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Is Deca Dick Caused by Elevated Prolactin Levels from Nandrolone?

Arnold

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Is Deca Dick Caused by Elevated Prolactin Levels from Nandrolone?
by Bill Roberts


A: The problem with this is that it is from no evidence. It???s the kind of statement that if true would be quite provable: prolactin is measurable.

The one study I???ve read that reported prolactin levels with anabolic steroid usage showed approximately the same results for testosterone and nandrolone both for average increase in prolactin levels and percent of individuals showing any increase. (I don???t, unfortunately, still have the study and I???ve found it hard to find again, but it quite definitely exists.)

The dopamine agonists are prosexual for many individuals even where there is no prolactin problem, so an improvement in libido with these drugs does not prove that prolactin was the cause of the poor libido.

It is true that high prolactin can yield low libido.

But it???s not proven that this is the cause of Deca???s unusual unfavorableness in this regard: if it were, testosterone should be about as bad a culprit because it too often increases prolactin and by about as much.

(Most likely via increase in estrogen.)

What would be good evidence would be if an author or researcher found that everyone or nearly everyone studied who has the complaint with Deca indeed had high prolactin, whereas among the Deca users ??? which is about half or two-thirds ??? that don???t have high prolactin, none or nearly none had the complaint.

Then we could say that among the Deca users the problem is correlated with prolactin.

But generally the claims of ???high prolactin??? are made without even a measurement of prolactin.

We don???t know that the many Deca users claiming ???high prolactin??? is causing their problem actually have high prolactin, or that if they do, that the prolactin alone is the full or even primary cause for their low libido, as testosterone users often have raised prolactin but still good libido.

And it would remain a mystery how it is that similarly high prolactin from testosterone use doesn???t cause the same problem.

It might be that nandrolone has a neurosteroid-like activity, or antagonist activity, that is anti-sexual. It???s as good a theory as any ??? no evidence behind it, but neither is there for the prolactin theory. But at least it doesn???t have the inconsistency problem that the prolactin theory has, the inconsistency being that testosterone has similar prolactin-raising properties but doesn???t have the same tendency to reduce libido.

So it???s a mystery, to date.

Read more from this MESO-Rx article at: Is Deca Dick Caused by Elevated Prolactin Levels from Nandrolone? | MESO-Rx Steroid Blog
 
Very interesting article. I am using NPP right now and my libido isn't the greatest while using Prami at 0.65mg ED. But heavyiron suggested I skip one dose of NPP and up my Test Prop dose, which I will start doing today. Hope this fixes me :)

On a separate note. I think the whole issue is estrogen related. People seem to think that an AI is going to murder their estrogen, so they either leave it out or dose it too low. I have been on Letrozole for 3 weeks now, and my estrogen has dropped only 25%. It may take another 5 weeks for my estrogen to reach the levels it is supposed to be within because of how long it takes for that particular compound to stabilize.

So the popular mindset is, OH! I'm taking an AI, therefore it must be prolactin !!

In some cases it could be, but I haven't lactated since back in my M1T days, now THAT was prolactin for sure !

We must continue to stress the importance of getting blood tests done, because why treat something that doesn't need treatment? Spend the money to get the tests, and you may end up saving yourself some money and from trashing your lipids by taking something you don't need.

JMO :)
 
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Sex drive/libido is a complex process. Over the years I have read a ton of info on it and have consulted various doctors from HRT specialists to Urologists. Most docs will want to see your Free T, E2 and Prolactin levels and look at them as a whole not individually. I advise a high Free T to E2 ratio. Basically you need Free T in the upper end of the range and E2 in the lower end of the range for men. (10pg/ml-30pg/ml E2). Very low E2 may also lower sex drive so don't crush E2. Once the Free T to E2 ratio is dialed in, normal to high sex drive will resume pretty quick however if Prolactin is high men will have trouble finishing or getting an erection. So lowering Prolactin is the next solution.

Sometimes the problem is not hormonal. It may also be mechanical.

When a man is aroused, nerve signals are sent from the brain and around the penis. These nerve signals cause chemicals to be released that relax the muscles in the penis. Normally, these muscles are constricted so that blood cannot flow into the penis. When these muscles relax, large amounts of blood are able to enter the penis, causing an erection. An erection is reversed when another chemical (known as phosphodiesterase type 5 [PDE5]) breaks down the chemicals that caused the muscles to relax in the first place. This causes the muscles in the penis to constrict again as blood leaves the penis.

When PDE5 is blocked, more of the chemicals responsible for the erection remain, so the muscles in the penis do not constrict. This allows blood to stay in the penis longer, which allows the man to maintain an erection.

Cialis is an excellent PDE5 blocker.

Testosterone will raise T, an AI will keep Free T high and E2 controlled, Prami or Caber will control Prolactin and Cialis will will block PDE5.

Bottom line is, get labs.
 
To really give us a real "head's up" on this issue, I truly believe that photos would be an absolute "KEY" in this matter.

:nerd:
This is indeed very serious, all the more reason for some before and after and then comparisons with those on it and not. Then "eye candy" is available as well, and we'll all get a better understanding.

don't you think?:hmmm:
 
To really give us a real "head's up" on this issue, I truly believe that photos would be an absolute "KEY" in this matter.

:nerd:
This is indeed very serious, all the more reason for some before and after and then comparisons with those on it and not. Then "eye candy" is available as well, and we'll all get a better understanding.

don't you think?:hmmm:

:roflmao:

And I thought only guys were pigs
 
I have thought about this too. In the arcuate nucleus of the brain there are a series of dopaminanergic neurons that run the distance to the between the hypothalamus and the pituitary. These neurons have progesterone receptors and when activated by progestins decrease dopamine secretion. This is what happens after achieving orgasm. There is a localized lull in dopamine signaling leading to a deficit at D2 receptors in the hypothalamus leading to secretion of prolactin via the hypophyseal portal vessels to the pituitary. After sexual activity this leads to satis and a refractory period before sexual activity can begin again. I suspect the chronic presence of nandrolone, a progestin, in the brain causes a low level of signaling through these neuron's progesterone receptor leading to various levels of sexual dysfunction depending on the user. This is basic neurobiology of the brain. I may be able to link an online text book. This does not get directly to the point but the basic neurobiology can be found here and a description of prolactinoma, which in some ways may mimic the nandrolone situation albeit with different mechanism and level of prolactin.

The pituitary gland - Endocrinology - NCBI Bookshelf
 
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