Please Repost this Everywhere til We Are Heard:

[min0 lee]

Hmmmm..

According to Wisconsin law, voters can recall any elected official in the state, as long as they've been in office for at least a year. This process involves collecting signatures for a recall position and then holding an election with the incumbent against any other candidates who jump in. There are eight Republicans who could currently be recalled.Walker just took office in 2011 and therefore is not eligible to go through the process yet.

That would be unions only hope.

 

[irish_2003]

Hmmmm..
That would be unions only hope.

yes, but the voters already spoke and from the many many pages of points and counterpoints i've read and been involved with today and this last week, the democrats did alot of damage to their party......the local news nbc (who's a liberal media) has even stated the same......

there is also some evidence that shows how most protestors don't vote ever.....there are many different variables that will come into play the next few days......both sides should be preparing for anything

 

[min0 lee]

yes, but for public schools it's a requirement currently, state workers also, as well as any company with an existing union....the state currently also gets a portion of those fees from the union....that's one of the big misconceptions or points people are ignoring....basically in the bill it's removing the gov't/union relationship....meaning one can't have the other in it's pocket......Obama showed his true colors (but we already knew) by funding the unions fight this last week against the bill.....that should never happen at any level of government......it's almost my bedtime....plus i have classes this week since my tech school isn't a state school it's not been called off

Ok now I see here where your saying you are being forced to become a union worker but that doesn't make sense. What is wrong with making a decent wage?

I left Motorola after 22 years to move into a union job, why? It wasn't because of the money....in fact I took a $4 pay cut.
I did it because it was destroying our marraige and it was just too stressful, every time around Christmas we had to watch our backs and wait to see who was fired next...that's no way to live.
Every year they fucked around with our health benefits while constantly raising our rates, then they messed with our sick time and took it away.
We couldn't complain really because the last person who went to the labor department was treated like shit till she broke down and left.

I held off for years in buying a house because I never felt secure.

Being forced to join a Union? That doesn't make sense.

 

[min0 lee]

Obama is Pro-union....the majority of union members voted him in much like the Police union voted for Walker which they now regret.

 

[irish_2003]

it's one of those things that if there is an exhisting union to keep your job you have to join it if hired in.....not every company has a union....in fact the numbers have dropped here too, but if there is a union and you're hired in you currently have to join and pay dues at that company for that union.....

also another point in the bill that people are misreading is the cuts in our states Badgercare program (medical assistance).....the cuts are integrated as a person is reintroduced into the workforce....meaning no extended free rides and abusing the taxpayer funded health system....i'm not sure but i think there are also plans to cap our states food stamp and welfare programs the same way....this is to cut down those who are abusing the systems and aren't taking steps to try to work or improve their lives......at one point wisconsin paid out the highest welfare payments in the nation......many families would purposely move from the chicago ghettos to just across the border and take advantage of our states programs...unfortunately it got out of control in the 80s and 90s but has diminished somewhat over the last 10 years....

 

[min0 lee]

For those keeping score:

Giving money to large companies: OK
Giving money to individual Americans: Socialism

 

[min0 lee]

it's one of those things that if there is an exhisting union to keep your job you have to join it if hired in.....not every company has a union....in fact the numbers have dropped here too, but if there is a union and you're hired in you currently have to join and pay dues at that company for that union.....

We know this, we both pay our Union dues. But we also pay into our health benefits, years ago our union didn't.

also another point in the bill that people are misreading is the cuts in our states Badgercare program (medical assistance).....the cuts are integrated as a person is reintroduced into the workforce....meaning no extended free rides and abusing the
taxpayer funded health system....i'm not sure but i think there are also plans to cap our states food stamp and welfare programs the same way....this is to cut down those who are abusing the systems and aren't taking steps to try to work or improve their lives......at one point wisconsin paid out the highest welfare payments in the nation......many families would purposely move from the chicago ghettos to just across the border and take advantage of our states programs...unfortunately it got out of control in the 80s and 90s but has diminished somewhat over the last 10 years....

Interesting.

 

[min0 lee]

The Bill
for those interested.

