America Is Messed Up.!!!!!

[DOMS]

My only rule is no nukes. The fallout that reaches the upper atmosphere could fuck over places thousands of miles way.

They don't need to. Not for the Palestinians.

And they might accidentally light the oil on fire.

That would be the only tragedy.

 

[lnvanry]

Also, my understanding on what is a win/loss/draw may be off a bit, but in what possible, far-fetched, remote and fucking insane world was this a stalemate?

Israel had a truck full of people killed, reacted by killing THOUSANDS, and only stopped after the UN stepped in. If by stalemate you mean that they were basically pooh-poohed into stopping the wholesale destruction of Lebanon, then yes...I guess it was a draw.

Body count is not the measure of success...We ended that metric during Vietnam.

 

[DOMS]

Body count is not the measure of success...We ended that metric during Vietnam.

500,000 of them to 50,000 of us. Of course, if you include the political and social fallout, the body count rises to about 6,000,000.

But you're right, Israel should have killed them all. Then NBC could've made a movie of the week that I could've eaten popcorn while watching.

 

[lnvanry]

Maybe my math skills aren't what they used to be, but I think that recorded battles begninning from the Battle of Kadesh around 1200 BC to present day is a pretty long war record. They have been fighting since before Jesus. Everyone there has combat training (yes EVERYONE). Think of your grandmother. If she had been born in Israel, she would have at least basic combat training and a base understanding of explosives.

Believe what you want, I have been in it, and seen plenty, and Isreal has done much more than defend it's backyard.

We give them handouts (read bribes) to continue to hold onto our influence with them, and to keep them from destroying everyone around them and kicking off a shit storm with our other middle eastern allies.

If you want to ancient history, then they Jewish nation (whatever the territorial border) have been dominated time and time again...Romans, Persian, Egyptians.

Besides, the country (nation state) didn't exist again until the 1950s. I'm not questioning their modern upper hand, but they haven't had it for 1000s of years....clearly.

Have you been trained by the IDF?

 

[lnvanry]

The difference between helping others overseas after a devastating event and 'ignoring' those in need within the United States is that some will argue that those in serious need within the U.S. (such as the homeless) are feeling the effects of some sort of systemic failure. Maybe societal and economic differences might have lead to their situation or it was there own fault, but it definitely wasn't an act of nature like a hurricane or an earthquake that put them on the streets.

Donations will NOT solve this problem within our country. It all starts with the availability of an efficient education and the breaking down of societal barriers and systemic borders.

Along with the donations we have made within the United States and the acts of volunteer groups like Habitat for Humanity, our government has involved itself in recovery and relief efforts after devastating events within our own borders. Citizens of other nations don't always have the luxury of having a powerful and organized (for the most part) government that can address the needs of its people.

I'm not saying that what happened after Katrina was handled anyway near perfect but I know that something was done. There is always room for improvement and I'm proud of the way the people of this nation responded to Katrina by helping out in anyway they could, but calling out the U.S. for helping people out who already lived in poverty before this catastrophe is not the way to go. Especially when your main argument revolves around the amount of donations we have made.
Not only that but it's also sad to think that when a horrible event has taken place and humanity actually responds positively by helping each other out, people look at the situation from a negative perspective.

Really though this post is kinda funny because even though our nation produces more in GDP than any other nation on the planet we still donate less money in terms of a percentage in comparison to our annual GDP than any other nation on the planet as well. So other nations making less than us are able to provide more financial assistance abroad in terms of how much they earn to how much they donate. It's insane how much money this nation makes compared to other countries. Although a lack of money will probably cause us more problems, I'm not so sure more money will fix everything either.

If people are really pissed off about us donating money to people suffering around the world because it takes away from addressing our own domestic problems take a look at how much money is directed towards military spending. I think the numbers for how much money was directed towards the Department of Defense in 2008 was estimated to be between $925 Billion and $1.14 Trillion. The 2009 GDP of Haiti was $11.61 Billion.

Fair point about aid ratio to GDP
US and Foreign Aid Assistance â?????? Global Issues

Not sure if this data is all inclusive though...does it factor private (ie civilian) donations? or is it just gov't to gov't $$$

As far as military spending goes, yes there is waste...but every contractor out there is a Haliburton. There have been paramount shifts in our species advancement through military spending. The microwave, the internet, GPS, space travel, are just a few examples derived from DoD spending. Also, the amount of jobs that are supported by the entire supply chain of military spending is enormous. Its an integral piece of our economy.

 

[jmorrison]

If you want to ancient history, then they Jewish nation (whatever the territorial border) have been dominated time and time again...Romans, Persian, Egyptians.

What kind of asinine statement is this? You just like to argue. I said they have been fighting for thousands of year, you said no they haven't, then when I point out that yes...they actually have, you ask if I want to talk about ancient history. Well no shit, I obviously didn't mean recent history when I said THOUSANDS of years.

