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ReproMan said:
Hell yeah, nice vid! Here is it:

YouTube Video


After watching Jacare vs. Lindland, I can't help but think he'd steamroll Maia in a cage and I'm a huge Maia fan.
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jacare if the fight with lindland is anything to go by has far superior striking to maia. not to be too harsh but Maia's striking is laughable at points.

damm i meant to put the lesnar stuff up good to see hes alright. means i can watch and support everyone he fights again.
 
repro man .... how you doing again??? your holding it down.sweeet hello mma lover's ..im a ujhria faber fan..lol but really a huge fan of who ever can fuckin fight...get em diaz...
 
I guess the only thing I am going to respond about in tonight's recap is that I am ashamed of the Sonnen winning fight.

I have never been a fan of any blanket strategy and I wont start now. Taking a guy to the ground and holding him there for minutes til the bell rings is no champ, no fighter, no fucking way an entertainer. This is a guy who wants to wrestle and because of the rules, knows how to work it to his favor.

"Well Nate couldnt defend the takedown attempts." Yeah, sure, I agree, but maybe he thought, fuck it, THE REFEREE WILL STAND US UP CUZ ILL MAKE SURE HE POSES NO THREAT. No sense, wishing for that. (God I miss Pride) Its a silly game plan, I know. I was yelling at the tv hoping Nate could hear me that i wanted him to try SOME sub attempts! But none surfaced. Maybe he was too slippery, didnt have enough knowledge, didnt think it could happen, but bottom line, I saw no progress in Sonnens game. All I saw was someone pitter pattering on someones face.

Ah well! Now Middle Weight is at an all time enthusiastic stand still after the Silva/Vitor fight.
 
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AKIRA said:
I guess the only thing I am going to respond about in tonight's recap is that I am ashamed of the Sonnen winning fight.

I have never been a fan of any blanket strategy and I wont start now. Taking a guy to the ground and holding him there for minutes til the bell rings is no champ, no fighter, no fucking way an entertainer. This is a guy who wants to wrestle and because of the rules, knows how to work it to his favor.

"Well Nate couldnt defend the takedown attempts." Yeah, sure, I agree, but maybe he thought, fuck it, THE REFEREE WILL STAND US UP CUZ ILL MAKE SURE HE POSES NO THREAT. No sense, wishing for that. (God I miss Pride) Its a silly game plan, I know. I was yelling at the tv hoping Nate could hear me that i wanted him to try SOME sub attempts! But none surfaced. Maybe he was too slippery, didnt have enough knowledge, didnt think it could happen, but bottom line, I saw no progress in Sonnens game. All I saw was someone pitter pattering on someones face.

Ah well! Now Middle Weight is at an all time enthusiastic stand still after the Silva/Vitor fight.
Click to expand...

I don't know dude.. I thought it was a pretty serious, extremely impressive, ass kicking. I mean, nobody has handled Marquardt like that, evar.

Sonnen-Marquardt

Sonnen took him down numerous times, dominated him positionally and outstruck Nate 214-37. Nate was widely considered the #2 middleweight in the world before this fight. Hugely impressive win for Sonnen.


aaaaand it got fight of the night:

UFC 109 bonuses and awards for 'Relentless' PPV fights - MMA Mania
 
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AKIRA said:
I guess the only thing I am going to respond about in tonight's recap is that I am ashamed of the Sonnen winning fight.

I have never been a fan of any blanket strategy and I wont start now. Taking a guy to the ground and holding him there for minutes til the bell rings is no champ, no fighter, no fucking way an entertainer. This is a guy who wants to wrestle and because of the rules, knows how to work it to his favor.

"Well Nate couldnt defend the takedown attempts." Yeah, sure, I agree, but maybe he thought, fuck it, THE REFEREE WILL STAND US UP CUZ ILL MAKE SURE HE POSES NO THREAT. No sense, wishing for that. (God I miss Pride) Its a silly game plan, I know. I was yelling at the tv hoping Nate could hear me that i wanted him to try SOME sub attempts! But none surfaced. Maybe he was too slippery, didnt have enough knowledge, didnt think it could happen, but bottom line, I saw no progress in Sonnens game. All I saw was someone pitter pattering on someones face.

