post workout sequence

[hardasnails1973]

2 hours prior
1 can tuna fish
6 eggwhites
4 mass /4 liver tabs

sip during workout in grape keto cooler
20 grams BCAAS
10 gram glutemine

after workout
v 12 with 500 mgs ALA

wait 15 minutes
2 serving mass maker 1 scoop muscle provider
10 grams glutemine

wait and hour
6 oz chicken, 3/4 cup oatmeal dry or 6 oz yam

3 hours
6 oz turkey burger (93 % ff)
1 tsp flax
veggies

let me know what you think

 

[fluffy]

why no carbs 2 hours prior?

 

[Twin Peak]

I like it.

Only thing I would add is Vendetta (EAA and some carbs)immediately prior.

Also ICE is BCAA and glut, so you might want to just get that (very high quality).

Only thing I would subtract is the extra glut post workout, unnecessary, IMO.

 

[hardasnails1973]

looks like good product but i have to take it easy on budget LOL

 

[Twin Peak]

Gotcha. Where do you get quality BCAAs that are cheaper?

 

[hardasnails1973]

why would you want carbs present before a workout ? that would halt lioplysis and vendetta has alot of carbs for me personally during workout. What are your opinons

 

[fluffy]

what are your goals now? if you're bulking i'd say you're throwing away good gains by not carb-upping before the workout. nice fiberous carbs, oats, brown rice, green veggies, that kinda thing. to go along with your protein, of course. no fats, you don't want to slow digestion anymore

if you're cutting and don't want to halt fat-burning, then it's your call. but by the time you're working out you'll be in catabolic state even with BCAAs and glutamine. i still ate plenty of carbs before a workout even on a cut (though it was a mild cut)

as i said in the other thread -- from what i've seen on this site so far, people seem to have mostly low-carb diets. i guess i come from a different school of thought. if this works for you, great. i feel dead if i don't have good carbs before a workout

 

[hardasnails1973]

well think of it this way my diet does contain good amount of slow burninng carbs about 200 grams spaced out through (140 taken in ) 2 post workout meals and 1/2 cup of oatmeal at break fast and may be a 6 oz yam 3 with chicken at meal 3 to help fuel workout. Carbs are a stored thing. 3300 caloires at 50 /25/25 training days seems to be a nice ratio

 

[fluffy]

hehe i used those exact calories and PCF and ended up losing mass (i'm only 6'0" ~180). i just need more cals and carbs. if this works for you, great. are you using prohormones, if you dont mind telling?

 

[Twin Peak]

The notion that you burn fat at certain times, and carbs at another, is silly to me.

Your body is in a constant state of flux of lipolysis and lipogensis. In the end, its the total caloric intake versus the expenditure, not "when" it was burned. Obvioulsy you'd add in things like insulin presence, and whatnot, but you get my point.

So if that is true, why not use a product like Vendetta that is specifically designed with the optimal type of protein (EAA) and carbs, to put you in an anabolic state during your workout, and for a significant time thereafter.

Read the write up on it on Xtreme's website. Its revolutionary. Too bad no one realizes this.

 

[fluffy]

i'm not familiar with vendetta specifically, i will read up on it. but i don't think you can question that at certain times your body is more or less catabolic than at others. if you go through strenuous activity with empty glycogen stores, then you will be putting yourself in a catabolic state. that's why you don't do cardio on empty stomach, etc

if vendetta is a carb + protein supp and you take it pre-workout, then yeah, it'll accomplish the same thing as a carb-up meal. if it's protein-only then i disagree that it can somehow keep you in anabolic state through the workout and beyond

i will read up more on the product

 

[fluffy]

ok i read up on it. yeah, it'd be very good pre-workout. it's damn expensive though for a mix of sugar, dextrose, and what might as well be whey protein

 

[Twin Peak]

Originally posted by fluffy
i'm not familiar with vendetta specifically, i will read up on it. but i don't think you can question that at certain times your body is more or less catabolic than at others. if you go through strenuous activity with empty glycogen stores, then you will be putting yourself in a catabolic state. that's why you don't do cardio on empty stomach, etc

What does this have to do with my previous post? Nothing, as far as I can tell.

Vendetta is both, as I stated above.

While I agree with your first parapgraph, it is indeed possible to be anabolic without carbs.

 

[Twin Peak]

Originally posted by fluffy
ok i read up on it. yeah, it'd be very good pre-workout. it's damn expensive though for a mix of sugar, dextrose, and what might as well be whey protein

EAA's are the same as whey protein where do you get your information from?

