perpetuates" itself by having people "believe" (just accept without question) and "have faith" even though there is no real basis for that "faith" HONESTLY speaking. There are THOUSANDS of religions each one claiming to be the "real" and / or "truthful".... To the point of killing others even over this... I believe ALL sources for ALL information MUST ALWAYS BE CONSIDERED with an open mind and very objectively and throughout a person's life. Honestly and accurately and completely so as near as is Humanly possible. And ALWAYS QUESTION EVERYTHING - never just "accept" from ANYONE. Take Care, John H.
Hi Pepper. And "scripture" IS WRITTEN BY MEN - over 40 with over 40 different points of view. The Old Testament is nothing more than the old Jewish law books. The New Testament came after the Time of Christ. If God has something to say HE - HE - will say and NEVER ALLOW others to speak for Him. Same applies with Christ. Remember this too, Christ was on this earth for 32 years and NEVER SAID ONE WORD HIMSELF EVER about Homosexuality or BiSexuality being wrong. If they were wrong HE WOULD HAVE SAID SO FOR SURE - HE NEVER DID - EVER. He said a lot of other things but NEVER said a WORD about these being wrong. Heterosexuality, BiSexuality and Homosexuality DO EXIST and ALWAYS HAVE in Nature and the Natural World of which we all are a part. Take Care, John H.
Re: Re: Heterosexuality, BiSexuality and Homosexuality
Hi MikeKy. ABSOLUTELY NOT. And NOT intended to be at all. It IS intended to express accuracy and truthfulness and completeness about these subjects. UNDERSTANDING ALL ASPECTS of Sexuality TRUTHFULLY SO. Take Care, John H.Originally posted by MikeKy
This isn't a gay rights forum, is it?
Hi Mudge. You speak as to why God WOULD NEVER allow someone to speak FOR HIM. HE WILL SAY WHAT HE HAS TO SAY HIMSELF. He KNOWS Human Beings and KNOWS their capabilities - and failings. GOD NEVER SAID ONE TIME about any of the Sexualities being wrong. They are natural variations of Sexuality like all things in life and in living - VARIETY. Each has a good and real purpose(s). Each NEEDS to be HONESTLY AND ACCURATELY UNDERSTOOD. Take Care, John H.
Hi Hold. You will find that people tend to ONLY look at what THEY want and what is "convenient" and forget ALL the rest. I like to be VERY open minded and VERY objective and consider ALL INFORMATION FROM ALL SOURCES and QUESTION everyone and everything. That is how a person helps make themselves the best they can be and is a lifelong process. Take Care, John H.Originally posted by HoldDaMayo
to each his own... why condemn... but, if you wanna throw out some scripture that the translation can't be questioned...
God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him may be saved."
(John 3:17
So, let me get this straight... The Son of God, the one who saved us all... didn't come to condemn... I feel pretty guilty condemning anyone... anyone ever been to Sunday School and learn that:
God is Love
Hi Pepper. THINK about this. If YOU have something to say - especially if it is very important - do YOU DO YOUR TAKLING YOURSELF or do you have someone else speak FOR YOU? GOD KNOWS MAN - He made them and KNOWS the dangers involved in having someone else speak FOR Him. HE speaks HIMSELF. He does NOT allow others to speak FOR Him. The Bible is written BY MEN. Happy New Year Pepper, Take Care, John H.
With regard to Nature and Sexuality please read: BIOLOGICAL EXUBERANCE, by Bruce Bagemihl (St. Martin's Press). With regard to the Sexual practices of MEN in the past one book discusses this very well with regard to BiSexuality and Homosexuality - see: FORBIDDEN FRIENDSHIPS, by Michael Rocke (Oxford University Press). You MUST ask yourself WHY nearly one Man in two would be involved Sexually - and lovingly - see the book and read it yourself and check out its sources. Very well written. Also read: SEXUAL BEHAVIOR IN THE HUMAN MALE and SEXUAL BEHAVIOR IN THE HUMAN FEMALE, by Dr. Alfred Kinsey and Associates. These have stood the test of time. Take Care, John H.
So he destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for the fun of it I guess?
The balls themselves were composed of pressed pure powder sulfur. Checking with volcanic experts around the world confirmed that no where else in the world, even around volcanic activity, were any balls of this composition found.
When the balls had fallen from heaven, they were estimated to be around 5,000 degrees Celsius (or around 9,000 degrees Fahrenheit). After consuming everything that was around them, the heat continue to melt the ash that had formed around them, vitrifying (turning to glass) the ash. Thus the balls were surrounded by a glassy casing of melted and re-solidified ash.