Ah well! Now Middle Weight is at an all time enthusiastic stand still after the Silva/Vitor fight.
Click to expand...

all with u mate I dont like the take down and just hold him down, dont even think 25% of his ground strikes were seriously worth anything other than looking busy.

but in his defence thats what mma is all about u can bring a style to the cage and if your opponent can do nothing about it you win. i must say though i think takedowns get to much credit.

rolles gracie was a bit of a let down aswell
 
Despite the fact that a lot of people don't like Sonnen and a lot of people wanted to Nate to win you can't say that Sonnen layed and prayed his way to a decision at all. He didn't wrestle the way Rashad did against Thiago or Guida did in every fight he ever won.

What I saw from Sonnen was a clinical display of ground and pound and a lot of heart. Personally I think the style match up of Sonnen vs. Sylva (Assuming Sylva makes it past Belfort which is by no means guaranteed) presents a better fight than Nate Silva 2. I personally think that Sylva was going to hand Nate his ass again.

Is Nate guilty of looking past Sonnen to Sylva? That is entirely possible, and if so then the fact that he got beat down is the risk you take when you don't take anyone seriously in the top flight of any division of the UFC.

Regardless however; I agree that people who lay and pray their way to decision victories make for boring fights that suck the life out of a card, but even if you weren't to score the take-downs as heavily as they are currently Sonnen still whooped Nate's ass. He outstruck him, he outworked him and other than two sub attempts, a single elbow and a single knee Nate wasn't in the fight for anything more than 1 out of 15 minutes.

Assuming Nate bounces back from this loss the best thing that can happen for him is for Sonnen to beat the winner of Belfort/Sylva as in all likelyhood (In the exception of a Machida/Shogun-esque decision) he will be the logical #1 challenger at that stage, and I think given what he learned on the weekend he will show up a different Nate.

Plus he has 100% more of a chance to beat Sonnen in a rematch than he does Sylva, stylistically he doesn't pose too many threats to Sylva where as Sonnen does.

Sonnen just better be working on his submission defense or else I see Sylva tapping him out.
 
I think you guys watched a different fight than everyone else. He did anything but simply hold Nate down. He beat Nate up so bad in rounds one and 2 he got a standing ovation at the end of both and both fighters got a standing ovation at the end. Every strike he threw had bad intentions behind it and the fight was so action packed, it won fight of the night. I thought it was extremely entertaining.
 
And then there was WEC matches going to pay-per -view... waaa waaa ,....
 
Vance said:
Despite the fact that a lot of people don't like Sonnen and a lot of people wanted to Nate to win you can't say that Sonnen layed and prayed his way to a decision at all. He didn't wrestle the way Rashad did against Thiago or Guida did in every fight he ever won.

What I saw from Sonnen was a clinical display of ground and pound and a lot of heart. Personally I think the style match up of Sonnen vs. Sylva (Assuming Sylva makes it past Belfort which is by no means guaranteed) presents a better fight than Nate Silva 2. I personally think that Sylva was going to hand Nate his ass again.

Is Nate guilty of looking past Sonnen to Sylva? That is entirely possible, and if so then the fact that he got beat down is the risk you take when you don't take anyone seriously in the top flight of any division of the UFC.

Regardless however; I agree that people who lay and pray their way to decision victories make for boring fights that suck the life out of a card, but even if you weren't to score the take-downs as heavily as they are currently Sonnen still whooped Nate's ass. He outstruck him, he outworked him and other than two sub attempts, a single elbow and a single knee Nate wasn't in the fight for anything more than 1 out of 15 minutes.

Assuming Nate bounces back from this loss the best thing that can happen for him is for Sonnen to beat the winner of Belfort/Sylva as in all likelyhood (In the exception of a Machida/Shogun-esque decision) he will be the logical #1 challenger at that stage, and I think given what he learned on the weekend he will show up a different Nate.