 

[min0 lee]

http://motherjones.com/mojo/2011/02/wisconsin-firefighters-give-pay-union-video

Wisconsin Firefighters: We'll Give Up Pay to Save Collective Bargaining (Video)

MJ reporter Andy Kroll has been working on the ground in Madison, Wisconsin, with media colleagues from the Uptake to collect the latest on the ongoing labor dispute there. Just a few hours ago, Uptake's Oliver Dykstra scored an interview in the capitol with Mahlon Mitchell, president of the Professional Firefighters of Wisconsin, who pledged solidarity with his fellow state workers, even though firefighters and police were spared from Gov. Scott Walker's attempt to bust state unions' bargaining power. Among Mitchell's pledges: The state's safety workers would agree to forgo some of their privileges and benefits to preserve collective bargaining for all the state's union workers. "We have a unique job," he said, "but so does the snow-plow driver, so does the janitor, so does a nurse, so does a teacher at UW college.

Full video is below. Highlights:

• 
  "The reason that we are here is because it's important that labor sticks together. There was a message from the governor's office to conquer and divide...collective bargaining is not just for us, police and fire, it's good for all involved. It's a middle-class upbringing."

• "When firefighters see an emergency, one thing we do is respond. And we see an emergency in the house of labor, so that's why we're here."

• "Every day, if you notice, we lead the AFSCME employees, the SEIU employees, all the public sector employees into the building, because we are here to fight with them."

• "Collective bargaining is not about union rights; it's about rights of workers...We ask Gov. Walker to come back and negotiate with the people, negotiatie with the state workers' unions, and get things worked out, as opposed to just putting out this bill and we don't hear from him again."

• "Us as firefighters, we have been exempted from this bill...There's a 5.8 percent pay into the pension, there's a 12.4 percent pay into the health care premium benefits...For the betterment of the government, for the betterment of the state, we don't mind helping to pay for that. We don't want to price ourselves out of a job. Ever. What we want to do is have a fair and equitable treatment among our members."

http://www.livestream.com/theuptake/video?clipId=pla_82b3c1a3-8e6e-4684-ba81-e9bcb3847083

 

[min0 lee]

Please tell me when was the last time some asshole pussy at Citigroup or any other bank that had an actual hand in causing most of the current financial problems we're havinggave up their own pay to help others out.
Please tell me.

This thread needs more bag pipes.

 

[min0 lee]

 

[LAM]

many families would purposely move from the chicago ghettos to just across the border and take advantage of our states programs...unfortunately it got out of control in the 80s and 90s but has diminished somewhat over the last 10 years....

and this is based on what data? poor people with "extra" money to move? really?

 

[min0 lee]

Walker lost the cops.

 

[irish_2003]

and this is based on what data? poor people with "extra" money to move? really?

the rich don't keep the poor poor.....the poor keep themselves poor......many need and deserve a "hand up", but unfortunately the mentality has turned into a "handout" instead.......


btw, Rage Against the Machine is performing at the Capitol......

 

[Dale Mabry]

Walker lost the cops.

Socialists

 

[LAM]

the rich don't keep the poor poor.....the poor keep themselves poor......

really? name one "society" in world history where there wasn't a percentage of the population that was economically depressed or poor?

another 4million people in the US that just feel below the poverty level in recent years and you say this is intentional?

 

[min0 lee]

Socialists

Hater.

 

[min0 lee]

btw, Rage Against the Machine is performing at the Capitol......

This is only for the protesters so please use earplugs while they play.

Guitarist Tom Morello of Rage Against the Machine planned to play for the remaining protesters a day after Walker signaled no retreat on the measure. Supporters call the bill vital, but opponents label it union-busting.
Fifth day of Wisconsin protests Thousands protest Wisconsin budget cuts Wisconsin businessman avoids chaos Teachers in upstate NY take pay freeze

"History is happening in the streets of Madison, Wisconsin and I'm going to be there," said a statement by Morello, who will perform in his solo identity as The Nightwatchman.
Calling the proposed budget law "unjust," Morello said he will join "teachers, students, firefighters, policemen, Green Bay Packers, nurses, steel workers, construction workers and religious groups that are filling the streets to protest."
He referred to Walker as "the Mubarak of the Midwest" in reference to the Egyptian leader ousted by popular protest, and accused the governor and unnamed corporate allies of trying to "rob American workers of their fundamental rights."

