Diet and energy levels

[dzjunction]

ok, so my workout partner and I have not been able to figure out why our energy levels are still very low after making significant changes to our diet and health. i get tired at the same times everyday. usually its extreme tiredness as well, where i have to fight to keep my eyes open.

along with 4 days a week at the gym,

my diet (muscle growth diet):

meal 1: protein shake (1 cup milk, 1 cup low sugar/carb yogurt, banana, 1 scoop whey)

meal 2: chicken or beef burrito (lettuce, cheese, tomatoes, pinto beans, rice)

meal 3: metrx protein bar

meal 4: foot long chicken or steak subway (wheat bread, cheese, and lots of veggies)

meal 5: protein shake (1 scoop whey, 2 scoops weight gainer, 2 cups milk)


i significantly feel drained after taking the shakes, and after lunch.... i have never been able to feel normal after lunch. but the protein shakes, they're like sedatives sometimes.... i don't understand why that is happening.

i get about 6 hours of sleep a night. i drink a decent amount of water. i also take 3g of vitamin C a day.

my partner(female), shes on a 1000-1200 calorie diet spread over 5-6 meals.

your typical healthy foods, lots of fruits, protein, chicken, salmon, lower on the fats.... and she hits the gym for cardio 3-5 times a week.

she is always tired as well.

does anyone have any idea what may be causing some of this tiredness or what we can do to assist it?


i especially would like to know if anyone else has ever felt the extreme sedated feeling after the protein shakes as i have been experiencing.

thanks

 

[garethhe]

your partner is underfed, for one thing. unless she's three feet tall.

 

[dzjunction]

hmm, well, her body burns about 1400 cals a day... so eating a 2-300 hundred less than that doesn't seem to be too bad, no?

 

[FranktheTank]

i dunno how the protein shakes make you sleepy....i cant seem to fall asleep after drinkin them

 

[Emma-Leigh]

hmm, well, her body burns about 1400 cals a day... so eating a 2-300 hundred less than that doesn't seem to be too bad, no?

How big is she? What are her stats? Because 1400 cals is not very much at all and 1200 is a very small amount!!

 

[dzjunction]

with stats of:

5' 7
140 lbs
23 years old

we get a basal metabolic rate of 1462...

so we thought it ok to stay around 200 under that...

are there some other things we need to be aware of?

thanks

 

[garethhe]

the basal metabolic rate is the amount of calories your partner needs in order to survive while laying still in bed 24/7. there are lots of other things you need to factor in! such as the energy needed to do cardio 3-5x per week, or the energy needed to blink, or to open up a bottle of snapple.

quite seriously, 1000-1200 calories per day is a dangerously low amount of calories for any normal sized and active human being to consume.

 

[dzjunction]

hmm, ok..

then im a little confused. how much calories should she be eating? at the end of the day there needs to be a net loss of calories to lose weight.

shes losing about 1lb a week, so we're not sure how to really keep a rate like that if there is anymore eating.

can you give me a estimate of how much she should be eating? 1800?

 

[garethhe]

one reason why she is losing "only" 1lb a week is because her body is starved for nutrients, which in turn slows down her metabolism.

i'll let emma weigh in on how many calories she should be eating, as she knows a ton more than i do...but personally i would start the discussion at 2000 calories as a maintenance rate.

 

[dougnukem]

I also noticed that you only get about 6 hours of sleep. Some people might argue here, but I just don't feel that 6 hours is enough, IMO.

 

[dzjunction]

yeah, i should say it ranges from 6-8..... but even nights of 9-10 hours (not too often) i still get the very sedated feeling after these protein drinks.....

 

[dougnukem]

How long have you been doing this routine and this diet?

 

[dzjunction]

garethhe, 2000. hmm. yeah id like to hear more about that. if her base is about 1460, and with a very mild lifestyle excluding exercise, we can factor in at most 300 cals for a regular day.

thats about 1750.

now, with 3-5 days at the gym, each averaging about 600 cals... thats only burning about 1800-3000 cals a week, barely a pound (3500 cals).

2000 sounds like it would be difficult to match our goals.

thanks

 

[dzjunction]

7 weeks.....

before i started this, i was averagine 4-6 hours of sleep max. i was undereating. and no excercise.

i was usually tired then. but after drastically changing my ways, i am just as tired if not more sometimes.

 

[garethhe]

if her base is about 1460, and with a very mild lifestyle excluding exercise, we can factor in at most 300 cals for a regular day.

thats about 1750.

I would argue that you're probably a bit too conservative regarding the role daily activities play in calorie expenditure, unless you're partner is <exceedingly> sedentary outside of the gym (but maybe that is exactly what you mean to say when you write "a very mild lifestyle"). Does she spend all of her waking hours sitting on a couch watching TV? If not, then you need to reconsider your math.

Assuming her base is 1460, adding 300 calories as her daily activity expenditure would be a 1.2 daily-activity-rate factor (that is, 1460 basal times 1.2 gives you 1750).

To put that in context--as I understand it--a "normal" lifestyle (say, a person with a desk job who walks to and from her car, up and down the occasional staircase, goes shopping, maybe has sex every now and then, etc) has a 1.4 daily-activity-rate factor.