Plus he has 100% more of a chance to beat Sonnen in a rematch than he does Sylva, stylistically he doesn't pose too many threats to Sylva where as Sonnen does.

Sonnen just better be working on his submission defense or else I see Sylva tapping him out.
Click to expand...

Now after watching the fight for the second time sober, I still wasnt that entertained. This goes back to where I stand on being entertained vs. being a fan.

I honestly like Sonnen. I liked him during his WEC reign. However, yeah, I am going to say he was laying and praying. Errr, actively laying and praying if there ever will be a term. Reasons I say that are the latter...

He literally did not lay on the guy and wait. Thats not what laying and praying is to me. Laying and praying to me is getting on top and doing just enough to merit a reason to hold the position and not being stood up by the ref. He didnt win by TKO or a KO, so his punches werent "in bunches" nor powerful enough. He didnt submit him or try to get to where he could. He won by a decision, which by my definition, is a laying and praying accomplishment. This is why I found it boring.

The only time I got interested and from the roar of the crowd, I am not alone, was when Nate did his sub attempts or when they stood up. Wait, they did cheer for the cut too.

Speaking of those subs.. The first Guillotine had an arm in, so I expected him to get out. The Kimura was against the cage, so I can see the escape. The final Guillotine was an impressive escape. One could argue and say he was slippery, but I am really not going to take that away. These were the only times I was excited.

The elbow from the bottom was a nice touch.

I cant only poke fun at Sonnen, even though he has 14 wins by decision :yawn: I thought the entire night blew. Too many decisions and lack luster fights. 2 were good, the rest were a bore.
 
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AKIRA said:
The only time I got interested and from the roar of the crowd, I am not alone, was when Nate did his sub attempts or when they stood up. Wait, they did cheer for the cut too.
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I think the audio might be bad on the video you're watching. The fans went crazy after the completion of the first round and every time Sonnen landed a huge strike. I was actually surprised that Sonnen was getting that warm of an ovation, thinking most people would see it as you are describing it and thank god they didn't. That was an awesome fight, Sonnen literally kicked ass, and it was well deserving of FOTN. You won't see Dana hand out a FOTN award to a fight the fans didn't go crazy for.

compu-sonnen_medium.jpg


Utter domination.
 
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My audio isnt working? Then what am I hearing at 2:35, 2:33? I hear the crowd cheer for Chael @1:31-1:21 in the 1st Round.

Round 2, I hear the crowd cheer for the takedown..then hardly a peep until Nate elbows Chael from behind. This isnt the cut. And then crowd livens up again @ :40 when Nate gets up. Chael gets him back down, but guess what, hardly a reaction from the crowd.

In round 3 I hear a dull roar from the crowd at Chaels first takedown. To me, thats a audience that has already seen this. Shit, Chael almost passes guard after Nate got up to be quickly taken down again @ 2:55 and the crowd hardly reacts. He even gets some hits in and they dont care. However at 2:00, Nate gets to his feet and they sure as shit wake up..they even verbally respond to Nates knee @ 1:54. But @ 1:50 the crowd does go wild at Nates sub attempt. When Chael gets out, the crowd I hear is a disappointed crowd. Like I said, it was a good escape. I know Joe was excited though, but I wont be swayed by commentators. It was close and exciting. Thank you Nate.

Chael doesnt do much but is sweeped and Nate excites the crowd again from :56 on.

Obviously, this is just a defense to the no audio pun. Nate couldve gotten on top and had been just as boring. The truth is, my audio does work and in between those notable time selections, I was just bored. Perhaps others were not. They need not more than what they got to be entertained. I do. :shrug:

I dont really follow FightMetric or any other predictors cuz they all said Serra would lose against St. Pierre.

In any case does this one Silva-Leites mean anything? Sure, it means Silva won. Was it entertaining? No. But, I dont need that site to tell me that.
 
AKIRA said:
My audio isnt working? Then what am I hearing at 2:35, 2:33? I hear the crowd cheer for Chael @1:31-1:21 in the 1st Round.

