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sustaining the "pump" ?

I never said getting a pump every workout increases your ability to get pumped.

As far as competition, you better get a good pump, or your muscles go cold and you look like shit out there. You must practice posing while your all pumped up, therefore you won't shake, cramp....

And no bluedevil, its not better than sex, but its pretty freakin close....
 
Originally posted by Pumping Iron
As far as competition, you better get a good pump, or your muscles go cold and you look like shit out there. You must practice posing while your all pumped up, therefore you won't shake, cramp....

How many times have you competed?
 
A better pump will result in more blood flow, thus more nutrients to the muscle, which will be good for recovery, as well as nutrient partitioning (since adipose does not share the increase).

It will also lead to compensetory hypertrophy of the vascular system (and, glycogen stores as well), which will result in larger muscles, though they will not be as strong per unit cross-sectional area -- there are studies looking at muscle fibers in bodybuilders vs. Olympic/Powerlifters, and the bodybuilders have larger CSA, but most is due to things other than contractile protein.
 
Should add that I still very much agree that it should not be THE goal of training, but there is data to suggest that it is not a bad idea at all to have it be a goal, if you are just training for hypertrophy and not function.
 
I think that Paul Delia answers this question best:


Obtaining a muscle pump from training IS NOT an indication of growth or even a successful set or workout for that matter.

Let me explain what actually causes a muscle to become pumped so you can better understand why is not an indicator of a successful set or workout.

Like yourself, most people think (and are taught) that the pumped feeling you get while training is a result of increased blood flow into the muscle. This is wrong.

The full and tight feeling, the pump, after a set or workout is not the result of increased blood flow into the muscle. This pump is actually the result of "trapped" blood within the muscle. When a muscle contracts the actual fiber diameter increases as it shortens. This muscle contraction exerts an "inward" force upon itself. This inward force temporarily shuts off vascular activity that blocks blood flow out of the particular muscle group being trained.

When this happens, an increase in blood pressure occurs as an attempt to clear the backed up blood from the congested capillaries and into the maze of interstitial spaces of the muscle cells. As a result of this congestion, a muscular pump prevails.

As you can now see obtaining a muscle pump has nothing to do with increased blood flow into the muscle, but rather a temporary entrapment of blood within the muscle. So you are not increasing the blood flow into the muscle you are decreasing the blood flow out of the muscle while at the same time increasing blood pressure.

This should clearly indicate why a muscle pump has nothing directly to do with muscle growth. This is yet another myth ignorantly propagated by the magazines and gym gurus. Like many things in weight training and bodybuilding, it seems right but it's not.

There is no physiological reason to "train for the pump." For muscle growth you should train to maximize overload force on the muscle because it's the overload that induces the metabolic activities needed for muscle growth to occur.

One more thing I must point out, no matter how you train, some degree of muscular pump will occur. It's a side effect of muscle contraction. However, it's important to understand that training specifically to induce a maximum muscle pump is not an efficient way to build muscle and quite possibly could be detrimental to your efforts. So you don't train to avoid a pump, you just don't train specifically to achieve a pump.
 
Paul Delia rarely says anything best -- instead, he writes columns (without references and with numerous things indicating he is ignorant of, or holding back purposefully, large amounts of data from the literature), which attack the "science" of products that AST has incentive to remove market share from.

Here are some studies on increased blood flow during exercise:

J Appl Physiol. 2003 Jan;94(1):6-10. Epub 2002 Aug 16. Related Articles, Links


Comment in:
J Appl Physiol. 2003 Jan;94(1):3-5.

Muscle pump does not enhance blood flow in exercising skeletal muscle.

Hamann JJ, Valic Z, Buckwalter JB, Clifford PS.

Medical College of Wisconsin and Veterans Affairs Medical Center, Milwaukee 53295, USA.

The muscle pump theory holds that contraction aids muscle perfusion by emptying the venous circulation, which lowers venous pressure during relaxation and increases the pressure gradient across the muscle. We reasoned that the influence of a reduction in venous pressure could be determined after maximal pharmacological vasodilation, in which the changes in vascular tone would be minimized. Mongrel dogs (n = 7), instrumented for measurement of hindlimb blood flow, ran on a treadmill during continuous intra-arterial infusion of saline or adenosine (15-35 mg/min). Adenosine infusion was initiated at rest to achieve the highest blood flow possible. Peak hindlimb blood flow during exercise increased from baseline by 438 +/- 34 ml/min under saline conditions but decreased by 27 +/- 18 ml/min during adenosine infusion. The absence of an increase in blood flow in the vasodilated limb indicates that any change in venous pressure elicited by the muscle pump was not adequate to elevate hindlimb blood flow. The implication of this finding is that the hyperemic response to exercise is primarily attributable to vasodilation in the skeletal muscle vasculature.

PMID: 12391132 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


J Appl Physiol. 1998 Nov;85(5):1649-54. Related Articles, Links


Skeletal muscle vasodilation at the onset of exercise.

Buckwalter JB, Ruble SB, Mueller PJ, Clifford PS.

Departments of Anesthesiology and Physiology, Medical College of Wisconsin and Veterans Affairs Medical Center, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53295, USA.

The purpose of this study was to determine whether beta-adrenergic or muscarinic receptors are involved in skeletal muscle vasodilation at the onset of exercise. Mongrel dogs (n = 7) were instrumented with flow probes on both external iliac arteries and a catheter in one femoral artery. Propranolol (1 mg), atropine (500 microgram), both drugs, or saline was infused intra-arterially immediately before treadmill exercise at 3 miles/h, 0% grade. Immediate and rapid increases in iliac blood flow occurred with initiation of exercise under all conditions. Peak blood flows were not significantly different among conditions (682 +/- 35, 646 +/- 49, 637 +/- 68, and 705 +/- 50 ml/min, respectively). Although the doses of antagonists employed had no effect on heart rate or systemic blood pressure, they were adequate to abolish agonist-induced increases in iliac blood flow. Because neither propranolol nor atropine affected iliac blood flow, we conclude that activation of beta-adrenergic and muscarinic receptors is not essential for the rapid vasodilation in active skeletal muscle at the onset of exercise in dogs.