Sodom is first mentioned in connection with Lot's choosing a pleasant place to live. But the warning is given that "the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly." Gen. 13.13
A list of six "abominations" are also given in Proverbs 6: 16 - 19:
These six things doth the LORD hate:
yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
A proud look, a lying tongue,
and hands that shed innocent blood,
An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations,
feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies,
and he that soweth discord among brethren.
The only purpose I can see homosexuality serving is keeping the population down, which to me is a good thing.
Do I think its natural? Yes, I think its ridiculous to think someone wakes up one morning and decides to go against the grain, risk being beaten to death, and become gay. Who would choose such a thing, certainly not every single gay person out there. We are part of nature and nature is not perfect, things happen.
Hi Dg. We are still learning about the Universe. There is little we actually know compared to what is out there to know. It is very possible that something catastrophic happened such as a meteor and people at the time did not understand what was happening much like the things we today do not understand - yet. People were not as knowledgeable in many ways 2,000 years ago. One thing is for sure - there were those who wanted to control others and they have always done their very best to do just that - even today. ALWAYS consider ALL INFORMATION FROM ALL SOURCES very objectively and with an open mind. And keep asking and questioning. Take Care, John H.
I guess we could argue that the Greek males were "gay" by social-choice.
As for having an open mind, that is like saying that we should question God which is a no-no IMO. The problem is, how do you know what to believe when your only accounts are left by mankind, hence my seat of the pants method.
As for having an open mind, that is like saying that we should question God which is a no-no IMO. The problem is, how do you know what to believe when your only accounts are left by mankind, hence my seat of the pants method.
vegepygmy
Registered
???This is incorrect. The majority of New Testament was written in Greek. The Letters to the Corinthians, who lived in the Greek city of Corinth, are in the Greek language.
The key word in question in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is ???arsenokoitai??? or ???abusers of themselves as men??? (King James) It is a compound word consisting of Arseno ??????man or having to do with man??? and Koitai ??????coitus or sex/to bed ???. This is a basic translation, but it is helpful to look for confirmation as to the meaning in non Christian texts.
The term ???Arsenokoitai??? is not a new creation. It appears in the Septuagint, which contains the first Greek translation of the Jewish Books of Law. These books were written by Jewish scholars prior to the birth of Jesus, and it is quite likely that the author of letters to the Corinthians was familiar with them. The Septuagint version of Leviticus 20:13 uses the phrase ???arseno koitai??? when describing ???If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a women?????? (King James)
The books of law are very explicit and exact in this matter. Because of the clarity of the text, there is general agreement among early Jewish commentators that Leviticus 20:13 in the original Hebrew refers to sexual activity between men, and is not specifically limited to male prostitution. As a result, there is very little evidence to suggest that Corinthians has undergone misinterpretation in this matter.
I am unsure if this is a social/political discussion or it is an actual debate on the correct translation of New Testament Greek???.anyway it does good to warm up before going back to school.
vegepygmy
Registered
So let???s follow the logic of this???The prophets of the old testament claimed to speak for God. Since God would never allow others to speak for him, these prophets were false and they have misled generations of people to the present day. Now hypothetically??? if God actually did appear and spoke to a group of people???could they tell others or would God not allow that?
How do you know that Christ did not say anything about homosexuality? You???ve previously stated that Christ would never allow anyone to speak for him. That would include all the disciples and apostles. So you would have to discount the entire contents of the New Testament.
Many things exist in the natural world. The simple act of existence means little in determining value.
Why force someone to go against their natural feelings? If it brings harmony to their lives then let it be. They were born with an anomally the same as someone with a cleft palate or diabetes it's not their fault. Men and women share the same genetic makeup, it's not uncommon for one to have attributes of another be it physical or mental. My girlfriends brother is gay, but he appears to be very much a man he collects sports memoribilia, goes to games all of the time loves sports cars, doesn't know how to dress hell I dress better than him 
Yet he knew in his early teens something was different it tore at him for years as he fought the truth about himself. Why would "Christians" wish that pain on someone? He loves his husband, there is love there, relationships go a lot deeper than sex.
One other thing, do you realize how many children living in orphanages would have good homes right now if gay couples could marry and adopt? How would you feel if your lover died suddenly and because you were never officially "together" you had no legal say so in the funeral, were left without their social security, his/her company never viewed you as a pair so the life insurance was void, etc.
Yet he knew in his early teens something was different it tore at him for years as he fought the truth about himself. Why would "Christians" wish that pain on someone? He loves his husband, there is love there, relationships go a lot deeper than sex. One other thing, do you realize how many children living in orphanages would have good homes right now if gay couples could marry and adopt? How would you feel if your lover died suddenly and because you were never officially "together" you had no legal say so in the funeral, were left without their social security, his/her company never viewed you as a pair so the life insurance was void, etc.