Round 2, I hear the crowd cheer for the takedown..then hardly a peep until Nate elbows Chael from behind. This isnt the cut. And then crowd livens up again @ :40 when Nate gets up. Chael gets him back down, but guess what, hardly a reaction from the crowd.

In round 3 I hear a dull roar from the crowd at Chaels first takedown. To me, thats a audience that has already seen this. Shit, Chael almost passes guard after Nate got up to be quickly taken down again @ 2:55 and the crowd hardly reacts. He even gets some hits in and they dont care. However at 2:00, Nate gets to his feet and they sure as shit wake up..they even verbally respond to Nates knee @ 1:54. But @ 1:50 the crowd does go wild at Nates sub attempt. When Chael gets out, the crowd I hear is a disappointed crowd. Like I said, it was a good escape. I know Joe was excited though, but I wont be swayed by commentators. It was close and exciting. Thank you Nate.

Chael doesnt do much but is sweeped and Nate excites the crowd again from :56 on.

Obviously, this is just a defense to the no audio pun. Nate couldve gotten on top and had been just as boring. The truth is, my audio does work and in between those notable time selections, I was just bored. Perhaps others were not. They need not more than what they got to be entertained. I do. :shrug:

I dont really follow FightMetric or any other predictors cuz they all said Serra would lose against St. Pierre.

In any case does this one Silva-Leites mean anything? Sure, it means Silva won. Was it entertaining? No. But, I dont need that site to tell me that.
Click to expand...

Silva-Leites was a completely different kind of fight in which little to no damage was inflicted. On top of that, it was a 5 round fight in which Silva and Leites combined threw less than 1/2 the strikes Chael threw in a 3 round fight by himself. I fail to see the correlation. Chael beat the shit out of Nate and Nate was fighting for his life until the very end. Simply throwing over 200 strikes in a 3 round fight is impressive let alone landing more than 150 of them.

Look, I understand you didn't like the fight and it didn't go the way you wanted, but in no way shape or form was that a slow-paced, action-less fight. It had everything, huge takedowns, vicious GnP, near submissions, huge cuts gushing blood all over the place. Hands down the most action-packed fight on the card and the crowd's ovation at the conclusion of the each of the rounds and the huge ovation they gave Chael when his hand was raised at the end certainly tells that same story. And once again, it was fight of the night.
 
Personally I thought it was clearly FOTN - albeit I feel that the rest of the card basically sucked balls. Not exactly Sanchez vs. Guida on the action stakes but definitely incomparible to the Silva Leites fight.

I understand the complaint about the way wrestlers fight negatively and why lay and pray sucks balls dude, I have said the same thing a number of times. After the Evans Thiago fight I didn't shut up about it for like 4 hours because ALL Rashad did was lay and pray for the entire fight. At two stages of over 2 minutes in that fight Rashad literally just lay on top of Thiago and the ref didn't stand them up FFS - see I'm still shitty about it.

That said without Nate getting KTFO I don't see *how* Sonnen could've been more aggressive and active from the top than he was.
 
Vance said:
Personally I thought it was clearly FOTN - albeit I feel that the rest of the card basically sucked balls. Not exactly Sanchez vs. Guida on the action stakes but definitely incomparible to the Silva Leites fight.

I understand the complaint about the way wrestlers fight negatively and why lay and pray sucks balls dude, I have said the same thing a number of times. After the Evans Thiago fight I didn't shut up about it for like 4 hours because ALL Rashad did was lay and pray for the entire fight. At two stages of over 2 minutes in that fight Rashad literally just lay on top of Thiago and the ref didn't stand them up FFS - see I'm still shitty about it.

That said without Nate getting KTFO I don't see *how* Sonnen could've been more aggressive and active from the top than he was.
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I agree 100%. I'm just as critical of LnP as the next guy.. when it happens.
 
There isnt much more to say on the basis on who thought it was exciting and who didnt. Its opinion.