This number can make a big difference; just check out the arithmetic:

1460x1.2=1752
1460x1.3=1898
1460x1.4=2044

And, just to remind you, all of this has nothing to do with what goes on inside the gym.

 

[dzjunction]

yup, these calculations are all excluding gym time.

yeah, i can see now, if you take a "normal" lifestyle to be a factor of 1.4 then i'm with you.

with this in mind. we shall re-examine everything...

thanks.

but back to original question, how about any tips for energy boosts? are there particular foods that actually help? ginseng, etc... ?

 

[pengers84]

more carbs from sources such as oats, brown rice, basmati rice, fruit etc

 

[Jodi]

Hold it now. Does she do any weight training or just cardio? that is going to make a huge difference in her caloric needs.

If she is only doing cardio then I think a 1400 calorie diet is sufficient for her. If she is weight training then she needs more.

 

[dzjunction]

right now,

only 1 day out of the week is set aside for some weight training.

 

[Jodi]

Then IMO a 1500 cal diet should be sufficient for her. 1000 as you stated above is too low but if she was to go 1800 to 2000 she would be gaining weight.

 

[Emma-Leigh]

I agree with Jodi - if she is not training a lot then 2000 cals would be too much... But how many calories she will need will also depend on her lean mass - if you knew her BF% then you could get a better indication of how much she would need.

 

[dzjunction]

right now, BF% is about 27% +- 5%

 

[Jodi]

Yeah, then I still think 1500 cals would be sufficient for a diet.

 

[Emma-Leigh]

right now, BF% is about 27% +- 5%

27... Right... Then 2000 would certainly be too much - her lean mass is only about 100 pounds. (ps: as long as it is accurate - so how did you do this tested??)

At that weight and BF her maintainence (with no weight training but only cardio) would probably be around the 1700-1800 cal mark (as long as she is not a chronic dieter - if that was the case then she would be lower than this)...

So this would mean that 1500 cals would be a good figure for her. [Jodi, once again, is spot on!! - the woman is a nutrition goddess!! ]...



But - Honestly - if she wants better results you need to get her into the weights room more than once a week.... A lean mass of 100 pounds, at her height - is REALLY small!!

 

[Jodi]

You are a funny women. YOU are the nutritional goddess.

I just play pretend

 

[dzjunction]

tested on a a tanita BF scale that is suppose to be within 5% accuracy.

so if we want to build up her lean mass.... say we start including 30 min of weight training 3 times a week, along with the cardio....

she'd prob have to eat 1700 cals or so? i assume the extra cals should come from protein to build up her lean mass.....?

 

[Emma-Leigh]

tested on a a tanita BF scale that is suppose to be within 5% accuracy.

Those things are reallly NOT that accurate... (even though they say they are)...

If you want to be more certain - get someone to do calipers or get her dunked (eg: www.getdunked.com ).

so if we want to build up her lean mass.... say we start including 30 min of weight training 3 times a week, along with the cardio....

That would be a start (eg: 3 x full body sessions would probably be ok for a complete beginner...). After a while she may want to increase this.

she'd prob have to eat 1700 cals or so? i assume the extra cals should come from protein to build up her lean mass.....?

I would still start her on ~1500-1600 cals - then, after she has trained for a bit, you can re-work her cals.

Of those cals you will want a higher % from protein - not only to help her muscles, but it will also hold her satiety better...

Also - with her BF% being so high you may want to keep her carbs lower.

So something like 150-170g protein, 40g fat and ~140g of carbs could be something that could work...

 

[Emma-Leigh]

You are a funny women. YOU are the nutritional goddess.

I just play pretend

Hmmm...

Maybe we should do "paper, scissors, rock" - winner gets to pick who gets the title!?

 

[dzjunction]

yeah, shes def got her head around the gym.... but what it sounds like

"That would be a start (eg: 3 x full body sessions would probably be ok for a complete beginner...). After a while she may want to increase this."

anymore than 3 times a week is really starting to look like a muscle building program....

should the weight training be done on top of the cardio? not sure about the balance of cardio vs weight training. its easy to think that cardio is more important to burn fat. im finding it hard to know what is the right balance so that she wouldn't be overworking and losing muscle.

 

[BritishTang]

should the weight training be done on top of the cardio? not sure about the balance of cardio vs weight training. its easy to think that cardio is more important to burn fat. im finding it hard to know what is the right balance so that she wouldn't be overworking and losing muscle.

I think many will agree here that although cardio is effective in burning fat. There is nothing like weight training. Weight training = more lean mass = more calories burned by muscle = usually less fat.

So I think of it this way, spend an hour sweating during cardio, depleting muscle glycogen and eating away at muscle and then eating less. Or, spend an hour weight training gain muscle mass over the course of a short while so then you can eat more! I love weight training.

Also check around the forums for "High Intensity Interval Training" for cardio, I find it far more effective.

(Note - I was a very skinny marathoner, and I can say that I feel much better now than I did while training for marathons. Talk about eating your body alive. Maybe thats why I'm slightly against tons of cardio now. Call me biased I guess.