 

[min0 lee]

Wisconsin, Ohio public employees are not overpaid
byMeteor BladesforDaily Kos
Share674 70
PERMALINK 86 COMMENTS
Contrary to conventional wisdom that public employees across our nation are collecting bigger paychecks than their counterparts in the private sector, the Economic Policy Institute has found quite the contrary. That's true in Wisconsin and Ohio, which have become the latest battle fronts in the right-wing's 65-year-long effort to gut the legal collective bargaining rights of Americans that were established after decades of bloody struggle during the New Deal.

In Wisconsin, which has become a focal point in this debate, public servants already take a pretty hefty pay cut just for the opportunity to serve their communities ... The figure below shows that when comparing the total compensation (which includes non-wage benefits such as health care and pensions) of workers with similar education, public-sector workers consistently make less than their private–sector peers. Workers with a bachelor’s degree or more—which constitute nearly 60% of the state and local workforce in Wisconsin—are compensated between $20,000 less (if they just have a bachelor’s degree) to over $82,000 a year less (if they have a professional degree, such as in law or medicine).
Here are the figures broken down by education, as evaluated by EPI.

The deficit that Wisconsin faces is caused by the current economic downturn and the recent tax cut package. It has nothing to do with the compensation of the people that educate our children, keep the streets safe and clean, keep dangerous chemicals out of our water, and keep insurance companies from taking advantage of us. These public servants are already paid less than those in the private sector, and nationally, this gap has actually been increasing over the past few decades ...
The situation in Ohio is quite similar. In a "rigorous analysis" of full-time state and local government workers in Ohio, EPI found that they are undercompensated by 6 percent. The analysts screened for variables including hours of work, organizational size, gender, race, ethnicity, experience, citizenship and disability.

Among EPI's findings:

• On an annual basis, full‐time state and local workers and school employees are undercompensated by 6.0% in Ohio, in comparison with otherwise similar private‐sector workers. When comparisons are made for differences in annual hours worked, the gap remains, albeit at a smaller percentage of 3.5%.
• Ohio public‐sector workers are more highly educated than private‐sector workers; 49% of full‐ time public‐sector workers hold at least a four‐year college degree, compared with 26% in the private‐sector.

• Ohio’s state and local governments and school districts pay college‐educated workers 25% less in total compensation, on average, than private employers.

• In addition to having higher education levels, Ohio state and local government employees, on average, are also more experienced (23.2 years) than their private‐sector counterparts (21.7 years).

While some of the effects of the Great Recession have had a delayed impact on public employees, that impact is being felt big time now. Tens of thousands of lay-offs, furlough days, pay freezes and pay-cuts, and a continuing assault on public employees' health benefits (something that has been going on through premium raises and cuts in coverage for years) are all part of the damage being done.

While the likes of renowned liar and Andrew Breitbart pretends to be a friend of the little guy who he claims is being gouged by public workers such as those in Wisconsin and Ohio, the truth is that the efforts now being carried out are a culmination of the long-standing attacks against the whole concept of unions. Breitbart, Rush Limbaugh and the governors are mere mouthpieces for an oligarchy feeling its oats and viewing the current situation as another opportunity to weaken the resistance to their agenda. One word, one attitude should describe the progressive agenda at this critical moment. It's a word and attitude we've seen revived in the past few days after a long dormancy: Solidarity!

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/02/21/947132/-Wisconsin,-Ohio-public-employees-are-not-overpaid

 

[DOMS]

I need to note that when it comes to comparing how "much" an employee makes, it's so very, very easy to get the numbers to say whatever you want.

For example, do those numbers cover the cost/benefit of health insurance? Retirement?

The vast majority of numbers relating to employee compensation are crap. Bear in mind that what I'm saying isn't in relation to the whole union issue, just a general statement.

 

[min0 lee]

I need to note that when it comes to comparing how "much" an employee makes, it's so very, very easy to get the numbers to say whatever you want.

For example, do those numbers cover the cost/benefit of health insurance? Retirement?