Besides, the country (nation state) didn't exist again until the 1950s. I'm not questioning their modern upper hand, but they haven't had it for 1000s of years....clearly.

Have you been trained by the IDF?

You are one of those guys who will argue semantics forever. "see, the sky isn't blue, it is aqua-marine...clearly "

The Israeli people are decended from people who have been fighting (successfully) for thousands of years.... clearly Have they, over the course of thousands of years lost any battles?! Of course, but their overall military success cannot be disputed. This is a fact. Nothing to argue about, not even really a point of contention, other than your obviously insatiable need to argue. I honestly have a hard time believing that anyone without an extra chromosome would bother typing a rebuttal to this.

Stalemates aren't determined by body counts either. Israel was trashing Lebanon, until the teacher pulled the bully off the fat kid....clearly I would honestly like to know where you pulled this out of your ass also...although I think its just another point that you want to argue about.

No, I am not trained by IDF, but I have worked with some Sayeret guys, and they have all the respect in the world from me.

 

[min0 lee]

It would benefit us if the US and other countries help rebuild that country.....think about it, if we can help get them on their feet again that would mean less immigrants coming over here.

.

I guess we already did and failed...

If any period might be considered a "golden" era of development and modernization in Haiti, it must be the U.S. occupation from 1915 to 1934. While by no means a resounding triumph, colonial rule by the Americans did have its successes. And it provides a convenient frame of reference for what the rest of the world can expect as it tries to rebuild the benighted country.

In July, 1915, a mass execution of political opponents by Haitian president Vilbrun Guillaume Sam - and Sam's subsequent dismemberment in the streets of Port-au-Prince - prompted U.S. president Woodrow Wilson to send 2,000 marines to seize control of the country. Further motivation for Wilson's gun-boat diplomacy was concern that if he didn't step into the vacuum, Germany might.

Once in control, the U.S. found Haiti to be almost entirely lacking in modern infrastructure, much as it appears today after the earthquake. There was no telephone service, no intercity roads, no public health care, no public school system, no working harbours. Corruption was endemic and the administration entirely dysfunctional. These problems were fixed when the Americans left in 1934.

A report by the American High Commissioner to Haiti reported a substantial list of achievements during the first 14 years of occupation. Among the accomplishments, the Americans built 12 hospitals, 147 rural clinics, 210 bridges, 12 lighthouses, nine wharves, along with irrigation, sanitation, municipal water and technical education systems. In 1929 alone, clinics provided 1.3 million health-care treatments, a blessing for a country racked by syphilis, malaria, hookworm and yaws.

There were virtually no automobiles in Haiti when the marines arrived. By 1929, there were 3,000 cars, trucks and buses. A telephone system with 1,200 subscribers also appeared from the ether as the Americans single-handedly brought the country into the 20th century.

The occupation government also operated without accusations of corruption, in contrast to previous domestic administrations. Despite many critics watching closely, there was not a whiff of financial scandal. And neither did the U.S. appear to exploit its control for commercial gain. In 1923, the State Department refused a monopolistic concession to the Sinclair Oil Co. due to lack of sufficient benefits for Haiti.

If the world wishes to create a functional system of public works for Haiti, then the period of U.S. control provides a successful template.

And yet there is more to making Haiti work than providing it with the necessary modern conveniences. It also requires a democratic tradition and a competent bureaucracy. And the evidence suggests this will take a commitment much longer than 10 years.

....

Moreover, the country's infrastructure rapidly disintegrated due to incompetence and corruption. In 1958, U.S Marine Colonel Robert Heinl returned to Haiti and found most of what he had left behind gone. The telephone system no longer worked, roads were non-existent and the ports silted up and crumbling. Donkeys were once again the main mode of transportation. "Curiously, the only effective survivor of the occupation's infrastructure benefits is the modest network of grass air-strips unchanged since 1934," Heinl wrote. Today, these are being used for tent cities.

Over the next 10 years, Canada and other developed countries plan to spend billions building hospitals, roads, ports and airports for Haiti, just as the Americans did from 1915 to 1934. But if we don't make an equally massive commitment to leave behind a real democracy ??? and Haiti remains one of the world's most corrupt and dysfunctional countries ??? then it will all be for naught.

 

[GearsMcGilf]

Next thing you know, they're gonna start shipping those friggin Hati orphans over here and my kids are gonna be expected to learn Haitian in school. WTF's next?!

 

[DOMS]

Over the next 10 years, Canada and other developed countries plan to spend billions building hospitals, roads, ports and airports for Haiti, just as the Americans did from 1915 to 1934. But if we don't make an equally massive commitment to leave behind a real democracy ??? and Haiti remains one of the world's most corrupt and dysfunctional countries ??? then it will all be for naught.

Like I said, it's just throwing good money away and a complete waste.

 

[min0 lee]

Next thing you know, they're gonna start shipping those friggin Hati orphans over here and my kids are gonna be expected to learn Haitian in school. WTF's next?!