Very informative vege. But once again, depending on what erudite scholars, biblical anthropolgists etc. you ask, you get a different answer...so we get back to the same circle of reasoning that all this may just be an overinterpretation.
http://www.worldpolicy.org/globalrights/sexorient/hom_bibh.htm
True, I probably should have clarified both OT and NT, since I lump them together as both were mainly translated in the 4th century by the singular work of one man ST. Jerome (although he did not translate it to english) which came later. My main point is, there is alot of room for mistranslation in the OT just translating it from the extra step from Hebrew, to Greek, then the vulgar languages and latin (due to the efforts of one man) , in the New Testament, the concern is also that the written language (greek) was a far cry from the oral tradition (Arameic) of Jesus and his followers. This translation from a very different oral tradition to a another written language can only be wrought with error. I'm no greek, arameic, latin, expert but as someone whos had to learn six languages (mandarin, hindi, malay, foukien etc.) before immigrating here to America, I can tell you there are words and phrases that are totally untranslatable between many Asian and Romance languages.
Hi Mudge. I have to disagree with you somewhat Mudge. I would think God WOULD WANT us to question Him. How else would someone TRULY AND ACCURATELY KNOW about Him? He made us and He certainly understands that we would have questions. Any TRUTHFUL person or thing would WANT someone to question their truthfulness and their existance. To just "accept" is VERY DANGEROUS and VERY WRONG. After all in the end what you are really saying (meaning anyone here) is that you are willing to jusst accept what someone else just tells you without really KNOWING that what is said is truthful yourself. I go to the source whenever possible. I question everything. That IS a REAL and HONEST part of learning about anything or anyone. FIND OUT YOURSELF. NEVER allow someone else to DO your work. Here is an example, I change my own oil and filter and grease my own truck. I CAN have someone else do it for me but the ONLY way I can TRULY KNOW it was done right is to do it myself. I would like to know that I can trust people and I sure wish I could but the more I live the more I realize you have to be careful about trusting others in any way. I sure wish that was NOT the case but I am VERY WELL AWARE of what is REAL. This sounds paranoid perhaps but I can tell you I never leave up to others what I really should DO myself. I go by "gut" feelings myself - intuition I guess you can call it. It is a part of the survival of any Human Being. Something we all are given but many times do not always listen to or pay attention to and we sometimes get "burned" in that lack of focus.... Take Care, John H.
Hi Vegepygmy. I feel that God (Whoever you or anyone else perceive Him to be) as the Creator of Man would certainly KNOW Man and Man's strengths and weaknesses and desires - especially with regard to the control of others and desire of power over others and Man's ablity - or even inability - to tell the truth. If I were God I can tell you I WOULD NEVER trust Man to speak FOR me. You can say that is my opinion but given the past practices of Man in general and to what extent Man will harm others I would think it common sense that God would NEVER allow someone else to do His talking for Him and that He WOULD SPEAK for Himself. You also must remember that before roughly 2,000 years ago this world existed for MILLIONS of years at the very least - we know that. How is it that God would choose to make His existance known for only such a relatively short time ago compared to the history of the earth and life as we know it? And to just a "few Men".... I believe God shows us everyday His existance at least in Nature and the Natural World. I believe there is more truthfulness there than anything Man has created or is "responsible for" or "not"... The Old and the New Testament are a collection of literature - essays, poems, prose, etc. - written BY MEN - over 40 and over a long period of time with each having their thoughts on whatever. Some things written are fine some are very suspect. As is Man himself. Look at the harm that has been as a result of the Bible itself since its appearance - it was printed around 1350 AD when the printing press was invented. Look at all the bad that can be attributed to the Bible itself and those that would have others believe ALL it says is absolute. People have been murdered, killed, harmed, etc. over what people THINK the Bible "says" or "tells them is so".... God WOULD NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH ANY OF THAT. NO Father I know of would do that to any of His children. Not if He TRULY LOVED them. Also remember that there are THOUSANDS of religions in this world and each one has their own "ideas" about what is or is not right... RELIGION has been the very SOURCE of a lot of the BAD with regard to Man.... (Don't believe me? LEARN from its history yourself and see for yourself - sure it can be good but too often it is NOT!) You ask me how I know Christ did not say anything about Homosexuality - well I can TELL YOU that IF He DID we CERTAINLY WOULD KNOW THAT WITHOUT QUESTION given the attention "RELIGIONS" like to give this one subject. They certainly do not pay anyway near the attention to the abuse of children for whatever reason and in any capacity that they do with regard to the subject of Homosexuality. To me what two people do that are capable and agree and can give that consent freely IS ENTIRELY UP TO THEM AND NO ONE ELSE. I really wonder why it is that religions give only lip service to the abuse of children - I am speaking of abuse in ANY FORM BY ANY ONE. But they sure have a lot to say with regard to Homosexuality - Male Homosexuality - NOT FEMALE Homosexuality. Also you speak things that exist in Nature and the Natural World and that THAT very existance means relative nothing - I TOTALLY DISAGREE. It certainly goes to its "NATURALNESS" as "religion" likes to say it is not. And that is just the "tip of the iceberg".... I FULLY APPRECIATE people wanting answers to the most important things of life and living but those who seek those answers MUST make an HONEST, SINCERE, ACCURATE, COMPLETE, etc. EFFORT and utilize ALL SOURCES FOR ALL INFORMATION and that is a life-long persuit. RELIGION certainly by itself doesn't even come close to answering much - at least NOT TRUTHFULLY AND ACCURATELY. Religion more often than not just gives "convenient" answers that do not have much in the way of fact or accuracy - mostly just "thoughts of some" or even "whim". I am NOT trying to be disrespectful to any in any form their past practices are what earns them anothers respect or not. Take Care, John H.
