strength programs (minimal size gains)

[bobbyatopk]

hey people. i was just wondering if any one knew any other programs like bill star 5x5 and 531 etc.. and which one would be the best for strength and power but without excessive size gains.

Im training for sports performance e.g. vertical jump and sprint speed mainly.

any info would be appreciated!

 

[Marat]

It's not a coincidence that running backs have some of the strongest (relative) numbers on a football team. The stronger one is, the more force can be generated by the legs.

Body size is a related to diet.

If you haven't lifted weights before, I'd recommend Starting Strength. If you have a bit of experience, I'd recommend 5/3/1.

 

[bobbyatopk]

hey thanks for the reply, i have been lifting for about a year and a half. i do backsquats, front squats, clean and jerk and snatch. i lift 3 days a week

usually i just buildup to a 3-5 rm backsquat and do a few sets on my heavy days. and then i do more olympic lifting stuff the next two days.

i think i just need to start cycling my heavy days (change the lift every 3 weeks ?) also i was thinking of doing sets of 3 building up to sets of 1.

 

[Marat]

I like your movement selection but you'd be well served to get in some deadlifts. Also, it sounds like you can organize your periodization a bit better. Instead of starting from scratch, I think it's less overwhelming to just follow a routine like 5/3/1. You can always add or take away elements to suit your specific goals.

 

[LAM]

don't want to gain size then don't eat a lot, it's that simple. the muscles do not grow simply because they have been stimulated there has to be a caloric excess in the diet for an extended period of time.

strength training while keeping the cals moderate is how power lifters stay in the same weight class.

 

[unclem]

pm flathead as hes a powerlifter and is in a team.

 

[MDR]

I like your movement selection but you'd be well served to get in some deadlifts. Also, it sounds like you can organize your periodization a bit better. Instead of starting from scratch, I think it's less overwhelming to just follow a routine like 5/3/1. You can always add or take away elements to suit your specific goals.

Gotta deadlift

 

[bobbyatopk]

hey thanks for the replys people im taking it all in. does any one know any good way of working out how many calories i should be taking in to repair and feel healthy but not gain to much.

any formulas ?

 

[Marat]

You are referring to your "maintenance" intake.

There are rough estimations floating around (something like taking in 13x-15x your bodyweight in pounds) but you can get a more accurate figure by tracking your intake (fitday.com) and then making any necessary changes.

Start with taking in 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass.
Also, 0.5 grams of fat per lean body mass.

You can fill in the rest of the calories however you'd like -- be it with carbs, fat, or protein.


An example:

A male weighs 80kg. That works out to 176 pounds. If he is 12% bodyfat, he carries about 155 pounds of lean body mass.

If one multiplies 176 pounds x 14 calories/pound, he would take in 2464 calories. I'll round to 2500.

If he were to take in 1lb/pound of lbm of protein, that would be 155 grams of protein each day.

At 0.5g fat/pound of lbm of fat, he'd be taking in about 77grams of fat. I'll round to 80 grams of fat.

The calories from minimal fat and protein intake comes out to 1340 calories. That's [(155 x 4) + (80 x 9)].

Subtracting 1340 from 2500 leaves him with 1160 calories to play with. Those remaining calories can be invested however is most comfortable.


That gives you a guideline. If you are losing at 2500, bump the calories to 3000 and reevaluate. Keep increasing until you stop losing weight. If you are gaining at 2500, drop the calories until you no longer are gaining weight.

 

[bobbyatopk]

wow its going to be hard to calculate calories for every thing i eat. i may just have to do it intuitively some what. but thanks for explaining that! i will work out what i should be eating any way

i just wrote this out as an idea of what i had in mind

what do people think of this, bearing in mind im doing sports stuff in between gymnastics / parkour.

MONDAY
Max effort day

Warm up doing some light clean and jerk and snatches (to maintain technique)

LEGS
Every 3 weeks alternate between these exercises ??? back squat, front squat, deadlift and Bulgarian slit squat.

Build up using sets of 3 untill that is too hard and use sets of 1 until 1rm

PULLING
Same as legs but use weighed pull up, dumbbell row or bent over barbell row.
????????????????????????..

WEDNESDAY
Technique / speed day

Warm up doing clean and jerk/ snatch for technique training

3 sets of 60 meter sled sprint followed by 60 meter un-weighted sprints
.................................
FRIDAY
Dynamic day

LEGS
5 sets of 3 snatch
5 sets of 2 clean and jerk

PUSHING
Alternate exercises: bench press, dips, military press and push press. Build up using sets of 3 untill that is too heavy and then do sets of 1 until 1rm.
........................

 

[gtbmed]

That is fine, but I would add a Saturday session and do some deadlifts. Recovery from the Olympic lifts will be fast enough that you can get in your deadlifts on Saturday. You may want to think about swapping your Monday and Wednesday workouts though.

So Monday do your technique work, Wednesday do back squats or front squats, Friday do your heavy Olympic lifts, and Saturday do some deadlifts.

That's along the lines of what I currently do. Check my journal in my sig if you want different ideas.

 

[bobbyatopk]

@gtbmed
do you think i should do a whole deadlift day or just cycle the max effort lifts to include deadlifts ?
also would i do the build up to 1 rm using sets of 3 then 1 ?

also are you training for a particular sport? i noticed you do box jumps

 

[gtbmed]

@gtbmed
do you think i should do a whole deadlift day or just cycle the max effort lifts to include deadlifts ?
also would i do the build up to 1 rm using sets of 3 then 1 ?

also are you training for a particular sport? i noticed you do box jumps

I think you'd be better off adding a deadlift day. You don't have to do a lot of them, but enough to strengthen your hamstrings and glutes. If you squat Olympic-style like I do, your ham and glute strength will probably lag a bit. I don't know if deadlifting once every 3 weeks is enough.

I don't know how much I like the idea of building up to a 1RM every week. What I'm currently doing is doing lots of triples and increasing the weight every week. After 5-6 weeks I'll do a bunch of heavy singles instead of the triples. That way you're building up volume and then, after time, you drop the volume and raise the intensity to see what kind of gains you've made.

I'm mostly training for volleyball. I like O lifting a lot though so I'm going to give that a shot at some point.

 

[bobbyatopk]

nice i think i will add in a deadlift day then. if not i will do alot of glute ham raises on the side. although when i backsquat i do it more powerlifter style.

i may be wrong but it seems that the westside program involves building up to a 1rm or 3 rm every week in one of the exercises. i guess it could be abit intense. maybe i will build up to 3rm instead. I quite like the way its constantly testing

 

[Marat]

I recommend following the protocol as listed and then heading over to the Q&A at EliteFTS and running your questions by Jim Wendler about any changes you'd like to make.

No need to fix what isn't yet broken.

 

[Marat]

Oh just a thought:

Due to you not being interested primarily in increasing your 1RM and you also are not primarily interested in increasing your size, perhaps you using Westside would be a bit overzealous. Maybe you'd want to look into a program like 5/3/1 or something similar.