 

[hardasnails1973]

whey protein digest in 90 minutes in sytem and you do not want food digesting in stomach while lifting !! you want it to goto the muscles. So why don;t I just mix some BCAAS with some dextrose with a little bit of gltuemine and get close amount of the effect

or i can spend make my post workout drink of just whey protein with 25 grams dextrose and 25 g malotedrin with 1 cup ground up oatmeal in a coffe grinder and spend money on vendetta in stead : )

What do you think of that ?

 

[fluffy]

extreme vendetta per serving contains:
L-Leucine 4290mg
L-Lysine 2070mg
L-Valine 1830mg
L-Phenylalanine 1607mg
L-Threonin 1390mg
L-Histidine 638mg
L-Isoleucine 636mg
L-Methionine 447mg

ON 100% whey per serving contains:
L-Leucine 2470 mg
L-Lysine 2120 mg
L-Valine 1440 mg
L-Phenylalanine 670 mg
L-Threonine 1720 mg
L-Histidine 400 mg
L-Isoleucine 1520 mg
L-Methionine 440 mg

take 2 servings of ON whey and you'll have more of those AA's than 1 serving vendetta. yes, they may not be as "available" but digestion will take care of it if you take it more in advance

 

[fluffy]

Originally posted by hardasnails1973
whey protein digest in 90 minutes in sytem and you do not want food digesting in stomach while lifting !! you want it to goto the muscles. So why don;t I just mix some BCAAS with some dextrose with a little bit of gltuemine and get close amount of the effect

or i can spend make my post workout drink of just whey protein with 25 grams dextrose and 25 g malotedrin with 1 cup ground up oatmeal in a coffe grinder and spend money on vendetta in stead : )

What do you think of that ?

i think whey digests quicker than 90 mins. i thought it was like 30-60. yeah, you dont want it sitting in your stomach

i guess i dont get the big deal with vendetta. seems to me you can make a pretty damn good homemade quivalent with dextrose/sugar/whey. i don't even get why use sugar instead of maltodextrin. but whichever

 

[hardasnails1973]

might just to 20 grams BCAAS with 15 grams dextrose for a slight spike . dont get me wrong vendetta looks good but just to prices for me right now. I need to watch my funds..

 

[Twin Peak]

Originally posted by fluffy
i think whey digests quicker than 90 mins. i thought it was like 30-60. yeah, you dont want it sitting in your stomach

i guess i dont get the big deal with vendetta. seems to me you can make a pretty damn good homemade quivalent with dextrose/sugar/whey. i don't even get why use sugar instead of maltodextrin. but whichever

You are getting much more than the 8 EAA's in your whey. Much. Thus, you will not get the same effect.

As well, if you are cutting, that means ytou have to take in extra calories to get the same anabolic effect (assuming it was the same).

If you don't believe any of this, get a can and try it. I can actually feel the additional energy, and am able to get additional reps.

 

[fluffy]

yeah you get all the other amino acids in whey too. i dunno. i'll take your word for it that it's different. might give it a shot sometime but i have a pretty anti-supp mindset in general lol. real food (plus whey) is where it's at

 

[fluffy]

oh yeah, sorry to hijack your thread, hardasnails i like everything you're doing except the carb thing that we went over already. also not sure why you choose to wait 15 mins to take the post-workout shake -- wouldn't the insulin spike help drive creatine to the muscles? just asking, not saying it's right or wrong

 

[Barlog]

I Have to agree with you fluffy about the carb thing, vendetta if anything should be taken post workout not pre. And is it really worth the money??? but if you disagree with the fat burning period then go ahead and take it.

 

[hardasnails1973]

Right now i'm just flooding my body with BCAAS during workout 20-30 grams in a sugarless drink or taking them sperately about 4 pills every 5-10 minutes or before sets. I was told by Gopro to wait 10-15 minutes before having my post work out shake plsu he has never lead me wrong yet . Since talking to alot of people I'm going to stick to 1 cups oatmeal, 6 -8 oz white potatoe with 50 grams of whey protein isoalte mixed in the oatmeal then wait an hour and a half and eat 6 oz chicken with 10 oz yam 1 cup veggies. what carb think are you refering to ?

 

[bigbrownbear]

waiting 15 mins before having your pwo drink - what is the logic behind this reasoning???? is it better for cutting?