Hi Bandaid. You "hit the nail right on the head" - MAN WROTE, MAN TRANSLATED. ANYONE MUST CONSIDER the background of those Men. WHO they actually were and what kind of Men they REALLY WERE. That goes to the heart of anything they would subsequently do or not and how truthful and honest and sincere and accurate they would be. Anything MAN is involved in MUST BE SUSPECT because MAN IS SUSPECT. MAN does have alterior motives for anything he does. Some things good some things not so good. Look at and learn from the history of Man you will see why and what I speak of. Man does not have a very good track record with regard to treating his fellow Man very well at all.... RELIGION more often than not is BEHIND IT ALL. The desire of some to control all others - it IS the money, position and power - just like politics.... Take Care, John H.
Intelligent DISCUSSION
I want to THANK those that are adding their thoughts here INTELLIGENTLY and DISCUSSING this subject from all points of view and that so far this has not turned into just another "flame-fest". My intention IS DISCUSSION and hopefully UNDERSTANDING about each of these forms of Sexuality. UNDERSTANDING each of them TRUTHFULLY AND ACCURATELY without regard to prejudice, hatred, bigotry, etc. UNDERSTANDING. It is NOT MY INTENTION by posting this thread to "convert anyone"!!! That can never happen. YOU ARE WHO GOD MADE YOU - even with regard to your Sexuality which IS a PART of who you are and AS BORN. NO ONE "chooses" their Sexuality. No one "chooses" the color of their skin, etc. ... Thanks for being "adult" and thanks for being Men and Women in this discussion. THAT IS my purpose - DISCUSSION AND UNDERSTANDING - ACCURATELY AND HONESTLY AND COMPLETELY. Then maybe we can move on to other subjects. This is a basic subject which NEEDS HONESTY AND ACCURACY AND UNDERSTANDING. Take Care, John H.
I want to THANK those that are adding their thoughts here INTELLIGENTLY and DISCUSSING this subject from all points of view and that so far this has not turned into just another "flame-fest". My intention IS DISCUSSION and hopefully UNDERSTANDING about each of these forms of Sexuality. UNDERSTANDING each of them TRUTHFULLY AND ACCURATELY without regard to prejudice, hatred, bigotry, etc. UNDERSTANDING. It is NOT MY INTENTION by posting this thread to "convert anyone"!!! That can never happen. YOU ARE WHO GOD MADE YOU - even with regard to your Sexuality which IS a PART of who you are and AS BORN. NO ONE "chooses" their Sexuality. No one "chooses" the color of their skin, etc. ... Thanks for being "adult" and thanks for being Men and Women in this discussion. THAT IS my purpose - DISCUSSION AND UNDERSTANDING - ACCURATELY AND HONESTLY AND COMPLETELY. Then maybe we can move on to other subjects. This is a basic subject which NEEDS HONESTY AND ACCURACY AND UNDERSTANDING. Take Care, John H.
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JohnH,
What is your basis for saying the God, the Creator, would want the created to question Him? I find many of the comments about God in this thread to be totally unsupportable and therefore nothing but opinion.
A religion based on what you or I think is simply NOTHING. These comments may sound reasonable but they are worthless because humans are just thinking them up.
The Scriptures tell us what God "thinks" and how we should live. This is a solid foundation for a system of beliefs. What I think is reasonable is irrelevant. I am the creature, the Creator sets the rules.
What is your basis for saying the God, the Creator, would want the created to question Him? I find many of the comments about God in this thread to be totally unsupportable and therefore nothing but opinion.
A religion based on what you or I think is simply NOTHING. These comments may sound reasonable but they are worthless because humans are just thinking them up.
The Scriptures tell us what God "thinks" and how we should live. This is a solid foundation for a system of beliefs. What I think is reasonable is irrelevant. I am the creature, the Creator sets the rules.
