PSMF question for Built or someone with experience.

[jmorrison]

Alright Built, I have a tougher one (well a couple) for you.

My girl and I are both going to do the PSMF. I have read and reread Lyles book, and I just don't see anything about how many carbs are acceptable, except to keep them minimal. Now minimal...is this pure protein minimal, or a few grams isnt going to hurt me?

Also, last year when I ran one of these, I was ok until I had a few too many carbs, then I would be ravenously hungry. About how many normally kick you out of ketosis?

First, my numbers. I am 211, 15% BF, so right at cat 1. I will be assisted, and so am planning on shooting for 270-300g of protein. This alone is 1100-1200 calories. This is markedly higher than Lyles "normal" of 800ish cals. What range should I be shooting for on a 3 week PSMF assisted?

Here is the toughy.

My girl is not fat. She is 5 foot, about 110lbs. She just wants to lose some vanity fat while I am cutting, so that she can ride the harley in her bikini.

I am estimating her at around 23-24% BF using the tape method, so right on the line of cat 1-2. She is active, but is not a weightlifter, so I have her at around 90-100g of protein a day. This will only put her cals at around 400 a day and she will be unassisted. Is this too low?

And lastly, in regards to my original question in regards to the carbs, because my girls calorie requirement is going to be sooo low, I am having a helluva time finding recipes that are both low cal/carb and high protein other than chicken. Any cool awesome sites that will help me out?

 

[Kathybird]

so that she can ride the harley in her bikini

Nice.

 

[danzik17]

I wouldn't do a PSMF until she's comfortable with the exercises (unless she already is). The point of the workouts is to retain muscle mass. Without that stimulus....bye bye muscle.

I think she's going to have hunger problems at such low calories. Maybe up her protein to 130-150g per day and add fat as needed until satiated ala Built style?

As for carbs, none! Exception being fiber, lots and lots of that from leafy veggies. It sucks, but it's an effective two week diet you know? Gotta suck it up.

 

[jmorrison]

I wouldn't do a PSMF until she's comfortable with the exercises (unless she already is). The point of the workouts is to retain muscle mass. Without that stimulus....bye bye muscle.

I think she's going to have hunger problems at such low calories. Maybe up her protein to 130-150g per day and add fat as needed until satiated ala Built style?

As for carbs, none! Exception being fiber, lots and lots of that from leafy veggies. It sucks, but it's an effective two week diet you know? Gotta suck it up.

Thanks for the response.


Hmm, I didn't catch any of that in Lyles book about the exercising. He had a certain protein requirement for inactive/active/weightlifters. She is active, and has decent musculature, just doesnt do resistance training (Although we are kicking it off for her).

Thats what I was thinking in regards to the cals. So just cut out carbs completely and just get as low as comfortable on the fats and protein as long she keeps the protein over 90g, and if she ends up at 600-700 it wont kill her, she will just lose a little slower.

 

[Tyler3295]

I think 400 calories ARE too low for her. I have done a PSMF diet before. I could have up to about 25-35 carbs and stay in ketosis. 35-50g would start kicking me out of it, so I didn't go this high. Like said above though, the less carbs the better.

It was hard as fuck to do, but it got me shredded in like 14 days, lol. Be careful for muscle loss though. It can be done w/o losing muscle, but their possibility is pretty high..

 

[Built]

She's tiny, and not all that lean - she should be fine for two weeks, but I second danzik17's suggestion to increase it a bit and also the fat, a bit. Where does she carry her weight - middle, or ass/legs?

 

[jmorrison]

Yeah I ran one last year and lost around 9 lbs in 14 days I think, and I was already carb and water depleted. At least 5 of it was pure fat. Great diet. I also wanted to kill everyone around me. Im not too worried about me on it. I know I can handle it and I know what cals are ok for me, just really struggling setting up one for her. Its a lot harder to set up a PSMF for a 105-110lb tiny little girl that is already in decent shape.

 

[Built]

Chicken breasts, hardboiled eggwhites, fat free Greek yogurt, fat free cottage cheese, and leaves. Lots of leaves.

That's it. That and the supps.

If she's doing non-weight training activity, she'll have to cut it way, WAY the hell back. Like, down to none, other than walking.

 

[jmorrison]

Sorry Built, responded without seeing your answer.

I am going to tape her when I get home. Those are HER numbers that she taped. I would guess her more around 18-20. She is in the reserves, so spends a lot of time running and played softball forever so she has decent musculature.

What fat she has is stored right in the belly and hips, which of course has her obsessing since we ride to the beach all the time.

Your advice, as always is appreciated. I have never set up a diet for someone this small.

 

[jmorrison]

Built, here is a pic of her from a recent fishing trip. I'm sure you can estimate BF% a helluva lot better than I can.

She would kill me if she knew I put this up. She is small....but deadly.

 

[Built]

I'd put her closer to the 25-30% range. She's not overweight - she's tiny. Fashion models are usually around 30% bodyfat - and tinier still.

 

[jmorrison]

Ok, thank you ma'am!

So after running an average day for her at 3 chicken breasts, 1/2 cup of cottage cheese, 1g fish oil and her supps, that puts her at around 530 calories, 110g protein, and less than 20grams of fat/carbs prior to leafy veggies.

At her weight, is that sufficient for:

1. Her to lose weight rapidly ie: RFL
2. Sustain energy levels for low activity

 

[Built]

It sounds right. I know it's crazy low, but she's tiny. (ps I think you mean TEN grams fish oil, right?)

How did she feel on this - or has she started?

 

[jmorrison]

She is starting it on my next trip out here next month. She is running about 1k cals now to cut a little, and she is already down about an inch on her hips in a week. Weight hasnt moved, but I told her not to sweat it. I am guessing her maintenance must be around 1400 with her activity level.

She is ok on this so far, but I don't know how she will handle 500-600 cals. She has the willpower for it, I am more worried about her hurting herself because she wouldn't tell me if she was lightheaded or so on.

I think I have an old copy of Lyles book. He recommended 6g in this one, but I have read in his forums that it is up to 10 now.

 

[jmorrison]

Bump for a question that got Buried.

I know that Lyle only recommends 2 days of resistance training on the RFL, but this wasn't written for assisted athletes. You think 3 or even 4 is acceptable? Not that I mind being lazy, I just want to get the maximum benefit of the cycle.

 

[Built]

No. Two.

 

[jmorrison]

Ok. Thanks again.