I suppose I say this was a lay n pray because of the idea that even though Nate was being pummeled, he wasnt fading. I almost wouldnt say that cuz it showed in the 3rd round when he wobbled. Thankfully, biased Rogan saw it too. However, when Nate got on top, he looked energized. Buuuut you can say anyone wouldve been like that cuz it was finally a dominant position.

I say Lay n Pray on this one because the only person really trying to finish the fight was Nate. The loser. Chael did continue his strikes, but every connected strike seemed at the same caliber. One didnt really stick out over the other. Good elbows sure, but Nate kept fighting. According to that "dominant" chart, more of the powerful strikes came from Nate. Nate was also the one who had submission numbers. These are what finish fights most of the time and thats what entertains me. Shit, Nate even cut Chael and that couldve been a show stopper. Though that wouldve been a cheap move if it was deliberate, but youre talking to a guy who also doesnt agree on half of the TKOs.

I suppose I didnt give a shit about Chaels performance because it had no where to go. He literally laid on Nate and prayed that these strikes would suffice.

His prayers were answered. :lol:
 
AKIRA said:
There isnt much more to say on the basis on who thought it was exciting and who didnt. Its opinion.

I suppose I say this was a lay n pray because of the idea that even though Nate was being pummeled, he wasnt fading. I almost wouldnt say that cuz it showed in the 3rd round when he wobbled. Thankfully, biased Rogan saw it too. However, when Nate got on top, he looked energized. Buuuut you can say anyone wouldve been like that cuz it was finally a dominant position.

I say Lay n Pray on this one because the only person really trying to finish the fight was Nate. The loser. Chael did continue his strikes, but every connected strike seemed at the same caliber. One didnt really stick out over the other. Good elbows sure, but Nate kept fighting. According to that "dominant" chart, more of the powerful strikes came from Nate. Nate was also the one who had submission numbers. These are what finish fights most of the time and thats what entertains me. Shit, Nate even cut Chael and that couldve been a show stopper. Though that wouldve been a cheap move if it was deliberate, but youre talking to a guy who also doesnt agree on half of the TKOs.

I suppose I didnt give a shit about Chaels performance because it had no where to go. He literally laid on Nate and prayed that these strikes would suffice.

His prayers were answered. :lol:
Click to expand...

We've agreed to disagree about the "exciting" part, but we don't agree with the "lay and pray" moniker because it's not a matter of opinion, it's a fucking fact. Lay and Pray alludes to the fact that the top fighter is not being active, not striking, and not looking to improve his position. The perfect example of that was Vance's and the Evans/Silva fight. Evans used effective grappling to neutralize Silva, inflicting little to no damage and scoring points solely on takedowns. Chael on the other hand scored points with takedowns, guard passes and pummeling Nate's fucking face into the mat for 15 minutes to the tune of 150 punches, elbows, forearms and hammerfists. If this was a PRIDE fight, Nate would have been the one to get the yellow card for stalling. He did absolute dick from his back for 14 of the 15 minutes they fought, yet you can sit here with a straight face and say Nate was the only one trying to finish the fight? Nate was completely outclassed and dominated in this fight and he'd be the first one to tell you that. So really, it's Nate you should be blaming for not being entertained.
 
Nate didnt know how to get back up, I admit, but he did what he could there.

Ive been searching and searching for damage pics of Chael and Nate post fight but all Ive found were Chaels fucked up face.

A fucked up face for a guy doing all the ground and pounding?! :scratch: Yet Nate was the more boring one..? :scratch:
 
AKIRA said:
Nate didnt know how to get back up, I admit, but he did what he could there.

Ive been searching and searching for damage pics of Chael and Nate post fight but all Ive found were Chaels fucked up face.

A fucked up face for a guy doing all the ground and pounding?! :scratch: Yet Nate was the more boring one..? :scratch:
Click to expand...

It was one strike that cut Chael's face open. One. Thank God fights are judged by what actually happens in the ring for 15 minutes, and not by what the crowd cheers for and what the fighter's faces looks like.
 
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