Chest Size and Stimulating Muscle Growth

[Golden_Boy]

Hey guys, couple of questions:

1) Do you think it is possible to expand your ribcage as an adult? I have read many articles on this question, all with different takes. Guys like Arnold believed in it apparently, and so do some people who do deep breathing exercises. But then you have medical people saying the ribcage cannot expand after a certain age.

2) Is there much literature about muscle growth stimulated by a "mind-to-body" connection? I guess this one sounds way out there, but I'm very intrigued how some muscles in my body for which I can strongly feel when flexing, grow much fuller/quicker than those muscles I cannot seem to have that same mental connection with.

I guess in a nutshell, I'm trying to figure out how to best stimulate my pecs to grow when I have such a difficult time "feeling" them while lifting, so that I can work at expanding my chest size.

 

[Duncans Donuts]

No, you can't expand the ribcage.

As far as hypertrophy is concerned, I would recommend the following:
1) Big muscles move big weights. Time Under Tension is important, and you have to work out
2) progressively. Get 1.25 pound plates and advance your reps or weight every week. From there you need to
3) eat appropriately. Clearly aggregate nitrogen balance and creating an anabolic state are important relative to hypertrophy. I personally feel that post workout diet (1-12 hours after the workout) is the most important phase in terms of getting massive. I've noticed that if my diet is skimpy throughout the day and clean and full after the workout, I still add muscle. If you have 150 pounds of LBM, I would advise 1-1.5 grams of protein relative to each pound of LBM. I'm only taking about 225-250 grams a day (some here are taking upwards of 400) and my progress is fantastic. Finally,
4) volume and frequency are the most important aspects of a good training routine. Don't overtrain, or you will not progress. Some people will argue that strength is not a good indicator of muscle gains, but that is a bad argument - what else can you measure with? A tape measure? Sadly, advances in muscle will not show every single workout - paticularly enough to show on a tape measure. In fact a 16th of an inch every month (depending on the body part) would probably be good progress, and that won't even come out to an inch in a year (depending on the status of your training - clearly newcomers will be able to track progress much better. As for me, getting my chest from 50 to 51 inches is a slow journey) The best way to track progress is through strength gains. Diet, in accordance with that, allowing yourself to grow, should leave you in good standing.

 

[Golden_Boy]

Thanks. I've done quite good in the 2 years I've worked out...getting from about an inactive 175-180lbs, average bodyfat, to a very lean 200lbs, 10% B.F., with no help from supplements except protein.
I use a journal to help me track progress, and to learn what combination of exercises works at improving the other (i.e. I find progress in squatting will help in my deadlifting).
My current goal is to enhance the chest/pecs, because my shoulders are huge, and they almost seem to overshadow my pecs during some poses. Using my journal, I decided to create a 4-day cycle that would focus more on my upper body, with the aim of increasing chest size through added development of the back and pecs. This is how it is right now: The first two muscle groups of each training day are the main focus, and the 3rd is done only if time permits.

Day 1: Chest, Back, and Calves
Day 2: Shoulders, Back, and Biceps
Day 3: Chest, Shoulders, Triceps
Day 4: Legs

 

[simbh]

Duncan forgot 1 thing. Rest is your best ally ! Try to sleep as much as you can during the night ... Always aim for 7+ hours of sleep.

 

[MTN WARRIOR]

No, you can't expand the ribcage.

As far as hypertrophy is concerned, I would recommend the following:
1) Big muscles move big weights. Time Under Tension is important, and you have to work out
2) progressively. Get 1.25 pound plates and advance your reps or weight every week. From there you need to
3) eat appropriately. Clearly aggregate nitrogen balance and creating an anabolic state are important relative to hypertrophy. I personally feel that post workout diet (1-12 hours after the workout) is the most important phase in terms of getting massive. I've noticed that if my diet is skimpy throughout the day and clean and full after the workout, I still add muscle. If you have 150 pounds of LBM, I would advise 1-1.5 grams of protein relative to each pound of LBM. I'm only taking about 225-250 grams a day (some here are taking upwards of 400) and my progress is fantastic. Finally,
4) volume and frequency are the most important aspects of a good training routine. Don't overtrain, or you will not progress. Some people will argue that strength is not a good indicator of muscle gains, but that is a bad argument - what else can you measure with? A tape measure? Sadly, advances in muscle will not show every single workout - paticularly enough to show on a tape measure. In fact a 16th of an inch every month (depending on the body part) would probably be good progress, and that won't even come out to an inch in a year (depending on the status of your training - clearly newcomers will be able to track progress much better. As for me, getting my chest from 50 to 51 inches is a slow journey) The best way to track progress is through strength gains. Diet, in accordance with that, allowing yourself to grow, should leave you in good standing.

Perfectly said DD

 

[CowPimp]

Is hitting your chest twice per week something you have always done, or is it something you have implemented recently to try and bring up this body part?

As well, would you care to outline your chest routine on both days?

 

[Golden_Boy]

Well, I'm always trying different things and journalling the progress, so some times I'm hitting chest 3 times a week, with fewer exercises, and other times 1-2 times with more exercises. I go by cycles. In this cycle I arranged it in the above fashion to focus more on the chest and back and shoulders, and I let my leg workout to be done only once every 8 days. I'm in my 16th week and I'm seeing some good results. This is what I've done this cycle with my chest.
Day 1 Chest:
1) Flat Barbell Bench Press: 4-5 sets, 12-10-8-6-4 reps
2) Incline Machine Press: 3-4 sets as heavy as I can go
3) Flat Bench flyes: 3 sets with good weight

Day 3 Chest:
1) Incline Barbell Bench Press: 4-5 sets, 12-10-8-6-4 reps.
2) Flat DB bench Press: 4-5 sets with medium weight, so that I can feel the pecs in the full movement
3) Cable/DB Pullovers: 3-4 heavy sets.