They actually speak French and they are to small an Island to make an impact on our "culture".

Funny, but the more I see Obama's inexperience slowly overwhelm him I believe we should send him to Haiti as a loaner for a year to see if he fix Haiti....I jest.

 

[AKIRA]

Exactly. A bunch of morons on my Facebook have been posting that as their statuses for days now. Worded horribly.

Fuck reading 4 pages. He copied an exact CHAIN update and tried to make the glory his. Thank you for noticing this and replying on the 1st page. I could care less what the rest of the thread says.

 

[min0 lee]

As food distribution improves, Haitians want U.S to 'take over'

"I want the Americans to take over the country. The Haitian government can't do anything for us," said Jean-Louis Geffrard, a laborer who lives under a tarp in the crowded square. "When we tell the government we're hungry, the government says, 'We're hungry, too.' "



Added Canga Matthieu, a medical student whose school was destroyed: "The American government should take care of us."


A throng of people in the square discussed their lack of faith in Haitian authorities. One after another, they said their only hope is the United States.
"The Haitian government has been here for a while, and they give us nothing. The United States should take over the country," said Andrelita Laguerre, shepherding four children and a grandchild at the camp. "Most of my friends expect the United States to take over. I wish!"

 

[GearsMcGilf]

They actually speak French and they are to small an Island to make an impact on our "culture".

No shit mate! A lil sarcasm in there.

But werd! I would like to send the messiah over there so he could fix all of their problems rather than ours. We're going to be about as prosperous as Haiti soon if he gets his agenda rammed thru.

 

[bio-chem]

As food distribution improves, Haitians want U.S to 'take over'

holy shit! we are fucked.

 

[maniclion]

great words...what you think bout '' if you speak english press one''? what bout american kids have to speak spanish? next will be haiti?

You just set off my Lunk Alarm with your goobity gabbity gaw....

 

[pitman]

You just set off my Lunk Alarm with your goobity gabbity gaw....

 

[maniclion]

As food distribution improves, Haitians want U.S to 'take over'

If they want us to serve them then they should have to serve us, in the Armed forces. Every Haitian National would serve at least 8 years, men and women that's the only way I see us being able to teach them life skills and make it worth our while....

 

[lnvanry]

Israel has been kicking the shit out of everyone who threatened them or their allies for thousands of years. Giving them handouts is good sense. It's like paying Chuck Norris to hang out with you.

No, you didn't say Israel has been fighting for 1000s of years....you said they have been "kicking the shit out of everyone" for 1000s of years. Not really semantics. Don't get all salty b/c you're reneging.

I'm not talking about losing battles either...I"m talking about being conquered and/or enslavement. Yes, I do like to debate and poke holes in weak arguments. Its part of my job.

 

[lnvanry]

As food distribution improves, Haitians want U.S to 'take over'

"When we tell the government we're hungry, the government says, 'We're hungry, too."
they're screwed...chalk them up to the failed state list with Somalia

 

[GearsMcGilf]

As food distribution improves, Haitians want U.S to 'take over'

That's what we need, 9,035,536 more poor people.

Or, rather about 8,925,536 now.

 

[pitman]

fuck this american bull shit..close the boarders .... keep money in america.....

 

[GearsMcGilf]

boarders ....

 

[pitman]

YEA THE BOARDERS !!!!!the haiti are coming and their broke like america..... i seen a african american sing the national athem...go figure america our great!!!!!!

 

[Budz08]

I completely agree with you. It definitely is a double-edged sword but there is no doubt military spending has led to advancements in technologies used daily by civilians like the ones you've mentioned.

Not sure what you're asking as far as the donation figures. The donations were referring to civilian-civilian spending. Are you asking if the DoD gets donations? I'm just confused because the only real data I put in there were DoD spending amount and the GDP of Haiti, everything else was commentary based off of general knowledge.

 

[e2ksj3]

We do have a lot of problems here, but it could be worse, a lot worse.

 

[weldingman]

Ye like the world comming to an end.

 

[Saney]

Shoot all the Mexicans = Solve Healthcare Problem

Shoot all the Niggers = Solve major Tax Problems

Give Not Bigs like me Test and Steroids = Me score with Kathy in the Arse-Hole

 

[weldingman]

lol

 

[HialeahChico305]

Ah, okay, I get you.

Then hell yes, we need to use American money to help American people. I'm all for this.

You just need to be careful on how you word it. Most of the rest of the world is pretty fucked up. From killing gays in the Middle East, to the raping of 3-12 year old girls in South Africa, to the killing of infant girls in India, to the harvesting of human bodies in China (by the government); most of the world is a nightmare. And most Americans have no idea.

America police country. I wonder why isn't it more peaceful?. hhmmmmm

 

[DOMS]

America police country. I wonder why isn't it more peaceful?. hhmmmmm

Are you trying to say that America is a police state?