PMID: 9804565 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


J Appl Physiol. 1997 Dec;83(6):2037-42. Related Articles, Links


Autonomic control of skeletal muscle vasodilation during exercise.

Buckwalter JB, Mueller PJ, Clifford PS.

Department of Anesthesiology, Veterans Affairs Medical Center and Medical College of Wisconsin, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53295, USA.

Despite extensive investigation, the control of blood flow during dynamic exercise is not fully understood. The purpose of this study was to determine whether beta-adrenergic or muscarinic receptors are involved in the vasodilation in exercising skeletal muscle. Six mongrel dogs were instrumented with ultrasonic flow probes on both external iliac arteries and with a catheter in a branch of one femoral artery. The dogs exercised on a treadmill at 6 miles/h while drugs were injected intra-arterially into one hindlimb. Isoproterenol (0.2 microg) or acetylcholine (1 microg) elicited increases in iliac blood flow of 89.8 +/- 14.4 and 95.6 +/- 17.4%, respectively, without affecting systemic blood pressure or blood flow in the contralateral iliac artery. Intra-arterial propranolol (1 mg) or atropine (500 microg) had no effect on iliac blood flow, although they abolished the isoproterenol and acetylcholine-induced increases in iliac blood flow. These data indicate that exogenous activation of beta-adrenergic or muscarinic receptors in the hindlimb vasculature increases blood flow to dynamically exercising muscle. More importantly, because neither propranolol nor atropine affected iliac blood flow, we conclude that beta-adrenergic and muscarinic receptors are not involved in the control of blood flow to skeletal muscle during moderate steady-state dynamic exercise in dogs.

PMID: 9390978 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


I could supply 100 more.

Why do you suppose the body increases blood flow to the muscle during exercise, if not to transport more nutrients to the cell.

It does not make a great deal of evolutionary sense (or common sense), to have a system which drastically increases blood flow (and, blood carries nutrients to cells) to the tissue with a higher demand for said nutrients, "coincidentally" right when that increased demand occurs, only to have it completely go to waste -- because, according to Delia, the one and only thing that increases the pump is blood that is trapped by a shortage of outflow -- and, worse, if we are not getting those nutrients from that increase in arteriol flow to the cell -- all it is left with is the used up venous blood that is stuck in there.

Somehow, I doubt such a system would have survived many millions of years of natural selection.

One can see through B.S. that uses the words "science" and "research" a lot, with pubmed and a little effort/logical reasoning.
 
Originally posted by Prince
How many times have you competed?
You don't want blood gorging in your muscles during comp. It can hinder definiton and that is what you want. You don't want to look smooth.
 
Originally posted by Par Deus
A better pump will result in more blood flow, thus more nutrients to the muscle, which will be good for recovery, as well as nutrient partitioning (since adipose does not share the increase).

It will also lead to compensetory hypertrophy of the vascular system (and, glycogen stores as well), which will result in larger muscles, though they will not be as strong per unit cross-sectional area -- there are studies looking at muscle fibers in bodybuilders vs. Olympic/Powerlifters, and the bodybuilders have larger CSA, but most is due to things other than contractile protein.

This was a beautiful post, and I totally agree. This is why I like people to explore rep ranges from 4-6 to 7-12 to 8-20. This way you can cause muscle damage, get a pump, affect the various types of muscle fibers that muscles contain, as well as affect different hormones that will react to different rep ranges.
 
Originally posted by Blade Runner
i look much more cut and my muscles are very defined now. is there no one else who have seen results like this so soon?


-YES, but w/ WIN :shhh:
 
Muscle Gelz Transdermals
IronMag Labs Prohormones
OK, I took NO2 for one bottle's worth, which was only 18 days for me. It worked for me, not so much as giving me a "pump" but in the way I would prefer, increased ENERGY. Which in turn would help me increase lean mass. But, at $60 a bottle, (20% off $70), there is no way I could continue using it.

So, I tried Chuck Diesel's NOS precursor. Cheap? Yes. Work? Nope, notta nothing. All kinds of additives, but none that helped me. I tried Trac Creatine, I couldn't really tell that I got much from it either, maybe only slightly more energy, hard to say, therefore it's not worth my money either.

After many times of trying Creatine, that never worked for me, I looked to the above alternatives for help, and go tnothing except for the results from NO2, and a lighter billfold.

Well, now I have been using EAS, and Weider Creatines, and they really have helped much more than I ever thought possible. I can go to the gym and have plenty of energy for a whole body workout for an hour or more. Good for me..lol. Plenty of Pump too.

But, with Creatine, and most other supp.'s, you must cycle off. So I am fixing to do that for a month from my creatine and needed something else to try. So I went to my local GNC looking for another NO supplement to try, hopefully cheaper. Well, I decided to try their GNC brand Arginmax. It's serving size is 3 grams of arginine a day, split at 1.5gm 2x a day. So I will be taking this 1hour before hitting the gym, and maybe before bed or right after the gym, not really sure yet. I am on here now looking for that suggestion, (when to take?). Just saw this thread, and thought I would share my experience.

PEACE!!
 
You should try SwoleV.2:thumbs:

Syntrax has this special where you get SwoleV.2 and Isomatrix Reloaded all for $45......this include shipping......

www.syntrax.com
 
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