The vast majority of numbers relating to employee compensation are crap. Bear in mind that what I'm saying isn't in relation to the whole union issue, just a general statement.

Some private companies give out bonuses, profit sharing.
We don't get that and we do pay into our health benefits.
I definitely could make more in the private sector but with little or no benefits nor job security.

 

[min0 lee]

Our engineers make crap....we don't attract the best engineers which is a big problem.

 

[min0 lee]

Busted!!

Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel's story on the phone call. Walker is caught on tape accepting future compensation from (who he thinks is) David Kock for breaking the unions.

State Senator Tim Carpenter calls for Gov Walker to resign over Koch block.

G

overnor Scott Walker
Wisconsin State Capitol
Dear Governor Walker,
I am informed that a tape recording has been released in which you apparently held an
extensive discussion with someone you believed to be your campaign supporter, David
Koch. The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel states that the caller was actually a reporter,
pretending to be David Koch, and it has posted a transcript of the recording. It appears
that you admit the call occurred, and have not contested the authenticity of transcript.
David Koch is the billionaire businessman who reportedly contributed thousands to your
campaign and who the media claims is a key source of funding for shadowy political
groups that spend hundreds of thousands of dollars attacking your political adversaries in
our state.
At a historic moment in our State???s history, brought on by your refusal to compromise
with elected officials regarding the elimination of worker???s rights, you still refuse to talk
with Democratic legislators. However, you apparently have no problem taking a phone
call from ???Mr. Koch??? and to:
??? Discuss your strategy to lay off public workers to seek partisan advantage to pass
your agenda;
??? Discuss your plan to lure Democratic legislators to the Capitol on the pretext of
negotiation, but then state that you would never actually negotiate;
??? Discuss your plan to use the pretext of negotiation to get a quorum for legislative
fiscal action that Republicans so far have not been able to do;
??? Discuss that you considered the ???planting??? of paid troublemakers into the
peaceful protests at our Capitol; and to
??? Give your enthusiastic acceptance to an offer from ???Koch??? to fly you out on a
vacation to show you a ???good time??? once you ???crush these bastards.??? Your
response was ???That would be outstanding?????? Given that Koch???s businesses could
reap vast rewards with the ???no bid??? sale of the Wisconsin???s power plants that you
propose in your budget repair bill, this response is severely troubling

Governor Walker, this tape would make Richard Nixon blush. If the recording and the
items discussed by you are indeed your plans, you have no business being in public office
in our State, and should resign.
Sincerely,
Tim Carpenter
State Senator

 

[min0 lee]

Just a junior middle manager reporting to his superior.

 

[LAM]

Just a junior middle manager reporting to his superior.

so the Gov of Wis thought he was actually talking to the GOP pupper master David Koch...the same person seen talking and palling around with our new Speaker of the House on the steps of the Capital the day he was sworn in into office...

 

[Dale Mabry]

It was on the daily show last night, pretty funny.

 

[min0 lee]

He reminds me of that character from trading places.

 

[min0 lee]

Hope he ends up like this...

 

[min0 lee]

Wis. Senate GOP Leader's Wife Gets School Layoff Notice

MADISON, WI -- The threatened wave of layoffs of public employees -- which Republican Gov. Scott Walker has said will occur if his budget bill does not pass with its anti-public employee union provisions -- is now hitting home with a top Republican leader. As the Associated Press reports, the wife of state Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald has now received a preliminary layoff notice.

Lisa Fitzgerald works as a counselor in the Hustisford school district, where the school board has sent layoff notices to all 34 members of the teaching staff.

Superintendent Jeremy Biehl told the AP that the board is following the advice of the Wisconsin Association of School Boards Preliminary notices are just the first step in the state's layoff processes. State law requires preliminary notices at least 15 days before the final notices, which in turn must be provided by March 15.

 

[Bowden]

would this be the 250+ companies on the S&P 500 sitting on 2T worth of capital that have reported record gains this year?

the same companies that have laid people off, reduced capital spending by 44%.

the same companies not giving employees cost of inflation wage increases

you mean these companies...that need a tax break

Yeah,
The same companies whose shareholders are paying a 15% tax rate on dividends and capital gains.