 

[Golden_Boy]

Thanks Duncan for the info....

Simon, you are right with the sleep thing. I'm in bed 7-7.5 a night and for me it seems good. I remember reading stuff about Steve Reeves and how he used to sleep 13 hours a day during competition training. He wasn't very big, but it is amazing how good his physique was.

 

[CowPimp]

I deem that routine excessively high in volume, especially if all of those sets are to failure. Try 9 sets per week, and don't goto failure on all of them. Goto failure on the last set of each exercise, or something along those lines.

 

[Duncans Donuts]

i agree...if one works out hard enough one set is enough to stimulate hypertrophy, 24 is excessive. 24 sets over the course of a week is, literally, what I would do over the course of 12 weeks.

 

[LAM]

you also have to take into account the number of sets that are under 60% of the 1RM. any less than that and you aren't causing any micro trauma, personally I don't count them...

 

[CowPimp]

you also have to take into account the number of sets that are under 60% of the 1RM. any less than that and you aren't causing any micro trauma, personally I don't count them...

I don't see any of those sets being under 60% of his 1RM. 12 repetitions is usually about 70% of one's 1RM.

 

[LAM]

you are assuming that he is training to failure which IMO would be idiotic if you still have 4 more sets to go...you don't get a big bench by training like that

 

[CowPimp]

you are assuming that he is training to failure which IMO would be idiotic if you still have 4 more sets to go...you don't get a big bench by training like that

Yup, that's why I suggest he only goto failure on maybe one set per exercise.

 

[Golden_Boy]

Hey guys, in the two years of training, I've experimented with volume, and I find that my body is quite robust and I can give it lots of punishment and recover pretty fast. In this cycle I wanted to see what would happen if I put the emphasis on upper body, as my legs are very well developed at this time. I'm finding lots of success with working out every second day.

I find it is easy for the shoulders and arms to overshadow the chest. I'm not a competing bodybuilder, but I have managed this year to create greater pec/chest appearence by building on the back, and reducing my waist from 37.5 inches to 33.5-34 inches. My shoulder width is over 2 feet. I'm also working on posing and posture.

As for diet, I've made lots of improvements as well. Thanks Duncan, I agree that the first few hours after workout is the most critical. Simon is dead on with the sleep as well.

I think that the only flaw with my chest is that my ribcage isn't too wide. I do breathing exercises every day, though. I'm also thinking that with only 2 years of training, I can stand to wait and keep consistent in building my chest.

 

[Rissole]

1) Big muscles move big weights.

Sorry DD but i don't agree with this, not trying to be anal cause the rest of your post was great..... I have had 2 training partners that have smaller bi's than me but can outcurl me by 20lb.... maybe i'm a bit stricter than them in my reps but still it's a big difference.
Size does not always mean strength but they often go hand in hand

 

[DeadBolt]

Sorry DD but i don't agree with this, not trying to be anal cause the rest of your post was great..... I have had 2 training partners that have smaller bi's than me but can outcurl me by 20lb.... maybe i'm a bit stricter than them in my reps but still it's a big difference.
Size does not always mean strength but they often go hand in hand

Just look at wrestlers...strong little bugga's for their size!

 

[Duncans Donuts]

Sorry DD but i don't agree with this, not trying to be anal cause the rest of your post was great..... I have had 2 training partners that have smaller bi's than me but can outcurl me by 20lb.... maybe i'm a bit stricter than them in my reps but still it's a big difference.
Size does not always mean strength but they often go hand in hand

I agree, that certainly some people have better neurological efficacy and a smaller arm can outperform a bigger one. However, you will never see a 20 inch arm that is using a light weight to achieve it's size (though it may still be outperformed by a smaller arm..)

All things in context, if you are eating right and getting adequate rest, hypertrophy should (in theory) accompany intense training that is progressive. If you want to get big, the chances of it reaching fruition increase if you're constantly pushing bigger weights...

 

[Rissole]

I agree, that certainly some people have better neurological efficacy and a smaller arm can outperform a bigger one. However, you will never see a 20 inch arm that is using a light weight to achieve it's size (though it may still be outperformed by a smaller arm..)

All things in context, if you are eating right and getting adequate rest, hypertrophy should (in theory) accompany intense training that is progressive. If you want to get big, the chances of it reaching fruition increase if you're constantly pushing bigger weights...

Agreed

 

[fUnc17]

Sorry DD but i don't agree with this, not trying to be anal cause the rest of your post was great..... I have had 2 training partners that have smaller bi's than me but can outcurl me by 20lb.... maybe i'm a bit stricter than them in my reps but still it's a big difference.
Size does not always mean strength but they often go hand in hand

There is no direct correlation between size and strength, but like you said they often go hand and hand.

 

[Golden_Boy]

What can you two tell me about neurological efficacy? This seems like the prime factor for muscle growth and development. Can this neurological influence on our muscles be improved with further training, or is it again determined by genetic means?

The reason I ask reflects what I was trying to express in the opening of this thread. Is the fact that we can "feel" certain muscles in our body better than others evidence that we have a better electrical/neurological connection with them, and thus have an easier time developing them fully?

 

[Duncans Donuts]

Neurological efficacy comes along with training. This will increase during anaerobic exercise; the body makes itself more efficient. Your maximum capacity of neurological efficiency, though, is genetically determined.